To All Who Think Spirit is OK in her Current State:
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Fun is subjective.
Do killers find it fun that they have to deal with jungle gyms, god loops, and Farm maps in general?
Do survivors find it fun that their team falls like flies while they carry the team?
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just because playing against a certain killer isn’t fun doesn’t mean it’s not balanced
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The only changes she needs is making prayer beads an ultra rare and removing collision while phasing.. otherwise she can be outplayed... instead of nerfs they should buff numbers on all the low tier killers which would could be done immediately... and continually until they are in a better place instead of waiting a year or more for a full rework that isn't really necessary.
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This comparison makes no sense. Of course giving survivors killers powers would be op, with this logic wraith is S tier.
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''hoomans are predictable and if you pay attention you will notice a trend!!!!!!''
as if you can notice a trend when it comes to spirit. ''oh she stood still at a pallet twice, maybe the third time she won't??'' guess what that isn't counterplay, you legitimately don't have a single clue about what she is going to do, you're telling me that because she stood still at a pallet twice that somehow gives you enough information to guess her next move and 'counterplay' her? no, its a guess and you cannot argue it in any other way. that is EXACTLY what the spirit is, a constant guessing game, guess wrong get hit, guess wrong again you go down. there is no legitimate way you can notice a pattern when it comes to fighting against a good spirit. scottjund summed it up the best honestly
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Yeah, imagine a survivor that could burst into a sprint and apply deep wound on you... Or one that could throw bottles to slow you down... ON EVERY LOOP! My god, @devs please fix this asap!!!!11
This is the weakest argument (aside from her being UnFuN tO FaCe) I've read against the spirit "shes op because if survivors could do the same you wouldnt like it" thats like saying empathy is OP because if killers had it they could always see injured people lol.
I'm on purple ranks as a survivor and faced her many times... I don't crave to play against her but shes not impossible to mindgame as some baby survivors say; run spine chill like I do (helps with literally every killer in the game) and you'll know when shes phasing. Then its all up to your skill against hers.
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Well, this thread will be interesting to keep watch.
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Everyone has a killer they are not good at going against regardless if ur rank 1 or 20. There are always perks you can use to counter them and you can learn to adjust your gameplay. Sorry that you cant adjust your gameplay to just run in a straight line like you probably do against most killers. She has counterplay, all killers have counterplay. Playing against a good spirit requires some brain power. If your not willing to do that, then she dosnt need a nerf. You need to get better. (Not directed at anyone specific, this is my opinion when someone says spirit is to OP)
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You can spin it around all you want but it is pure luck on many situations. Choosing left or right is a pure 50/50 chance, there is no pattern.
I drop a pallet and she is standing in front of it. Is she using her power? Probably. Should I go left or right? No clue at all. Might as well flip a coin to decide. I decide to go left and oh no, I bumped into her. Totally outplayed right? Not at all. I just guessed wrong and there was no pattern or anything to help me decide.
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My best advice for all those people who are saying XY is OP, just play them and see it for yourself.
If you are too lazy to learn a counter, just play her and copy what others do, to give you a hard time.
The spirit has clear weaknesses and during her phasing she is blind without some perks or add-ons.
Spine Chill and Iron Will are good perks, especially against a spirit.
I acknowledge her strength, but to me it sounds more, that you are unwilling to adapt and change.
She is still just one killer vs 4 survivors. Learn to play to your strength in numbers. Focus on gens and keep her occupied.
She has no exposed in her base kit.
She is a m1 killer with mindgames.
Be smarter than her and use distraction against her.
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As a survivor main I say Spirit is balanced. People just so lazy to invest some time to learn to play Vs her. However they have time to go on forums and rant about how op she is. She is definitely strong but not op. Please nerf idiots
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I've been playing her a lot and of course facing her a lot, I think the changes she needs are pretty simple: rework her add-ons (base Spirit is fine imo) and make her more difficult to play well.
Killers like Hag, new Nurse, and especially Doctor, have add-ons that make the killer function in a different and unique way, introducing different playstyles and builds.
This is incredibly healthy for the game as it promotes playing a killer in more ways than one and is refreshing for survivors, as facing a killer with these types of add-ons means that the killer may be running something different, playing differently, bringing variety to that killer alone rather than killers in general, which is often how survivors can even achieve variety.
