these 3 gen solution changes seem worrisome
wish they could do something like if killers kick a gen (or regress it by any means) 8 times at 1 gen left it exchanges its progression with the furthest completed gen and the newly incomplete gen would be shown to survivors for a certain amount of time. or simply address problematic gen spawns on particular maps because these changes definitely will affect normal gameplay.
- can killers kick gens anyway after all regressions are used, for nwth for example?
- if so will base regression (over time) still apply infinitely?
- will overcharge still have infinite uses?
- will missed skill checks still regress gens infinitely?
if gens can't be kicked after 8 regressions, nwth is unusable. if they can still be kicked, the 3 gen problem won't really be solved because the effortless, unconditional regression is still there (over-time regression and overcharge) while rewarded gen regression perks are destroyed as a whole, especially eruption which is going to use 2 of 8 regressions for 1 proc.
Comments
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I feel like this proposed change does nothing regarding 3 gens. The killer doesn't have to keep kicking to hold a 3 gen. It was during overcharge CoB eruption era that they had to kick. The problem is gens spawn too close and Killer can keep easily patrolling and pushing people off. Doesn't need to kick anything which means this proposed "mechanic" won't even be in effect during a 3 gen unless Killer deliberately keeps kicking.
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true. in most 3 gen scenarios survivors can't even dare touch the deeper gen(s) in the middle of a massive dead zone. these changes won't do much unless the killer is a kick-bot.
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They should have just addressed the gens spawn location instead of fixing the problem by creating another one.
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I predict gen blocking will become the meta and it will make survivor absolutely awful to play
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I agree to an extent but if we want smaller maps for more balanced gameplay gens will inevitably spawn closer.
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This creates more complicated mechanics, and so will whatever they are cooking up will do. The killer should not have to do a math equation to figure out if they should do a basic game mechanic or not. I shouldn't have to think about how much a gen has regressed at any complicated level to determine whether or not they should kick a gen. I should be able to just see a gen think (maybe i should kick that) if i don't see a survivor rather than having to significantly think about it.
The biggest problem with 3 genning is that gens take 90 seconds, and 3 gens close together is very very easy to defend for a long time. Another problem with the game is that the "early game" basically does not exist. At a decent MMR level, a typical game results in a killer losing 3 gens in the first chase. Thus the "3 gen" naturally just happens because of how the mechanics of that work.
A BETTER solution, that is easier to understand for both sides (and could easily have a HUD element added for it) Would be to even out the curve for how gens are done. Right now we have:
- 1st gen: 90 seconds
- 2nd gen: 90 seconds
- 3rd gen: 90 seconds
- 4th gen: 90 seconds
- 5th gen: 90 seconds
- Total gen time: 450 seconds
The idea here would be to take some gen time from the last couple of gens and put them to the first gens such as this:
- 1st gen: 130 seconds
- 2nd gen: 110 seconds
- 3rd gen: 90 seconds
- 4th gen: 70 seconds
- 5th gen: 50 seconds
- Total gen time: 450 seconds
When a gen gets completed, you remove completed charges from the other gens first before you remove uncompleted ones, this prevents survivors from doing 75% of 5 gens, completing one gen, and then you just have 5 gens pop instantly.
This does a few things:
- It makes the start of the game a bit slower
- It makes the end of the game a bit faster
- 2 survivors on a 50 second gen will complete that gen in about 29 seconds. This is much much more doable in a 3gen scenario than 50+ seconds on a 90 second gen.
- Gen regression perks will be stronger early on when gens have more charges
- Gen regression perks become WEAKER later on because pain res on a gen 130 second gen removes 32.5 seconds of progress, but only 12.5 seconds on a 50 second gen. This also makes 3 genning more difficult.
- Gens are less likely to pop all at once early on, meaning that survivors are more able to strategically decide which generators they should work on, likely preventing more scenarios where they 3 gen themselves.
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Peanits mentioned in another thread that a survivor missing a skill check doesn't count as a regression event, so they can keep screwing up and losing progress.
As far as overcharge and I'm guessing any gen-kick perks, I'd assume they're dead-perks once you hit you limit on a gen. However this should be pretty rare in most normal games.
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Please be sure to give it a try and let us know how it feels. In the meantime, I see gen spawns mentioned often, so I want to take a second to add some context behind this change and why we didn't simply adjust spawn locations instead. Moving generators further apart is a bit trickier than it seems for a couple reasons.
The short version is that it's a double edged sword. Even perfectly spaced generators can be fairly close. In order to spread generators further apart, many maps would need to be made larger. This comes with its own gameplay issues (making it take longer to cross the map, harder to find survivors, etc.) Making the map larger may help with a 3 gen scenario, but it would have a negative impact elsewhere. It gets extra tricky because Killers with extra mobility or powers that may help them defend a 3 gen can still guard those generators fairly easily even if others have a harder time.
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the bigger problem with 3 gens is they spawn close and in a very unsafe area with no window set ups nearby. dead dawg has 2 potential 3 gens for example 1 is around main and the other is the infamous gallows 3 gen. gallows 3 gen isn't unbreakable because they are closer but because they are in the dead corner of the map with pallets only. once those are gone survivors have nothing. so fixing it doesn't necessarily mean seperating evenly or anything like that.
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An indicator will show the Killer if a Generator can no longer be damaged.
from patch notes, so i assume killers can't kick gens after that point. wonder how that works out and if it will interfere with normal gameplay.
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imagining pain res on 130 second gens actually resonated pain, oof. maybe they could do something like extra kicks remove from total charges a gen requires so killer needs to make a smart trade off.
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Right, that is the point, to slow down the early game. After doing these types of changes, they could then do tweaks on perks, maybe pain res needs to be come 25%. Or maybe the tokens now work differently. I.E. You earn tokens, and then spend them by hooking. Any number of possible changes there. The point is not about the perks, it is to fix the core system, then adjust perks accordingly.
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That’s fair. A lot of 3 gens spawn in areas which just have no resources making it dangerous to even attempt to repair them especially against certain killers who can quickly down an out of position survivor.
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The main problem that I see with this new system is that all it's gonna do is encourage tunneling and camping because this system will, effectively, be a punishment for killers trying to defend gens which will primarily point them in the direction of tunneling and proxy camping which is just as bad. This just ain't a solution imo at all- To me it's more like trying to aid someone with depression by giving them a depressant medication. Just because it's a "medication" (the potential solution in this case) doesn't mean that it's the correct type of medication at all and can potentially just do more harm than good.
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Does perk effects like Surge count towards the 8, or is it specifically kicking?
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