The Legion desperately needs a Band-Aid fix
As a long time Legion player, I was happy to see Frank's Mix Tape neutered and the moonwalk exploit removed. It was also quite fair to deplete The Legion's power meter when missing an attack. These changes added counter-play for survivors and removed the most annoying aspects of Feral Frenzy. But many nerfs beyond this felt overboard and unnecessary.
I realize actual mechanic changes take a lot of time and effort, so I will propose a few simple number changes to Legion's base kit to make them more viable and not so punishing to play.
- Reduce Frenzy fatigue duration from 4 to 3.5 seconds
Currently, even when stacking the reduced fatigue add-ons, survivors will always be able to reach a safe zone before the fatigue has ended. This is also the most punishing and unfun aspect of Legion's power for the player.
- Reduce Frenzy cooldown duration from 20 to 16 seconds.
Since Frenzy is no longer a lethal ability and it cannot be used until the power meter is full, the cooldown must be reduced. This change is aimed at letting Legion use Frenzy as a map pressure tool, instead of feeling forced to save it for the next chase.
- Remove Frank's Mix Tape and reduce Deep Wound timer from 30 to 20 seconds.
Frank's Mix Tape is completely unusable in it's current state, but it's too frustrating for survivors when powerful. I'd like to see it removed so Deep Wound can actually feel like a threat. There are a multitude of ways to pause the Deep Wound timer now, therefore, the timer should be reduced to encourage mending. It's just too easy to ignore and does not feel threatening whatsoever.
- Buff base Frenzy speed OR re-add speed add-ons for Frenzy
Not only was Frenzy's base speed nerfed quite a bit, but the speed add-ons were removed as well. Frenzy feels too sluggish now. If Hillbilly can zoom across the map at Mach 5 with barely any cooldown, Legion should be able to run faster.
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Please discuss and tell me what you think about these changes!
#FixLegion
Comments
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I think legion is fun to play against but not fun to play. For an ability that doesn't help get survivors downed it's crazy how weak their power is compared to almost any other killer. I think they just need a new power altogether but that's just my opinion.
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@Bludge23 Perhaps Feral Frenzy could use a legitimate redesign. But I made this post because the devs already have a roadmap for the near future, and The Legion is nowhere near a priority for them. It could take potentially a year or more before Feral Frenzy receives any sort of overhaul (see how long the Freddy rework took).
The changes I've suggested are strictly number changes and would not require a large amount of time or resources and would make Legion a bit more enjoyable to play in the short-term.
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If you remove Frank's Mix Tape you gotta replace it with something.
I suggest making it reduce the penalty for a missed hit in FF - not so much because that's too punishing to play, but just because one of the few fun things about playing Legion was just stabbing wildly at the air in a threatening way during a chase. Like an "I'm gonna getchu!"
It doesn't have to go away completely, but maybe just so it takes a chunk off your power gauge instead of completely depleting it.
Though I do agree that a total rework's necessary before Legion's fun to play as or against, it's not likely to happen so might as well work on small fixes. Though honestly, I'm not sure about these, just because one of the more boring things about the power, survivor side, is being forced to mend while Legion runs off and this looks like it'd make it more common. I'm not sure how you'd fix that issue as any tweaks to make Legion more viable probably would all have similar outcomes.
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Legion:
So insanely boring to verse.
Not really fun to play.
Would be happy to remove from the game.
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Legion just needs their feeling of momentum back, the power is currently extremly sluggish and just feels terribly underwhelming to use. The power itself at the moment feels almost like a bad joke, like "Oh the Legion's power is to gain 2 stacks of Play With Your Food and the ability to slow vault pallets and medium vault windows, their attacks also apply borrowed time and show you all the people you probably wont be able to hit in the 10 seconds you spend in your power, and leaving it stuns you for 4 seconds and makes your screen almost entirely black... you also cant see scratchmarks, or blood". This sounds terrible... because it is.
