Visit the Kill Switch Master List for more information on these and other current known issues: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/299-kill-switch-master-list
We encourage you to be as honest as possible in letting us know how you feel about the game. The information and answers provided are anonymous, not shared with any third-party, and will not be used for purposes other than survey analysis.
Access the survey HERE!
How do you feel about killers being punished for being too optimal?
I've said this before; if you are too good at finding survivors and finishing chases you'll get frustrated and waste time because you'll probably get hit by a ds. I know a solution to this is slugging, but I just want to hear your thoughts on how the game doesn't make it easier for the killer when he is being too efficient while survivors do have it easier when they are doing gens as fast as possible.
In my opinion something doesn't feel right about this.
Comments
-
In terms of emblems, a 4k at red rank often leaves me with a black pip that's closer to a depip than an actual pip. That's an issue in my mind, especially for Plague players who suffer in the chaser emblem simply due to how her power works.
18 -
getting hit by decisive isn't frustrating I know what I signed up for
17 -
The emblem system can be much more frustrating. I've seen killers get a 4k and not even get a pip.
10 -
Fine, but would you admit that getting hit by a ds because you are too good doesn't make it easier for you while making gens as fast as possible does make it easier for he survivors? If so, how do you feel about that?
4 -
Survivors also get punished for being too optimal.
You're not getting pips or BP if you are stomping the killer. It's the exact same thing.
If you want to argue DS punishes killer for killing too fast, then NoEd punishes survivors for gening too fast.
Get over it.
17 -
How do you feel about killers being punished for tunnelling?
Fixed for you.
If you are really too optimal, you should have no trouble catching them again.
7 -
Are you not? I pip as survivor almost every game rather i win or lose. Also no ed isn't a fair comparison because DS only punishes you for killing too fast, while no ed will activate no matter how fast you do gens....which also fits your bias more so im not sure why you brought it up.
Anyway DS lasts too long but the concept of it is so you don't tunnel a survivor to death which is a healthy thing for the game. It's dumb when EVERYONE has it but what can you do...well you could slug but thats boring
4 -
What happens when the person who went down was downed because his teammate unhooked him with the killer nearby?
Shouldnt that teammate be punished for his failure to unhook safely?
3 -
Judging by how fast survivors try to make gens (some of them don't even bother healing) I don't think they care about bp as much as they care about "stomping the killer" or simply getting out of there as fast as possible.
I don't think it's the same thing at all because of what I just said and because that punishment would be a post game punishment that doesn't affect the outcome of what you are trying to achieve; get out as fast as you can.
0 -
You can get hit by a ds even if you don't tunnel anyone, I think you missed my point.
9 -
No, I do not pip either when a killer plays poorly. I barely get any BP either. Either you are chased the whole time and get no objective or altruism. Or you do gens the whole time and get no boldness or altruism.
Also it's rare for me to get hit by 2 or even 1 DS, never mind 3 or 4 lol.
1 -
Imagine a killer complaining that survivors don't heal.
1 -
It's not really a complaint. It's an argument I'm using to prove that survivors who want to do gens as fast they can to end the game as fast as possible don't care about bp as much as they care about getting out of there or "stomping the killer".
Edit: And why do you call me a killer anyway? I'm not a killer main. I play both sides and I have more hours as survivor.
3 -
Its just what ppl say on here. With 95% of my time on killer, I was called a survivor main not too long ago by telling a guy that him chucking hatchets at a hook is still infact tunneling, no matter how far away he stands.
2 -
I'd prefer to be hit with a double-length stun but halve the perks active time to 30 seconds. That way it would be closer to an anti-tunnel perk.
The emblem system keeps good players at worse levels than they deserve and will lead to them getting easier games that then leads to even more efficient kills. The double-pip would be best handed to to players that manage to kill everyone immediately rather than the players that 3 hook everyone.
If a Hillybilly can take down an entire team in three minutes, he probably deserves two pips to help him rank up to where he belongs. Not zero pips.
3 -
Once again I'll pull this out...
This is what happens when you get a 4k with 5 gens remaining in 2 minutes without camping. Guess I shouldve done better, lol.
2 -
The only problem with DS currently is that it's not deactivated when the unhooked survivor is back in action. As soon as they are on a gen, totem, chest, unhook or heal somebody else, they should be punish and live when they are downed again.
3 -
The killers certainly aren't kind to me, why shouldn't I do gens as fast as I can when they camp, tunnel, slug at five gens, and bring in ebony moris with ultra rare add ons into every other game? I personally am not afraid to play this game injured, as opposed to Blendetting my way through 87 self-cares a game.
