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The Bottom Line Of Hook Suiciding
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It's never acceptable.
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Oh yea? What if the killer doesn't wanna play the match anymore should he just AFK in a corner and deny survivor a pip and points? Nah didn't think so. Suicide on hook should have consequences as well it's literally an exploit for DC.
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This is a video game, not a job.
If my teammates let me get to second phase because they’re crouching around not fixing gens, not getting chased, not doing ANYTHING, and I’m not getting camped then I’m letting myself go on the hook. Sorry not sorry.
You will never force players to play against something they don’t like, they’ll AFK. Not saying this is right but you can’t force players to play against broken mess. If worse comes to worse they’ll just leave the game :/
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Talk about your impossible to punish rules. Everyone at some point in this game has broken that rule. A killer that gives a survivor the hatch or walks them to the edge of the exit. Anyone who hasn't struggled on the hook to give another survivor a chance at the hatch. People who are just plain tired of trying to finish one gen of a three gen situation.
People WILL NOT play a round where they are not having any fun. They will always bow out via the hook.
Would you face it, BHVR IS NOT GOING TO PUNISH hook suicide. No matter how much you feel its warranted.
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Your reasoning faulty.
AFKing in the corner is actually something the devs have always punished. This is how the bots problem was squashed. But there is nothing stopping the Killer from just running around in the map.
No where does it say the Killer must swing his weapon.
No doubt you have been reading my responses thus far so I'll not repeat it here, but just point you to my other responses for more on this topic.
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It's still an exploit and shouldn't be allowed just because it's in the game.
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So first off this is my first post so go easy on me and I'm dyslexic so don't be like you can't spell as yeah I'm dyslexic your point but I'm a solo player and I enjoy playing surviver and I've had games like others where u get caught straight away and get hooked and after getting hooked your assume your be saved well first of if your being camped no one wants to and that fine u wait out timer and your team gets gens agreed that's what u should do but there are other games I get hooked not camped and where's my team no where not even doing gens so I gotta sit there and hang ? And not rush hook to die no I'm not staying there for no reason when I could be playing another game
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Not really an exploit. The self dehook is a legit attempt to continue the the game. And the failure to struggle, is iffy at best. I have a friend who legit screws up his struggle all the time.
So I'll fall on the "nah its not" side of the fence.
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I think it's kind of silly you're saying this when you don't even know that the people hook suiciding are the people making these "youtube epic montages", and there are just as many videos of killers as there are of survivors, I'm sure.
I get that you just wanna use your ebony mori to deny survivors BP in a game while also being a jerk and crab walking left and right between your hook waiting on them to be unhooked, but I'm not gonna deal with that. If I'm not gonna get much BP, I'm getting out of the game as quickly as possible because it's a waste of a game. There will be no fun in it for me, and I don't want to give you the satisfaction of being a jerk. We're most likely not gonna get 5 gens done anyways, and you're likely gonna get your 3 or 4k, so I'm just gonna die on my hook, unless I kobe, and then you can run straight to the hook and kill me like you intended so I can get out.
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It's good enough that straight dc'ing will start to be punished. Dc'ing was by far the easiest way to get out of the match early, but it definitely wasn't the only way.
Let's say they find a way to punish hook suicides. Next best thing? Seek out the killer when you get saved so you can get hooked again. Or afk. Afking already is punishable, but I can't see a way they'd punish "throwing". And if they did, well, queue times are already bad right now.
The bottom line is yes dc'ing and suicide are the same things but in the end you really can't force someone to play a game they really don't want to. Best way to address this kind of behavior is for the devs to work on -why- people leave the match early. Not how. They'll always find a way.
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Very easy to punish, actually. You just punish the ones who do it excessively. Same as with DCing.
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loved the title you came up. totally would bait me to click
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It's almost the equivalent to a concede button survivors have asked for.
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Jesus. This again. If they first hook suicide it sucks. Get over it. There is nothing to be done about this. If you managed to get first hook suicides banned they'd just go afk. If going afk became banned they'd find a way around that. There is nothing you can do to stop people from getting out of a match they don't want to play.
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Honestly be glad with dc being punished, wait see how it goes.
