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Killers get to keep instadown (noed) since forever but survivors lose their perk after a few months
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It was actually buffed several times.
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I win more when survivors use self-care. I just hop on a gen, if you’re running around looking for a teammate just because you’re injured then you may rely on your second health-state. A big problem as killer is higher ranked survivors not healing, if they don’t heal then you lose most of your pressure.
“Stop beiing delusional.” I don’t see how I was delusional, People are more likely to take you seriously if you discuss without insults.
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You say that but it isn't true, survivors do heal a lot with SC on high ranks since you can't go full game injured otherwise killer would have extremely quick chases thus far more pressure and save would be near impossible. Survivors on high ranks do use SC but they know when it's smarter to not heal and just do gens.
Go ahead and don't heal against likes of good nurses or spirits you'll have great results I'm sure, ofc you don't have to heal against loopable killers but at high ranks you see more nurses then them.
Either all survivors using SC are delusional for helping killer win his games or you are. I think it's you since SC is extremely powerfull and survivors benefit from it greatly. You can think whatever you want I don't care but I won't agree with you on SC beiing more beneficial to killer then survivors.
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Worth pointing out, the killer plays most of the match with only 3 perks, risking the 4th being entirely disabled by the end so it's not like they're getting free kills through it. They did invest a perk slot in a perk that may not matter at all. Plus you can cleanse it after the gates are powered too. You're not entitled to escape just by completing 5 gens.
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@Ihatelife last time it was changed was in patch 1.8.1
I consider this a long time.
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When you dont want, that Killers can use NOED; than just cleanse the totems...easy peasy :)
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Survivors can just sit and hide and get a really easy hatch.
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Noed has counter play and comes at a cost to the killer. Its balanced just plain and simple. It counter plays gen rushing to a degree and punish failing to do a survivors 2ed objective. It removes an active perk from the killer for the chance it will work late game. It allows 1 hit KOs but thats part of a lot of killers basic kit, the ones who use it normally don't have the option.
Basically what balances an ability or perk is the ability to counter play it. This is what balance really is, what isn't balanced is a perk or advantage that you can't use skill, time or experience to over come even over coming it has a cost. NOED has counter play in various ways be it perks, knowing which killers are likely to bring NOED, to simply taking longer in match to cleanse totems. Its balanced because the survivor has options to counter its advantage.
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Here to remind OP that NOED can be removed in 17.5 seconds from each survivor.
Also, in before "ToTeMs TaKe 14 sEcOndS to ClEAnSe."
(14 seconds x 5 totems) / 4 survivors = 17.5 seconds each.
If your team can't spare 17.5 seconds, then you deserve to get NOED. It has a counter. Use it. MoM had no counter except to down them after the first hit to make sure they never got hit three times, which isn't always possible.
Do. The. Totems.
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noed can be removed by survivors before it even procs. Talk about "losing a perk"
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Adrenaline is completely null vs NOED. It's ignorant to claim that it's equivalent to NOED.
If you are wounded and adrenaline pops, good you're healthy, if you get hit once your dying.
If you are healthy and NOED pops, if you get hit once, your dying...
Wait, I thought Adrenaline countered NOED?....
If you're hooked and adrenaline pops, then you are unhooked, you, oh wait, there's a second before you can move and if the killer hits you you go back to dying....
The only counselation is if you can find all 5 secondary objectives (totems) and destroy them before the 5th generator, it will not proc.
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So what you are saying is, in addition to have perks to counter noed, like Hope/Adrenaline etc, you can also break the totems to remove noed before it procs?
noed has numerous ways to counter it and its been nerfed like 3 times already,
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What about red hatchets and rancor?
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Lose it?
I didn't know Mettle of Man doesn't give you the extra health state anymore.
Sarcasm, of course.
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While you're right on most of that, there's actually a second that you CAN move that you're invulnerable, not a second that you can't move.
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A 6000bp addon that makes it so without infantry belt you can only carry one hatchet at a time. The other an obsession perk that only comes into play at the very end of the game against the obsession.
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Thats funny... I don't see your issue with NOED. Hill Billy... Leatherface... have a one shot the entire match every match, unless they take a limiter.
Yet.. you don't see those killers 100% of the time, just like you don't see NOED 100%.
You play against those killers, yet you can't play around NOED?
Weird.
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Ive noticed and said this for years: survivors think game is over when the gates are powered, and thats simply not the case. As someone who played Freddy for 100s of hours, and love his endgame builds - once gates are powered its third phase boss time kids.
They think they won the match if gates are powered,... nope...not over till you leave the gate
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@HURRI_KAIN could you point out where exactly i said, that Adrenaline counters NOED?
I said it is the survivor Equivalent of NOED.
Equivalent doens´t mean counter.
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Played both roles at Red ranks. Haven't had enough time to get back there this season yet, but getting close.