2 -
Had a case afew weeks ago where I went to hook someone, just for a Bill to go for the unhook as soon as the animation finished. Went ahead and started Bubbas chainsaw and downed em both. Picked up the Bill...and got a DS...cuz you know, i tunneled him and he didnt follow me at all. If someone is doing an objective action, like cleansing totems, fixing gens or unhooking teammates...theyre clearly not being tunneled.
2 -
The same thing happens to survivors who play “too” optimally. If there’s no altruism to get because nobody is going down and all you do is gens and leave, you’re not getting BP or pips.
1 -
If you are that good that you constantly drop survivors left and right and get DSed even tho you don't actively tunnel, then it doesn't matter cuz you are already dominating the living shitt out of the survivors.
2 -
Okay, so how about you not ignore the part where I said Survivors are also punished if they do gens too fast by NoED?
Or is too inconvenient for the narrative you're trying to tell, and you have no answer for it?
3 -
Well, sorry, we're not all genius survivors like you.
I hate to break it to you, but you are an amazing, exceptional, outstanding player and everything you do is perfect. The normal rules don't apply to you, you are the anomaly that breaks everything. So of course even if you die a minute into the game you still pip, because you're that amazing.
Now if you can't see why I brought up NoEd, that's YOUR BIAS. I brought it up because the OP was talking about how DS punishes killers who kill too fast.
He brought up a perk that punishes killers for killing too fast.
I bring up a perk that punishes survivors for repairing gens too fast.
And YES if you do gens too fast you get hit by NoEd because that means nobody went and cleaned the totems. This isn't rocket science. Surely such an obvious thing didn't go over your head?
2 -
I didn't say anything about that, because, as far as I can tell judging by my own experience, genrush hardly ever happens at low ranks and noed is almost never used at high ranks. And because ds is also much more common at high ranks. You seem like an experienced player, so I think you know what I'm talking about, unless we've got completely different experiences with the game; like killers usually running noed at high ranks and survivors genrushing and ds being much more common at lower ranks.
0 -
Sure but, once again, anti-tunneling is not the SOLE purpose of DS. It offers some protection for 60 seconds after being unhooked. People need to move on from trying to define DS as anti-tunneling because for every adjustment made, someone will come along and say it's not enough because they did this and this and they still got hit by DS and that just isn't fair!
0 -
Well your experience doesn't jive with mine and a ton of other players.
Genrush happens at most ranks, and NoEd is used at all ranks. And teams do genrush at various ranks and get hit with NoEd when they do. This is an indisputable truth, whether you deny it in your experience.
It is a fact that Survivors who genrush and neglect do all the totems get punished by NoEd. This happens in the game. This has happened many times to me, and it has happened countless times to others who play this game. If you need evidence, just do a search for NoEd here and you'll see the hundreds of posts complaining about NoEd.
And it's irrelevant what rank it happens at. It happens. So Survivors do get punished for being too optimal, just like Killers.
0 -
I'm actually surprised if that's the case. I'd swear noed is hardly ever used at high ranks and that genrush hardly ever happens at lower ranks and that the ones who are usually optimal at genrush are the red ranks.
I actually have another account I use to play with my low rank friends; they really can't hit hex skill checks and great skill checks, genrush is very uncommon when I play with them. I also tend to run across killers running noed more often when I play with them and tunneling seems to be more efficient when I play with my low rank friends, because for some reason lower ranks don't usually run ds or seem to struggle with the skillcheck.
0 -
How are people still complaining about DS?
When it first came out all 4 survivors got a free escape.
0 -
I don't see how that's a counter argument.
0 -
Anyways the Emblem system is kinda stupid. It isn't tied to the wincon so you can depip on a win or pip on a loss, which just isn't right given the function of a ranking system.
0 -
It's not that hard to predict if you are going to get hit by ds. If you downed them too early , just slug. If you suspect their ds is still active, just wait a bit before picking them up. I rarely get hit by ds when I play killer, it is really easy to avoid ds in most scenarios.
0 -
I know, that's why I said slugging is a solution to avoid a ds, but that's not the point, don't focus so much on ds, focus on what I say about killers having more difficulties to end the game faster while survivors (at least the red ranks) don't have to struggle as much to end the game as fast as they can. Survivors can rush through gens while killers can't really rush through sacrifices. Now, why is that? Do you have an answer to that?
And how do you feel about that?
Post edited by Xerge on0 -
This just shows you don't understand the way the game is designed. You are not there to kill the four survivors. You are there to entertain the entity.
If this were a basketball game, a score of 130-14 would not be a fun game to watch. It's an blowout. Blowouts are boring. It's no different than if you get genrushed to hell and the game ends in three minutes. No one really won that game and most likely everyone black pipped or depipped.
If you want to do your job as is reinforced by the emblems: Play with your food. Toy with them. Tease them. Hurt them. Then eventually kill them.
