Keep saying this over and over... but it has to be done asap.
Rank 20-17 or anything like that should be for BEGINNERS. I introduced this game to multible friends and they are all leaving because they simply have no interest in playing against people with 1000+ hours on their rank! Getting crushed by Survivor or Killers that are clearly more experienced is no fun for new players, and i dont see how this is still a thing in DbD. Another friend just uninstalled it only because of that reason.
Please devs, if you wanna hold new players, dont let them get crushed by players that are way better then them. Better today then tomorrow.
Thank you for reading
Comments
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Agreed. I'm really worried that not a lot of new players who came with the Stranger Things DLC are going to stick with the game.
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Exactly. The Devs have such a great opportunity with that DLC, but i doubt many will stay, after a few games getting destroyed.
Just right now i had a game as survivor, rank 10. Killer was rank 20, probably just bought the game.. did not even get a single hit... gave him the kill, but i doubt this will make him feel any better.
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Your friend who uninstalled is just a poor casual. He is absolutly new to the game and is already expecting to win? #########. Some other games dont even have a ranked matchmaking and it's completely mixed. Does he uninstall aswell? It's normal to lose at the beginning. I'm not playing Apex for the first hours and cry about losing all the time. My first 10 hours in apex were absolutly catastrophic, I got demolished by everyone and everything. But I "git gud" and learned the game. And now I can win (be champion) at least once a day.
Maybe he should quit playing online games. Those "smurf" at rank 17-20 are very rare, probably not even 1% of them have 1k+ hours. Crying about this little amount is just silly.
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Matchmaking is broken, red ranks can get a killer rank 20.
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Omg. No he is not expecting that, but whats the point in playing against Top tier Killers / Survivors when you are New to the game? This game has a ranked system, and a working ranked system is one of the reason why he wanted to play the game. He and many other people are not touching games without a ranking system. Ever thought about that?
Maybe he is a casual, and guess what...? This game is FULL of casuals as your Apex, and it grows only because of the casuals.
People like him are way more important then you and i, because we are maybe 10%, and they are 90%.
EDIT: Also your whole argument is completly bs, or do you really think rank 20-17 should NOT be for new players?
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@NoShinyPony Hell, if I remember, you saw one of my posts from last weekend where I discussed my 32-year-old baby sister, whom I gifted a copy of DbD. She first played the week that ended with rank reset. Tuesday through Thursday, she enjoyed it. Then Friday hit and rank reset happened and she got bullied to hell and back Friday night and Saturday afternoon.
She was intending to buy Stranger Things. Instead, she uninstalled and won't ever look at DbD again.
And that was just from the crap with the rank reset.
With the matchmaker issue now? No, I don't see many new players sticking around. This is going to end-up just like every other free weekend and 50% sale. Numbers will drop a lot after the weekend as they fail to keep enough new players who tried it and didn't buy, and roughly two weeks after the sale ends, DbD will be back to its daily peak of 20k-25k players or so.
As usual, DbD will remain flat for retained player activity growth.
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Course not cant handle this game but bought stranger things dlc alright we got your 12$ we dont care if you stay we got your money
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Bra I've been playing for a while(as a killer) and after rank resets went back to 14 or 15 and this whole match making fiasco consistently had me matched up with red, purple and green try hards. It makes me not even want to play.
I bought the demo and didn't have an abundance of blood points to pump him up and the only 4 games I played were miserable, haven't tried since.
I even tried the "op spirit" build and still getting matched with players way better then myself, I was walked on.
Yes some one new who wants to play killer should expected to get a couple sacrifices in a few games. It's not like other online symmetrical games where even if you aren't the best, usually your team is fairly balanced against the other in terms of skill and you can coast along and figure it out.
A new killer matched against veteran survivors is not going to enjoy the game nearly enough to stick out what seems to be a mountain of a learning curve. They'll just go play a game that they do enjoy.
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Agree, new players need to play against people with their same level of experience, or they are gonna get crushed all the time and just quit. Is not fun to play a game where you know you just gonna have a terrible time.