Spirit doesn't follow these types of add-ons at all. Pretty much all of her add-ons make her a strictly better killer than she is by default by buffing things she already does, which gives her no variety, as everyone knows when you face a Spirit, they're going to play very similarly unless they run one build that offers little variety still (Totem Spirit with Prayer Beads and Mother-Daughter Ring), which even then this build is incredibly unfun to play against and doesn't promote healthy variety.
Moving on, I really do feel that Spirit should be changed to be more difficult to play, maybe a level below Nurse, because even Billy is difficult to play properly and he's also one of the best killers in the game, so why should Spirit be that much easier?
It's not really fair for me to have little experience on Spirit and still manage to 4k most of my matches with her without trying much just because of how easy it is to do well with her due to her power not being hard to understand or use for how powerful it is.
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Your not wrong lol but the people who know what there talking about say this
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I like having a killer that actually requires me to switch up my playstyle instead of running the usual loops 24/7. Spirit is a unique killer and that's what I like about her. I understand it may be annoying to see her frequently but let me ask you this. What happens if Spirit does get nerfed and [people move onto Billy/Freddy? What will happen to them? The question I'm asking is what is the main request for nerfing spirit? Is it coming from how many times you see her or just her power? Cause I'm worried people will start to say Billy is broken when people start playing him more cause the devs will probably nerf spirit, then it'll move onto Freddy, then Huntress and the list goes on.
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I don't think anything will happen to freddy or billy. Only some small addon changes will probably happen (which aren't really necessary).
People aren't asking for changes to spirit for no reason. Her power doesn't have much counterplay except guessing games and the amount of complaining about it is huge because she is played a lot.
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I think the best change they could do (without nerfing her to oblivion) is just make it so she can only hear survivors while phasing. No scratch marks and also remove the collision with survivors whilst phasing. it rewards bad spirit players.
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FFS- you’re the 40th person I’ve had to report, because you make too much sense!
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Here to say, I'm mostly a killer main now. Ex survivor main, as survivor when solo queuing is boring.
Absolutely despise going against her, she's not at all fun to play against. And this is coming from someone who adored going against the nurse.
However, she's fun to play from a killer perspective, but that's only because she's really easy to get 4ks with.
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I just find it funny that everyone will preach that Spirit is fair and balanced and that there are reliable counters to play against her. Yet none of them have posted ANY evidence backing up this opinion, there was Groot posting about what Marth said about her but that was it. Every single streamer I've seen (bar Tru) have voiced their concerns about the Spirit and have brought up a good argument with conclusive evidence to back up their claim.
All you people are really saying is ''go for windows, fake things!'' This. Is. Not. Counterplay.
You can't tell what on earth she is going to do, is it REALLY too much to ask for the Spirit to get some sort of telltale sign attached to her so you can at least tell when she's phasing? And before you say ''but duh glass lights up!!'' this has already been proven false by a lot of youtubers so don't make this argument again.
If you find Spirit fun to fight against, good for you, but from a balance standpoint she simply isn't fair to fight. Yes, she might be FUN to fight for certain players, but she isn't FAIR to fight. And yes killers shouldn't be fair to fight blah blah, but every single killer has some form of counterplay.
Why is Spirit the only exception to this rule?
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Who's the next killer to cry about after the spirit nerf?
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I don't understand where the hate for Spirit is coming from. She's a strong killer but she was never as strong as The Nurse. The only change I could recommend making to her is making Prayer Beads an Ultra Rare addon. Also that whole analogy of survivors having her power has absolutely no meaning. To make that a fair comparison you'd have to have 4 spirits and 1 survivor. It's just a silly analogy that doesn't make sense.
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Probably because right now she is the only realistically viable killer in the game. And some killers don't want her to be nerfed because well, you know what they'd have to do.
I am in agreement she needs a sign on when she is phasing, like for example if she's phasing we hear her glass breaking noise that the killer hears. If she isn't then she doesn't make that sound.
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I don't even own spirit so I've only played against her and while I can see why people want her nerfed, this is a really bad argument because the roles aren't the same. You CAN counterplay spirit because you can hide, how would you counter play an invisible survivor?
I realize its not the point but i don't get why you would make this whole convoluted hypothetical instead of you know, talking about the reality of the situation lol.
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That just brings up a new issue entirely, I'm all for nerfing the Spirit and then bringing up the other killers to a viable level, that's how it should be.
But right now people don't trust them to balance so they are clinging onto Spirit like the Nurse players clingned onto Nurse.
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Well, you know how BHVR gutted Legion. The community at large right now is very wary in confidence to BHVR's ability to balance the game properly.