If you get hit by a DS ever, then it's your own fault for denying the survivor a chance to play. The entity wants them to have hope of survival before you quash it.
0 -
The 'wincon' as you put it is to entertain the entity. Your job as killer is to torment the survivors in a way that lets them have hope of escaping up until the last moment.
It is not to crush them into the dirt as fast as possible.
0 -
The DS part is wrong. You can regularly down and hook a different survivor then go to pick up a survivor you slugged and still get DS'd.
You denied nothing. You did what you were "supposed" to do by giving the survivor a chance to escape or be healed, but since you were too efficient at hooking a different survivor, you're punished by DS.
DS is now a free 60 seconds of immunity. It's not a punishment for bad play.
0 -
If you pick someone up that was just unhooked, that's on you. I get hit by DS maybe once every 10 games or so, and it's usually because there were two people with identical cosmetics.
The point of the perk is to give that survivor a chance to play after being unhooked. Slug them if you *really* feel the need, but you have complete control over whether or not you get DS'd.
0 -
I don't care because I dont play killer seriously
0 -
Let me go step by step since you didn't seem to understand.
1: Survivor gets unhooked.
2: You down a DIFFERENT survivor.
3: You hooked that DIFFERENT survivor.
4: You down the unhooked survivor.
5: You get DS'd when you picked them up because you managed to be efficient enough to down and hook a different survivor, then down the original survivor.
DS is simply free immunity to good killer play. Even "giving the survivor a chance to play" can be done and you can still be hit by DS while playing efficiently and according the survivor's rulle book for what killers are supposed to do.
1 -
You're not understanding. If you win that hard, it's boring for everyone but possibly you. The entity is bored, this is why you get next to no points or emblems for it.
Your job isn't to kill. It's to entertain. This is reinforced by being how the ranking system works. Slug if you have to, but stop being boring and let the survivor have his minute to do something.
0 -
So, let me get this straight; with the current way the ranking system works being a red rank killer consists on farming as much as you can before killing survivors? That may entertain the entity but sounds boring as hell to me as a player.
Let's talk about that; players, they are the ones playing the game after all.
2 -
No, my job as the killer is to kill. That's the game. Trying push the lore's narrative into the reasoning behind not performing as efficiently as possible in order to justify bad game design is just laughable.
A ranked game needs to look at skill and your ability to win, not your ability to entertain someone/thing that doesn't actually exist. If that is the case then they need to do away with the ranking system. Otherwise, they need to allow the game to score as a game, and not as a theater play.
1 -
I don't think it would be so much of a problem if people didn't just flock to the easiest solution to their problem; being how to win the most games with the least chance of failure.
1 -
Honestly it's not just the killers too if the survivors gen rush and get out to early there's no pips either and it was a bad game. Honestly I think completing the objective should put you to at least a safety every time. Currently the games idea of doing good is making the game scary for survivors that's how killers pip seems really weird. I do like that it punishes killers that just tunnel or camp. But it seems weird to have a ranking system based around having fun and not winning. I think winning should strongly affect your winnings like a guarantee single pip. I think if you go above and beyond and play they way they have the ranking now is where you should get the double pip and a boat load of bloodpoints.
0 -
If you got DS'ed you aren't playing optimally, it's really that simple. Survivors with DS will bait you into using it or play super risky when it's active. Therefore anytime you think you outplayed a survivor with DS more than likely they LET YOU out play them so they can hit you with DS.
The optimal play against DS is to slug.
0 -
The entity punishes you for playing "optimally" because it feeds on the survivors hope of escape. Your play robs it so you get punished for it.
0 -
The game actively penalizes you for that. You ask why you're being punished for playing efficiently, but you're failing to understand that you *aren't* playing efficiently. It's why you aren't rewarded for it. You are there to entertain the entity. Enjoy continuing to be punished for being boring.
0 -
How is downing one survivor and then another survivor not efficient play? Are you syaing that downing and hooking (or attempting to hook) two survivors isn't playing efficiently?
I think you're confusing ACTUAL efficient play for "not entertaining the entity" play.
0 -
Yeah, I understand that and I think you missed my point; do not focus so much on ds, focus on what I'm saying; If a killer is good at finding survivors and good at ending chases he would be able to rush through kills if it wasn't for the current state of ds, but it's the current state of ds that forces you tu slug survives and wait a a few seconds before you can hook them again.
What I'm saying is that survivors are able to rush through gens while killers are not able to rush through kills. How do you feel about that?
I'm not asking how to deal with ds.
0 -
You get less points. You get less rank. You are actively detrimental to your own performance. That's suboptimal.
0 -
First, NOED is a thing and punishes gen rushing. Second, survivors are punished by no unhooks, no chase score, and likely depip if all they do are gens.
0