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I'm tired of getting reset to the brown ranks myself when I stop playing for long periods of time. If you make it to the yellow ranks, you should never drop into the brown ranks... PERIOD
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@justarandy You're using Apex as an example? Apex Legends is a Battle Royale where, outside of their ranked mode, does not use an MMR or any sort of matchmaking for their other modes. It's how I, as a new player of only three days old a couple months after launch, played in three different matches against Shroud. Or where as a new Realm Royale player I was regularly in matches against Thor, Krippler, Aero, IdiotMouse, or Gentle_Giant.
Fortnite, Realm Royale, and other battle royales do not use matchmaking. I think PUBG might be one of the few that does. Never played it, but I remember reading something about that.
If you play a battle royale, you go in expecting zero matchmaking algorithm. I don't play them (though I'd tried them for several months) for precisely that reason.
Nor is DbD using an MMR system like, say, Overwatch Quick Play, where it takes several matches, which will be throwing you to the wolves, for the MMR to gauge where you belong and adjust your matchmaking from there for better matches.
Dead by Daylight uses their "ranks" for their matchmaking algorithm. A system which is not only bugged to hell right now, but is easily abused and manipulated to derank without penalty, or just take an extended break from the game and be deranked by Behavior on a monthly basis, thereby rendering a large purpose behind the rank-as-matchmaker as absolutely useless.
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I totally agree with this. If I was a new killer, I would be disappointed if I kept getting matched with rank 2 survivors but tell your friends whats happening so they dont rage quit ir just quit because of this bug.@xEa
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DbD has had a bad player retention rate for a very long time, that's really nothing new.
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Whenever I started, rank reset put everyone back at rank 20. I started during a rank reset and of course I didn’t win very much at all but I stayed, because I knew that I’d have to get crushed to get better.
Matchmaking bug needs fixed of course, but people who are willing to improve will stay.
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It is always frustration vs dedication. Not many are dedicated enough for getting stomped so often (and especially so brutal), that they stay. At least not how it is right now. DBD needs new players, this matchmaking does not promote that by any means.
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The bug needs fixed but I don’t think a lot will leave, it is kinda expected to get stomped when starting to play an online game, at least for me.
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@GrootDude Here's the issue, and I am going to only use my own anecdotal experience based on my wide circle of real life friends and family gamers.
Most players don't want to get good in that sense. They want to jump in and have fun. Fun doesn't necessarily equate to winning, but it does equate to not being bullied or steamrolled by Vets you should not be going against in the first place.
They don't visit forums or reddits, and don't watch YouTube video guides for a game.
The other thing to consider about Dead by Daylight is why it draws in a lot of people. In a lot of instances, it's the licensed DLCs such as Myers, Leatherface, Pig, Ghostface, or Freddy, which are famous horror film icons, or one of the hottest shows on Netflix right now: Stranger Things. It isn't Legion, or Nurse, or Spirit, or Plague, or those guys.
And those people want to, again, jump in and have fun. And, again, getting steamrolled by deranked or rank reset Vets is not going to be fun.
And as the SteamCharts have shown repeatedly free weekend after free weekend, and MSRP sale after MSRP sale, the new players aren't being retained. Which means they aren't having fun within their first experiences with the game.
Gamers who find a game to not be fun through their initial experiences, in a majority of cases, will not stick around long enough to get good or improve. A vast majority of the gaming consumer base are very casual gamers.
And they will simply move on and spend their future money elsewhere.
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I like your optimism, and i hope you are right, but i doubt. If it stays that way, pretty much everyone will be gone besides some tryhards or some masochits.
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De-ranking and the matchmaking bug are problems, I personally always found ways to have fun, despite getting stomped.
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@GrootDude Those two things are, indeed, the core of the problem. And yet for three years, Behavior has done very little to actually solve the issue. It requires an entire overall of the rank system, the deranking potential, and how season resets function. And Behavior, in all this time, hasn't acknowledge the issue nor done anything about it.
And therein lies the longer term problem. What is Behavior going to do when the Vets get bored enough and start moving on? It will happen at some point. They're launching on the Switch this coming week, which is fine for a surge of more money. But what next? After mobile, they're pretty much out of new platforms to milk for initial MSRP sales.
And yes, you find ways to have fun. You've also gotten Leatherface, of all killers, to be successful within Red Ranks. You are not the average, nor majority, gamer. A majority of gamers will never see Red Ranks in DbD, never mind be able to do it successfully with Leatherface.