Imagine you would punish hook-suicides as well? The person that wanted to suicide might ruin the game for the other further, running to them, giving the killer noise notifications and griefing even more. There is always a way to ruin a match, punishing dc is fine. Hook suicide is not have you never had a lag in this game and ended up dead on the hook?
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This person gets it!!
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You didn't actually specify how they'd get around punishing AFK. :P
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I was playing my first game as Leatherface today I know late to the game buying him and all, but I had all 4 survivor's hook suicide and to be honest it's not fair to the killer especially if they have a decent add on or perk to use and then they lose it
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I assume they'd track afk people by them not moving. Position the left stick forward. Or for PC have w held down.
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I feel like you're really just grasping for straws here. At the end of the day, survivors have invested time and money into this game, so you're just going to have to suck it up if one guy feels the need to die early. And the whole "oh it's unfair for killers" thing doesn't work, because you know exactly what you're getting yourself into when you choose to play. If it's truly such a horrible thing, then switch to survivor.
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At the end of the day we all spent money on this game so we have the right to in a sense do what we want I been in games we done 0 gens and 2 dead one on hook so I hide in locker by gate and when hatch is shut do gate and win the point is yeah if people wanna do the game there way they can and if it fails and they suicide Welp to bad there really is no rule that saids u gotta stay this long or do this amount of work etc and if they punish people that just don't care or just want to leave because they don't like map/perk/killer or item well there allowed at the end they lose points too from not struggling so both killer and player miss out
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I uhhh... I've definitely never had that happen, and gone on to survive the whole match, multiple times in a day before. No sir, I would never rage Kobe in a game...
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just make it so struggle is automatic with no imput from the survivor, Easy solution
But nah, we are talking about survivors and bhvr here, they will do some stupid and convoluted system to "fix" the problem
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Once you start running into a wall, stillness crows can still get you for staying in the same area, so just finding a way to have your character automatically move in one direction wouldn't work.
I don't feel like I am. That person's argument was that Survivors would always find a way to get around whatever punishment measures devs could put into place to avoid having to play a game. But I am thoroughly unconvinced. There's only so much a Survivor can do before their only options are "eat the punishment," "stop excessively leaving the game," or "stop playing altogether."
Also, I would argue that this is more unfair for Survivors than Killers, as it makes a Killer's game easier (though the higher rank you are, the more you are penalized in the emblem score) but a Survivor's game more difficult.
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@TAG you gotta think about the fact it's there choice to make like if they wanna struggle they have that right 2 if they don't wanna spam they have that right to now let's say there's 2 survivers left one on hook one at hatch so it's ok for the person on hook to rush for them ? But any other time it's not allowed and should be punished ? Like @Outland said they should try to solve the reasons y they rush hook instead of punishing them as it is a thing u can do in the game so it's allowed and yes if they use offers or items that they spent points on and time to get it is ######### if they lose them but at the end of the day it's a game with pros and cons and I doubt there force people to sit through that
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It's not "do it any other time and get punished." It's "leave the game early excessively and get punished." Whether it be DCing or hook suicide.
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The true is tho there is no punishment for suicidieing on hooks as they are using a mechanic in the game that's been there since release and they could be doing it for multiple reasons and we don't know all the reasons either with dcing the killer loses the points for killing them and anything building up at least with suicide on hook they get something I honestly dealt they will change it at all
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I have to refer back to an earlier response I made where I argued that it is possible to punish someone who repeatedly griefs their own teammates by intentionally wasting pallets left and right, which is using an in-game mechanic. So this argument that excessive hook suicides can't be punished because it is technically using in-game mechanics doesn't add up to me.
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The goal was to avoid getting dinged for not moving. If they tracked it by if you had crows that would take more thought to avoid. I'm not sure if you'd gather crows while running into something. I never tested it because why would I.
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The goal is to avoid getting dinged for being "away from keyboard". Just getting stillness crows isn't going to mean anything by itself, but if they notice you getting crows repeatedly, it would at least warrant them looking into your circumstances, seeing that you are just constantly moving in one direction and not actually playing the game, and making a judgement call from there.
From my understanding, stillness crows happen when you stay in the same area for too long without doing something like working on gens or something.
