Best Of

please reconsider adding Elusive off hook. that change alone would help with the frustrations of being instantly tunneled off hook since the killer can’t easily track your pools of blood and scratch marks.

I wasn't try to imply you had any one specific opinion on this, which is why I specifically said "OP" and not "you" when talking about the "causes of tunneling" thing. I'm not trying to argue against a point I think you made, I'm trying to explain to you why a point someone else (OP, that is to say, MechWarrior3) was incorrect and how a different user (Firellius) addressed that incorrect point. This isn't about you.

You're looking for the term "positive feedback loop."

That said, Firellius still has a point. Often when the "tunneling causes gen rushing (or vice versa)" debate comes up, you will see people say "I only gen rush because people tunnel," or the opposite, "I only tunnel because people gen rush." (OP has actually said this second one one themself in this thread). The fact this thread is titled "why are we not doing anything about gen speeds," and the point about gen speeds causing tunneling, lead to the implication that if gen speeds were reduced, that would reduce tunneling in turn.

The point Firellius has is that we have clear historical precedent that contradicts that implication. 6.1 was a patch where the required time to complete gens increased, and people immediately noted an increase (not a decrease) in the amount of tunneling. Maybe OP truly would tunnel less if gens took longer, but the existing evidence shows that they are in the minority.

In the interest of actual discussion, let me give you another perspective.

I'll take you at face value that you both want to improve the game and address core issues.

You claim to want to address these things, and at a surface level you and I both agree that we should address these issues. Ideally at or around the same time.

I'd love to have meaningful discussions about to what degree gen speeds are actually a problem or how we can meaningfully buff trapper without just adding dash slop.

And I'd also have no issue discussing that in context of "and here's the changes to tunneling that would go with that".

Unfortunately, historically what the loudest voices want is the first part (nerf gen speeds), and absolutely will not allow BHVR to address the second part (tunneling). And whenever that has happened in the past, we get direct or indirect buffs that result in making tunneling worse with literally nothing that attempts to address or fix that part of the issue.

And usually, when we start taking about the "fix tunneling part" is where people start to give a huge amount of push back or just throw up their hands and claim it's bias. Or something else to shut down the conversation (usually it's SWF or gen speeds).

So, for context, when @Firellius responded and I gave you solid reasons why tunneling absolutely has to be dealt with in this discussion you shut down instead of engaging. You jumped into "bias" claims instead of giving any kind of actual discussion.

That doesn't feel like you're looking for a solution, it feels like you're joining the loud group that we see a lot here that claim "gens speeds need fixed, but if you expect any tunneling changes I'm out, forget it". Now maybe that's not your stance, and I'm willing to take your word for now that it isn't. But that's likely why you're getting downvoted here.

I'm not sure what is left to say about Lights Out. It has been the same story twice now. It releases and everyone complains about how it's the worst thing ever. Then the devs say that no one played it. Then it goes away and people ask when it's going to come back. Then predictably people hate it again… Why would it be different the third time? It seems like a failed game mode to me. It was one of those ideas that sounded cooler than it actually was in practice.

BHVR making their game anti-friends when it's the only thing keeping a lot of casual and average players engaged would be an idiotic move.

Tbh are we sure its even people DC'ing on purpose? The servers are so unstable sometimes I just get randomly booted from the match. It happens so frequently.

Your first post was more upvoted than downvoted, it seems to me you only started getting "bombed" with downvotes when you made your unnecessarily aggressive reply to Firellius. I imagine if you hadn't immediately accused him of "purposefully try[ing] to misunderstand" what you were saying, your other posts might have performed better.

I advise we not continue discussing this as we're getting quite off topic

"Toolboxes can stack with not just perks but multiple perks from multiple survivors."

What are those Perks? All Perks which do anything like that are basically Noobtraps, or really hard to pull off.

And I dont really get the impression that Killers have fun playing the game either. Where is the fun in slugging the whole team so that all abandon? Or where is the fun in tunneling someone out early so that it is a guaranteed win because of the early 3v1?

But I know the answer - THIS is the Survivors messing up, so they deserve it. But a Killer getting "genrushed" (lol, most Killers claim they get genrushed even if the game takes 10+ minutes…) is never the fault of the Killer playing badly, nono.