They just want to jump in and play Slasher horror hide-and-seek, preferably with teammates, and against opponents, of comparable skill level.
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The matchmaking bug comes back every now and then, it has been fixed a lot but it keeps coming back.
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would be whise to anounce it to new players, that this is not the normal status of the game, so there is at least a chance they take this game serious.
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What's the point?
The matchmaking as been broken since day one and rank 20 can just end up being matched with red ranks anyway and whenever they manage to fix it it get broken the next patch all other again.
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Toss me in the list of new players discouraged by this bug. I've been playing regularly for about a month and a half, I'm totally okay with losing matches, but when red ranks with epic loadouts started regularly appearing in my matches, I stopped having fun.
I'm already kinda put off by the whole teachable perk system, tbh, but my time actually playing had been fun enough to justify it. Now... not every game is miserable, because sometimes it doesn't happen, but it's a roulette. If I get people around my rank, I have fun. If I get people 10 or more ranks away from me... not fun.
Of course, I'm not a total noob either, I'm a green ranks kind of guy, so when I end up being forced into a match with totally fresh survivors, none of whom are under 17, that's not fun either. I either slaughter them and feel like a prick or I go easy and drag the game out for no reason but to try to compensate for BHVR's mistake.
Either way, I have a new level of uncertainty loading into every game. Will they be way higher than me? Maybe. Lower? Maybe? Just right? Also maybe. My first minutes of every match are now spent watching each survivor like a hawk so I know the appropriate level of force to use.
I don't understand why they release the new chapter before fixing the bug. If it were my game, I'd have pushed it back until it was fixed.
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@Xboned I agree with everything you've said. As it stands, I stopped even trying to login and play right now. I downloaded the six free Batman games that Epic is currently giving away, and did what I thought I would never do for the rest of 2019: logged into Overwatch. Already played enough to get the 9 wins on both my account and my 9-year-old's account to unlock the Bastion Lego skin for both of us.
That was about 24-26 matches for those 18 total wins. Matches that I could have been playing in DbD instead, except, well . . . Behavior.
You are logging into the game with a sense of uncertainty, you say. Unfortunately, I have a real sense of uncertainty toward Behavior as a whole. It's why I've decided to not buy Stranger Things at this time and will not be spending on cosmetics. As it stands, I don't have faith in them enough to spend my money on them.
I almost purchased Deathgarden: Bloodharvest a couple weeks ago. Looking at them on Steamcharts, I'm glad I refrained from doing so.
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Red rank survivor who keeps getting matched with rank 20s. It's not fun for anyone unless I guess you like bullying.
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Dead by Daylight takes a long time to get good at, but if you put in the hours it will always surprise you. I keep getting surprised even after 1600 hours. Each match has the potential to be nuts if all the players do their best.
Ranks 20-15 cannot be re-entered during the season once you reach 14. This change made it a little better. There are very experienced players in these ranks sometimes if they are coming back after a long break from the game. These players will be returning during the double blood points next week.
It is a brutal learning curve but there are many Twitch streamers showing how they kill and survive every day. That really helped me when I first started. At the end of the day it is a party game and is best enjoyed with a light heart and no expectations of victory.
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@Kilmeran Yes, I remember your post where you talked about your sister. It's a very good example for the current situation/problem.
I'm sorry that I can't be optimistic in this case, but I also think that the number of players will stay at 20-25k. It would be such a shame if this great license doesn't increase the number of players permanently. Hopefully I'll get proven wrong.
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It's crazy how this still hasn't been fixed.
And it's a very simple fix. Just don't match Devotion 0 players with Devotion 1+ players. Easy! They can still SWF if they want but don't match 0's with people who have Devotion 1 or higher.
It's too large a gap in experience.
I been fighting a few beginner killers over the week. The worst one was so lost I could literally juke him at will. I let him tag me a few times and hook me twice before I escaped just so he wouldn't feel so bad. Was lucky my teammates unhooked me actually.
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@NoShinyPony I know. Trust me, I know.
I returned a couple weeks ago after burning out on Overwatch and not liking RoleQ being forced into the game. I was completely prepared to leave Overwatch behind and just play DbD. Hell, I'd even uninstalled Overwatch.