On the killer side, the only killer I'm capable of doing perfectly well with without any perks or add-ons is the Nurse. That is the only killer I would be able to get to Rank 1 with if I didn't use perks and add-ons. Every other killer needs their perks and/or add-ons at least somewhat.
On the survivor side, I could get to Rank 1 solely running No Mither + WGLF + Spine Chill + Empathy with no item. Granted the No mither would make it take longer, but it would not be impossible. If I ran no perks at all instead it wouldn't even be hard.
The majority of killers need their perks. Survivors really do not. You need 3 skills to do well as survivor. 1) Pallet Looping. 2) Working through Hex: Ruin. 3) Paying attention. All other perks, items, and offerings are just a bonus. So when something like Mettle of Man comes out, it really is meta-breaking and the survivors should certainly not be allowed to have it on top of Exhaustion Perk + Adrenaline + Decisive Strike.
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On the topic of NOED: It certainly doesn't deserve a change, but at this point I wouldn't mind them nerfing it just to make bad survivors finally shut up about it.
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jUsT cLeAnSe tHe tOtEms
Killers want you to cleanse the totems because the time you're spending running around the map like an idiot looking for the totems is time you could spend working on generators instead, at the end of the day it gives the killer more time to get some hooks/sacrifices, it's a win win situation for the Killer.
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NOED is the perk with the most counters by far, if you complain about it you are bad
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Spoken like someone who ignores totem right by generator.
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I get what you’re saying, I never use NOED anymore. Only didn’t when I first started, but all survivors have to do isn’t be stealthy and destroy totems. That’s already a huge counter. Survivors have so many advantages as is, with any killer, even a really good nurse player can struffle against a really good team of survivors. Lol
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You do know NOED has had a few nerfs, it used to activate at end game and be unlimited, then it was on a 2 min timer and now it's a totem.
Do you know why it was changed to a totem? To give survivors another objective and to help slow the game down or risk it activating.
MoM was a broken perk as there was not counter play with most killers, while I dont think they way they changed it was the right option as it makes it not worth using it did need something done.
Instead of making a post complaining why not give some feedback on how you think it would be better changed.
My idea was to make it like more like the DS vision as an anti tunnel perk with a timer so that it has conditions after an unhook and you could only use either DS or MoM in a match as it deactivated the other.
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Same
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Cleansing a dull totem now gives 20 points. This takes 14 seconds without bonuses giving 1.42 emblem points per second.
Doing a generator completely solo gives 100 emblem points upon generator completion. This takes 80 seconds without bonuses giving 1.25 emblem points per second.
Cleansing dull totems now officially gives you more lightbringer progress than working on generators for the amount of points gained versus amount of time spent. Often, you will even find dull totems in your course of normal play without having to go out of your way looking for them. There is now very little excuse to not cleanse every dull totem you come across if the killer is not on your butt at the time.
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They give more BP per second than gennies too.
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LMAO
Exactly as survivors want to be chased around the map looping each one of the 20 pallets 3 times before dropped. All that time chasing one guy is time not spent hooking the rest of the survivors.
Was this a joke or what??
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The nature of the game means that overpowered survivor perks have a much bigger impact than killer ones. (Not that noed is that overpowered, it can be cleansed and relies on the killer basically losing the game by letting all gens go before it even works.)
When you can stack a perk 3 or 4 times ot becomes much much worse, old ds and mom went too bad, even old brand new part, but taking 3 or 4 of them quickly becomes oppressive.
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What does this have to do with the subject?
Also if you find that many pallets you probably ain't update your game since 2017
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It has all to do with your post.
You're being Captain Obvious in yours, so I'm being Sherlock in mine.
There, spelled it out.
And count the pallets in the temple of purgation, then come back.
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Aright chief
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People complain that survivors need a secondary objective.
Killer's provide secondary objective by bringing NOED
People still complain.
Today's entitled gamer logic...
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Even equivalent, NOED = 2 health states. Adrenaline = one health state, only if not uninjured. Not equivalent.
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They both throw one health state out the window in effect. The killer would have had to hit you once more but with Adrenaline they have to hit you twice and catch up with you after you take off like you've got a firecracker up your ass. With NOED they would have had to hit you twice but now it's only once and they also have a small speed boost. Adrenaline is not rewarding you for making it to the gens being powered anymore than NOED rewards the killer for guarding their totems until the gens are powered. Sure you might be uninjured at the end of the game but the killer might have also killed everybody by the end of the game or have had all of their totems cleansed. You get your speed boost regardless. The perks are pretty similar considering the difference in both roles. Adrenaline wouldn't be as common as it is if it weren't powerful.
SWF-s have another tool in their kit on top of its regular use as well. I can't count how many times I got someone down with one gen left and then here comes their buddy with a flashlight. You know Adrenaline is about to pop but you're forced to try to go down the other person because you're most likely going to lose your hook regardless.