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everything else than looping is too hard for most of the survivors. thinking even hurts them. get a grip already and learn how to play against her, its not that hard.
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To everyone who is taking this hypothetical literally, don’t. It was not saying someone was OP, or asking for nerfs or talking about balance. It was showing people why some believe she is unfun to play against. Of course its a botched idea in REALITY, but it only is supposed to make you think about how poeple find going invisible unfun, whether you are a survivor or killer.
If you can’t grasp that concept and assume that I havent played against her hundreds of times, or played her lots, then I pity you. Don’t balance the game around fun, but dont leave largely unfun areas of the game as is. Killers found instas unfun and they’re gone. Killers found exhaustion perks unfun so they were nerfed. Survivors found Nurse unfun and she was changed and is still a viable killer. THEY WERENT CHANGED BECAUSE THEY WERE UNFUN, THEY WERE CHANGED BECAUSE THEY WERE STRONG WHICH MADE THEM UNFUN.
Survivors find Spirit unfun not because she is overpowered, but because they want a reliable form of counterplay that gives them a better chance. I, personally find keys to be unfun, like most killers, so wouldn’t mind seeing them get changed along with Spirit. But these are all strong, its not balancing around fun, its balancing strong aspects of this game.
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That's not how that works.
The killer IS MEANT to be powerful. Much, much more powerful than a single Survivor. What you described might be applicable of this was a 1 v 1 game. But it's a 1 v 4. Asymmetrical. Therefore, it would make ten times more sense (even though 10 x 0 is still 0 sense) to cut her power into fourths and THEN apply it to a single Survivor.
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Read my previous message please. ⬆️
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I still find it false, but at this point, it's just a matter of opinion.
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Actually the ability to go invisible every 15 seconds is something Rainbow 6 siege did, really well actually
But back on topic, Spirit is balanced you just need to stop relying on loops against her
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Insta heals literally took a chase from any killer in the game, that's not fun or balanced, nurse was not charged for "fun" she can still instantly down people, she just cant get around as fast, if they were fixing for "fun" why wasnt spirit changed then? People complained more about her even before the rework.
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Im a spirit main (well, I actually became a spirit main after they butchered nurse into the trashcan) and I agree with you, the concept of spirit is stupid. I just play her because it's piss easy to stomp survivors, it's very relaxing compared to other killers (even old Nurse was more stressful than spirit.. And Nurse was much stronger than spirit).
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Yes evidence was posted, maybe you should watch the entire tournament where several spirits were killer and none of them 4ked. Consistent counterplay as requested was posted.
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Hah..with that kind of demeaning logic, what's the point of talking ?
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Shes not particulary broken. Its a strong killer just her addons add a lot of power spike
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People have given video evidence how to counter Spirit, but the anti-Spirit group always dismisses it as "Spirit bad". We could give you guys the most clear as day evidence ever and you will find a way to discredit it. Yet if we do the same, "survivors bad" then y'all just ignore those comments.
The anti-Spirit group is an echo chamber. No one is willing to accept any evidence to the contrary because being right is more important than the truth.
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Idk why everyone is still whining about her, they already said they’re nerfing her
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Imagine if they could teleport to gens lol
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Only the ones who know how to play this game knows that the spirit is broken, I saw a YouTuber who used to say that the spirit is OK and don't deserve a nerf because she is viable, the he get into red ranks and start playing against many spirits, and what do you think? He change his mind and recognize that she is broken even more than the nurse pre patch
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Not all the survivors mains like me always play with a swf, you all killer mains just want an easy win that's it
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Get first hit with her and you done my friend, literally no way to run, she activate her phase mode and In a few seconds got you
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Personally I struggle with Freddy more then I do spirit, but I’ve played enough spirit to know how to fool one a few times.
Either way she’ll be easier to deal with soon.
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Not every single killer has to be super difficult to play, it's just that when looking at killer variety, for every Nurse and Billy I face, I face 5 Spirits, which gets incredibly boring and frustrating after a while.
Spirit being harder to play I feel would bring more variety, as Nurse before nerfs and servers was considered the best killer in the game, yet I rarely saw her at red ranks compared to Spirit, probably because she's way harder to play than Spirit so people just turn to the easier killer.
Also, if you're against a bad killer I guess you can have easy games in a 4 man SWF, but if you face a good killer you can't just turn on autopilot and expect an easy win, you have to actually play well and make the right decisions, which to me is good; a challenge for every player in the match.
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