Well, this weekend, I actually had decent time to play some video games for a change, which is like finding a unicorn. But guess what? Behavior didn't fix the damned matchmaker bug before they left for the weekend, so playing DbD was out of the question. So, I said "to hell with it" and reinstalled Overwatch for my PvP fix.
I played enough matches to get the 9 wins to unlock the Bastion skin on my son's account, the 9 wins to unlock it on my account, and just completed my 9 wins for Arcade mode for the three extra lootboxes. That's 27 wins in two days, which averaged me about 35 or so matches.
Those were matches I could have played in DbD if Behavior had just fixed the damned matchmaker. Even if it meant some extra hours for the Devs, you have a free weekend and a major sale going on for a PvP game: You fix the damned matchmaker as a number-one priority! Period.
But they didn't. So playing those matches in Overwatch showed me that . . . you know what? . . . I actually don't mind RoleQ. And there's Quick Play Classic in the Arcade for my non-RoleQ play.
So, allow me to thank Behavior for inspiring me to reinstall Overwatch and learn that information, all for leaving the matchmaker broken all weekend.
Matchmaker was broken a couple weeks ago. Peanits said they made some adjustments to fix it. A major DLC launches, and they break it again and leave it broken over a free weekend?
I guess they don't care to grow the game. Or maybe they think enough will just mindlessly stick around because of a Stranger Things DLC. Or maybe they're just banking on the Switch version money this coming week.
So, riddle me this? Why should I continue giving my time, never mind any money, to Behavior?
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Forget the last chapter. Sadly it's been three years since this issue has been happening.
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Devotion is not the best metric to use for this either. What if you've only played survivor up to this point and you're Devotion 1+ but then you decide to try killer?
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@Kilmeran I wanted to play SWF about 12 hours ago. Waiting 20 minutes to get a match. We managed to play 2 matches in 60 minutes and gave up after that.
The rank disparity aside: Everytime when there is a significanty increased amount of players, you can't play on console because queue times for both roles become insane. Happens everytime when a new DLC drops or there is a free-to-play weekend or an event, reliable as a clockwork.
Obviously the reason must be that BHVR's servers can't handle the increased amount of inquiries. Beats me why they don't solve this problem.
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New players on survivors will always be crushed by killers. The reason is simple. The learning curve for survivors is higher than the learning curve for killers. For example, when I first started playing the game the first killer I attempted to play as was Hillbilly. I wish I kept the video as something to laugh at now. I did everything wrong.
I didn't use the chainsaw as a way to get around the map and couldn't land a chainsaw attack to save my life. So I just started hitting survivors with the hammer. I didn't know jack about the game. I didn't understand how I could club a player with my hammer and put them on a meat hook and see them running around and healthy again a few seconds later. I was a Hillbilly that didn't even use his chainsaw and I was still getting 3ish kills a game.
I agree with you on a fundamental level that newbs shouldn't be going against experienced players. I don't think rank resets should ever drop players below rank 15. But even if they made those changes a lot of players will find surviving difficult at first. The game really isn't for everyone.
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@NoShinyPony Well, damn, it's going to be a double-whammy on console, then. Free weekend ends sometime tomorrow, but the sale continues until Wednesday, and then Thursday starts the Bloodhunt.
So . . . what other games do you have in your library that you and your friends can play? I'd seriously consider those for the next week or so.
I'm on PC. I prefer Killer simply because I've tried, but I find survivor boring. I also play Solo, which makes survivor doubly boring. None of my friends or family will touch the game because of the deranking to manipulate the matchmaker on top of the idiotic grind + bloodweb RNG combination. Well, outside of the sister who tried it, but that experience has already been discussed.
Anyway, come the Bloodhunt, I can probably forget about playing my killers, just like every other bloodhunt, unless I want to play PC Gaming Lobby Simulator.
Kind of makes me thankful that Behavior not fixing the matchmaker before leaving for the weekend turned me back onto Overwatch. At least I'll have that to play.
Unfortunately, that also means their lack of action this weekend and me having to go play elsewhere has likely made it so that I'll end up playing DbD less than expected moving forward, and therefore spending a hell of a lot less money on the game. Because their next big patch, the mid-chapter patch, launches the Rift and Archives into the game. And I have absolutely zero confidence the game won't be completely screwed once again the moment they send that live.
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@Kilmeran I'll reply on your wall to not derail the thread.