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@Tsulan Noed and Adrenaline aren't really equivalent. Adrenaline triggers after survivors completed their objective. Noed triggers after the killer has failed to stop the survivors. I'm not advocating for noed to go, just saying the one rewards success the other failure.
To the OP, survivors still have plenty of things to work with.
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If you have a problem with Noed, why don't you remove the totem yourself? If there is no dull totem on the map, Noed won't trigger. I am on killer side for this one, Noed have a hard counter that require no perk whatsoever. Since it is not a Hex perk at start of the game, cleanse will also not reveal you.
A perk this bad only good when the survivor pretend like it doesn't exist in the game.
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@thrawn3054 the survivors objective is to escape. Some people think that once the gates are powered, they deserve to escape. But the match isn't over until you see the point screen.
According to the emblems, the killer has to keep the game going for as long as possible. If he kills everyone quickly, he won't pip.
Here lies a problem. The devs want to force certain playstyles on us. Which then creates wrong expectations.
A killer who sacrificed his perk slots for Blood Warden, NOED and Remember Me. Shouldn't be considered a killer who failed his objective. He prepared for the endgame.
Which is honestly the best way for both sides:
All players earned their points. Everyone will probably pip, no one will leave with 2k points and complain that he got tunneled.
But somehow, I get the impression, that people want killers to tunnel and kill survivors fast with no one earning more than 2k points.
Just because everything else is considered a failure. Please make up your mind on what you want. A match where everyone "wins" point and emblem wise, or a match where the killer ruins the survivors fun by killing them as fast as possible. Imagine Iridescent hatchets + mori. Terribly efficient, but ruins the match for everyone else.
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Whiners like you are the reason some killers use noed because you refuse to cleanse the damn totems. I swear people that main the survivor role is like spoiled brats anything that makes you put in even the slightest effort you whine and moan about it just do the totems so you won't be put into the situation. Stop relying on the devs to hold your hand every time something hinders the survivors role simplistic playstyle.
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Adrenaline is a very powerful survivor perk.
NOED counters Adrenaline. Adrenaline does not counter NOED. NOED counters Adrenaline.
NOED allows killers to still be dangerous even after the gates are powered. An uninjured survivor sprinting towards an open exit gate feels no fear. An uninjured survivor sprinting towards an open exit gate with NOED active... that's a different story. It makes the killer a threat again. Does it suck to go down to NOED? Absolutely. But should an uninjured survivor running towards an open exit gate have a guaranteed escape every single time? Should the killer always have to feel helpless once a gate is open?
NOED counters an open exit gate.
Cleansing the NOED hex totem deactivates it. Cleansing all dull totems before the exit gates are powered stops NOED from activating in the first place. Survivors can counter NOED without needing another perk to do so. Small Game helps, but it's not necessary.
It can no longer even be said "Killers preventing survivors from doing gens counters Adrenaline." It doesn't. Adrenaline can also kick in when the killer closes the hatch. That means slugging for the 4k is now the preemptive counter to Adrenaline.
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Cleansing totems isn't even that big of a deal. Run a perk or bring a map to help you find totems. Or play SWF and communicate.
If efficiently done, cleansing totems doesn't consume enough time to qualify as a 2nd objective for survivors. As long as you play well, you really have more than enough time to cleanse all the totems.
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If NOED is to be removed or reworked then so should adrenaline
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in solo queue you rarely have time to cleanse totems, especially on maps with incredibly weird totem spawns like swamp
noed isn't an OP perk in my opinion because all it does is get the killer one or two consolation prizes at the end (sure sometimes it'll get them a 4k from a 0k but if you made it to the point where noed is activated you've basically won anyway, escaping is just 5k points), but i will consider it an unhealthy perk for the game, just like MoM and old DS were
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There are 2 counters to Noed SO OBVIOUS that they never get mentioned in these kinds of discussions:
- Don't get found
- Don't get hit
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NOED does the exact opposite, rewarding failure.
No, it punishes survivor failure
If the killer has NOED, you are playing against a killer with 3 perks until the generators are powered. Either you are all dying and have no time to do totems, in which case you absolutely deserve to lose because you are getting destroyed by a 3 perk killer, or you have enough time to do totems, in which case you also deserve to lose because you didn't destroy them all
You can also not do totems and play stealthy when the generators are powered and only attempt to open the gate when you know the killer isn't there to not die.
If you die to NOED, it is always your own fault because you played badly
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Mate, NOED has too many counters to count. Mettle of man had no universal counter for all killers.
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NOED is a failure on the survivors part to prevent it. You should always account for it regardless (FFS dude, it's free points and it counts toward Lightbringer).
If you fail at that, you deserve to get destroyed at the end of the game.
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