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I'm saying if it was tracked by you taking an action like moving it would be easily avoidable. Hell all crows would require is you periodically move to another spot and go back to what you were doing. Even if those two things failed they'd just run at the killer and get hooked. Then run at them again if they got unhooked. There will always be a way around this.
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As I said before, one of the things listed as a reportable offense under "Unsportsmanlike Conduct" is "Purposefully losing the game". It's not the sort of thing where you get in trouble for doing it once or twice (same with stuff like DCing or hook suicide), but if you make a habit out of it at the expense of your fellow teammates, they can certainly take notice.
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I think the fact your comparing 2 mechanics one that punishes people for greifing the other for people wanting to leave by a legit way is silly players have the right to leave if they want to it's a game there's no way stating THEY HAVE TO stay as long as they can let's say they just don't like the killer or map then ok they run to killer die and surrender so what dcing however gives 0 points to killer 1 u get pints maybe not as much but points the other u get 0 and if it screws over team who cares they shouldn't have to sit there hanging if they just wanna die
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If someone is purposely losing then report them and if they continue then the Devs will decide to punish or not the whole idea of changing the game tho to stop this is stupid imo as it's a mechanic the killer still gets the kill and points
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Both would be instances of punishing people for repeatedly screwing over their teammates. It's not about "Oh, I have to do something outside of the game, so I'm going to die once." You don't get in trouble for that. It's "I'm going to frequently/repeatedly leave the game early at the expense of my teammates."
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...I don't know if I'm misinterpreting things, but you are pretty much just agreeing with me at this point. If someone is purposefully losing the game, report them, and if they continue, the devs will make the decision of whether or not to punish. That is what I am saying.
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Then you get into the murky waters of proving that is what they are doing. How do you prove it's intentional and not they are just really bad in chases? Like I said there will always be a way around these things. No matter what is tried.
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Patterns. If it happens once in a while, that doesn't mean much. If someone is just consistently dying first hook or consistently idling (or running into a wall, as you point out) or constantly running right to the Killer to die, one can make a pretty safe judgement call.
If someone is actively just trying to pretend to look bad to avoid getting busted, at that point, they're kinda just playing the game anyways, so...mission accomplished?
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Leaving the game early affects both Killers and fellow Survivors negatively. Obviously, you shouldn't punish someone for leaving the game once because there are very valid reasons to leave the game suddenly. Someone who does it with a level of consistency, however, is ruining the game for the other players and should be reprimanded.
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I don't usually suicide unless its to give someone the hatch. But the number of times I've seen someone suicide and thought "yeah, I don't blame them" is pretty high.
I get over it and move on. Unless this becomes a real team game with in game voice chat or something, I don't expect anything from anyone. Unless this becomes a real skill game where rank actually measures skill more appropriately, I don't expect people to stay. Unless they add a quick play option for people who just want to have fun without worrying about rank instead of forcing then to be with the people who do, I don't expect them to stay. If they're not having fun then they can leave and I'll survive the same way everyone should be able to.
Furthermore unless the game becomes actually balanced (lol), I don't believe we should be forcing people to go through dealing with the likes of Spirit and ridiculous add-ons if they really don't want to. People will just get annoyed and leave the game for good.
If you really want, give the killer the option to open the gates at anytime like "yeah I don't wanna deal with this 4-man swf, a gen got popped before I even crossed the map, and ruin got popped in the first 20 seconds, I'm out" the same way survivors can.
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What? Punishing people for excessive DCing is a thing in video games. What makes you think that most games don't care about DCs?
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This whole issue is about excessively DCing/leaving the game, so when you say "sure", what exactly is there left to argue? I'm not advocating for banning people for DCing/leaving once or twice.
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it depends I only do it when I just got hooked in all other three survivors on the other side of the map and I'm in the struggle state
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As a survivor I used to play in a full stack with best add ons and offerings. But now I don't care much for ranks and play for my own fun with OoO :)
As a killer if I see teams or just survivors who look cocky in a way, I will try to use everything to bring them pain. If it's a streamer I might bring Mori :)
If it's a nea I am 100% bringing a Mori and spirit. All neas should be eliminated
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This whole discussion is just people saying "I was having a good game and when survivors kill themselves on the hook. I wanted to insidious camp in the basement. They shouldn't have the right to just die!"
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