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He was specifically talking about people having 1k hours and being in brown ranks
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I'm just saying that this is 1% cuz these ranks are locked and you can only get there by not playing for months. Uninstalling because of 1% smurfs is overreacting.
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Yeah, exactly that was the point I was trying to make. This game doesn't even have a ranked based matchmaking, what would his friend do when he gets demolished 10 hours straight by more experienced players? Uninstalling aswell? Apex is just one game if many who hasn't a ranked matchmaking. That's why I said maybe he should stop playing pvp online games all together.
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We are talking more about 99% then 1%. No, i am not exaggerating. Our example played 3 days, no Killer or Survivor he could check had less then 300 hours, some had over 2000. I am his wittness, was watching him quiet a while.
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It's not about smurfs, it's the matchmaking, but k then.
Learning a game shouldn't be super frustrating in my opinion.
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It is getting ridiculous now, and baby killers or those in the game are more likely to dc and well in a way who can blame them going against such ranks.
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Do away with the current 1-20 rank and make it 1-10 also match lock 11-20 for solo Ppl who have never progressed to 10. There are some really skillful killers out there teaching these survivors how to be optimal and there are killers out there that don't try hard. It would be nice to play with like minded individuals.
As for playing in a swf group and you just started playing the game, if there's a rank 1-10 player in the group enjoy playing in the rank 1-10 lobbies.
Post edited by whammigobambam on1 -
Separating new from experienced players in an Online PVP is extremely important.
I wish matchmaking took hours into consideration even just a little, Maybe achievments or Kill/survival rate and not just rank because honestly the ranking system is pretty bad and there's usually big differences in skill level. There's probably not enough players for that though.
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I would rather go with some default games you have to play before you even rank. 20-30 games should be a good number.
After that, Rank 20-16 is exclusive for new players. No possible way to derank, after you have reached 15+
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@justarandy But you're wrong. DbD is supposed to have ranked as matchmaking. The Dev Team vehemently claims that the rank system is in place because it is their matchmaking algorithm.
The fact that it fails to function even remotely as they claim is because of the asinine monthly resets and the deranking without punishment, which is precisely why new players find it not fun in the slightest, and move on.
I will put money down that it is the primary culprit on why, after every free weekend and every MSRP sale, their steamcharts numbers plummet back down to the same old flat 20k-25k peak players again.
So, yes, DbD is supposed to have a matchmaking algorithm via rank. But Behavior has no clue what they are doing with it, and I'm saying this as someone with over a decade in actual commercial game design.
New Players are not going to chew glass in a game that is supposed to have matchmaking, per the Devs own words, because the Dev team is utterly incapable of actually creating a functioning matchmaker. If the new players wanted that headache, they'd probably just be playing Fortnite, Apex, Realm Royale, or the battle royale of your choice. They're trying to play DbD, where even Streamers talk about Rank being the matchmaker.
So, they come in expecting a matchmaker as there is supposed to be, but instead find one riddled with enough design holes to fly a Death Star through.
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I think preventing people from deranking below rank 15 won't fix anything. Even before the Stranger Things patch was released, I as a rank 20 killer was barely ever matched with any survivor below rank 15. I guess it would be a choice between getting nobody in your lobby or playing against survivors that are higher rank than you.
All things considered, I must say I'm pleasantly surprised though. In the last couple days I haven't had matches with toxic survivors. Either the toxic players are taking a break until the matchmaking is fixed or the people do consider they might be playing against a beginner. Or I've just been extremely lucky. It's funny how the bug with the matchmaking has made the atmosphere more bearable for a beginner killer than before. I'm not usually an optimist but I think the community effort is paying off.
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It is not fixing the problem, but it is at least a start. As said, there should be a way that new players can verse other new players exclusivly. That you can not up or de-rank from 20-16ish if you have less then 50 games / 50 hours played.
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Stuff is being done to fix it. Should be out in the next hotfix.
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I actually believe it has nothing to do with experienced players in low ranks, I'm saying this cause EVERY time I get to play against a lowrank killer we get tunneled or camped, therefore, experienced killers are better for the begginer survivors first experience, but on the other side, yes, low rank killers should ALWAYS play against people of their rank colour cause we purple or red ranks live of looping and breaking killer's ankles.
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