Many people have suggested a lot of ideas that would make Legion probably pretty decent and if the devs decide to go for another take at overhauling the character I hope they atleast take inspiration from some of them, that being said: For a quickfix I agree with most things you mentioned here.
Personally I think they should buff the speed and bring the speed add-ons back, simply because the base speed is terrible and the killer instinct add-ons are quite frankly useless. The vault speed nerfs should also be reverted, vaulting currently is almost pointless as a survivor can gain enough distance on you to a point where they can actually loop certain pallets and windows even. Why they nerfed the CD add-ons and also increased the base CD of FF is still beyond me, I'd say just rework the CD add-ons into something else and just put the base CD at no more than 3 seconds, but for a quicker fix your idea is fine I suppose.
Regarding Frank's, it like so many other of Legion's add-ons needs a full on rework, just like Deep Wounds, I dont think they'd be able to fix them with just some number changes.
Finally, regarding the whole "Legion is unfun to play against" thing. Personally I think most if not all slowdown based killers are annoying to deal with and this alone should not be a reason for Legion to be removed or reworked entirely, but that's just my opinion.
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Still boring to verse...? Reminder these changes were made so they are more fair and/or fun.
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Fair yes, fun no. Legion is tolerable now, but as long as the power involves forcing people to keep mending, he will never be fun.
Plus the character sucks in general. A bunch of edgy teenagers is hardly intimidating.
The first words spoken in every Legion game:
Me: "It's Legion"
Everyone else collectively: "Ugh, ffs..."
I hope they nerf him even more so nobody ever plays him again.
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The miss penalty is hardly "fair", at least in its current state where the power has so many limitations.
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The 1st part i kinda don't understand. We have Doctor. He also has the "keep forcing people to hold M1". The only diffrence is Snapping out has skillchecks (which i would add to Mending tbh)
... Isn't Ghost Face also basically an edgy teen? Or atleast looks like one?
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Ah yes, Doctor - the second most annoying killer after Legion. It's saying something when a killer that gives me a migraine every time I play against him is still more fun than facing a Legion.
For Ghost Face, I think they invented their own Clark Kent-meets-Dexter knock-off backstory. Not really sure since I kinda skimmed over the lore but he seems somewhat removed from Billy Loomis et al from what I can tell.
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I love when people use "not fun to play and play against" as an argument. Its just useless saying this. Fun is a subjective thing. For me is fun to play Legion and unfun to play Billy, someone want to say that i am wrong?
So please, if someone want to talk about anything, don't say such things as "he is not fun" or "his power his bad", because its meaningless. Explain why and then we can have an useful and acceptable discussion.
I find The Legion a good killer. They need some little tweaks, but not a complete rework or a massive buff. Their power is strong when used as intendeed, so for slowing the game down and not for chasing
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Noone says "oh its a legion, I love versing legions".
Noone.
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please bhvr, remove the penalty on Legion’s power for hitting a survivor with a basic attack.
there is no reason for it to be there.
my biggest pet peeve with legion is losing my power for attack survivors. It doesn’t make sense.
if I hit a survivor with my m1, and then go into frenzy, I can’t down them anyway. It literally just stops me from gaining momentum through slugging, and if that is the reason it is there I don’t get why that penalty exists.
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Yeah Legion's actual powerset is fairly weak. Mechanically speaking, a Billy or Nurse is much more deadly, but I have fun playing against them, even if they're really skilled. But Legion's real power comes from the fact that I literally do not want to win when I play against him, I just want to get out of the game as quickly as possible without screwing over my teammates by suiciding and into a game with a killer that's actually interesting. I have literally, once two survivors are dead, chased Legion down and done something like a generator in front of him just so he could grab and hook me and the last survivor could have a shot at the hatch. I would literally do the same if the gates were open and I was on my last hook and dying got me out of the game faster than running for a gate. That black hole sucking all the enthusiasm out of the game and making it an exercise in just going through the motions, now that is OP.
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"That black hole sucking all the enthusiasm out of the game and making it an exercise in just going through the motions"
You summed up my feelings perfectly mate hahaha :D
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