Something needs to be done about Ebony mori
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I'm gonna need some evidence of that.
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Not rank 1 right now, but last season I was
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What relevancy does this have?
BNPs were nerfed 2x
DS Was Nerfed Multiple times
Instas Were Nerfed 2x
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Nope, balance is binary (is or isn’t). There’s close or distant sure... but there’s absolutely nothing wrong with something being balanced. Certainly “overbalance” doesn’t exist.
That’s like saying scales can measure a negative weight or something to say overbalance is a thing.
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Well, then do us a favor and go play The Culling or H1Z1. Attitudes like that, whining, and overnerfing/overbalancing everything killed those games.
Your analogies don't apply because this a *casual, arcade style, asymmetrical slasher horror video game*. It's in no way realistic, and balance is completely up in the air. There is nothing wrong with having rare, overpowered things in games like this. I could understand your point of view if this was a competitive game, but it's not. You just take it too seriously and are set on killing the fun for everyone.
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gg ez
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For someone who’s “casual” you don’t seem it...
Actually I was someone who defended this game to remain casual than go competitive (which devs thought of) cuz it’d invite hackers and stuff... could go competitive way in the future but should stay casual until the game is built from the group up entirely.
Moris are generally op to a point they’re super annoying.
I was in favour of keeping ultra-rare add-ons for killer/survivor strong though.
Like what do survivors have if killers have mori offerings exactly?
You don’t really care about anyone’s fun but your own tbh.
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Wouldn't it be 2 escape since hatch spawns when 2 people are left or its guaranteed 1 escape also there are a lot of variables in this
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SWF and keys have never been nerfed.
Just because one thing has been nerfed twice doesn't mean everything has to be nerfed twice.
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Said to you test it, not saying that moris are better (But i think)
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The hypocrisy.
Your entire statement was about how mories had already been nerfed, my post was explaining that doesn't matter because things have already been nerfed multiple times to make them balanced, refuting your point that just because they were nerfed once doesn't mean they shouldn't be nerfed again.
SWF doesn't need nerfing because if you're not a huge 4head they're pretty easy to play against & you're right, keys haven't been nerfed, lets do that. OH LOOK, it's almost like this is a conversation about mories and not keys which is why I didn't bring it up, but we still agree on that.
Once again, can't have a conversation about one thing without people brining up other things as if they're some how relevant.
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nope. why would any of us want to remove lunge.
moris are just cheap///change my mind.
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Moris and instaheals were never on the same level.
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that’s the thing though:
instas are way weaker than moris and keys, yet insta got ruined.
i know the devs probably don’t want to address this situation because it may cause a riot, but it’s best if maybe someone were to take a poll on what changes they want to see with mori/keys.
its the only way we will be able to come to a conclusion on the changes.
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Yes, all it takes is a terrible killer and good survivor or vice versa. OP meant when people with equal skill get matched and there is an ebony, the survivors have zero chance.
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Keys are weaker because they depend on gens done for the hatch to spawn, the user knowing where the hatch is and he not getting moried within 2 minutes of a match
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How did you counter Old Legion? Just 360 every single of his attacks lol 4head has no skill
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This example is stupid. Moris are overpowered, base nurse was too strong, and both should be changed
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We all play against swf, just because you dont get kills doesnt mean everyone is wrong
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But SWF isn't too strong?
No its not a stupid example when SWF breaks the fundamentals of the game. Just as Keys, the old base nurse, and moris.
Also anyone knows that old base kit Nurse=SWF, as they both break a fundamental of the game.
A strong, optimal SWF can destroy any killer except the old base kit Nurse.
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Ehh gens can get rushed pretty fast these days depending on the first chase but the hatch spawns consistently in some places depending on the map and not getting mori'd is entirely dependant on the map how good you and your team are at looping and if your team is focused on doing gens
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I can see 2 ways to adjust mori's. Either give each one the effect of increased bp for the survivors (or everyone) at an increased rate depending on the rarity.
Or, make the ebony Mori more like the keys in that you need a minimum amount of hooks in the trial before it activates. Like, hook 4 times, then you can kill anyone that you hooked already
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exactly. 80 seconds on a gen is a lot weaker than a and 80 second chase and then getting mori’d.
because then basically the entire team is ruined.
it should get nerfed to all survs get hooked, then all can be mori’d.
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Two comments on this topic:
(1) There is something you can do already. DC whenever there is a hidden killer offering. There's no penalties for DC'ing during the offering screen, so feel free.
(2) What they need to do to make moris fair and NOT encourage camping/tunneling is add language to the effect of "The victim cannot have been the most recent survivor hooked." What that would do is make it so the killer has to hook someone else before he/she can kill you. Too often the killer is so excited to use his/her mori that they literally or proxy camp that hook. That's what sucks. It's not the dying early because that can generally be avoided if you play well.
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Keys and moris change the game up because they are obtained in the bloodwebb. I have no issue with either of them. Ultra rares should be strong. However, SWF does give an unfair advantage that nobody can deny. So you are referring to an altruistic team. Those are not an issue. But if they tryhard and coordinate so that one is always on a gen, it is totally impossible to hook everyone 12 times. Old nurse maybe but now no. And now we have a thread nerfing something else killers have. Before long the devs will have to implement an AI for killer bots because nobody will be killer.
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You're kidding, right?
Killer has never been as easy as it is right now, people just refuse to get better, they rely on their ruin/pop/spirit fury and then basically give up the match when it's gone or they don't have it on, citing there is no way to "win" without it.
To assume killers would leave now, when the game is at it's easiest is ridiculous.
SWF is fine, solo is far too hard right now on survivor side, you see people talking about how they get stomped as solo all the time, you see killers complain about "SWF" all the time, but I've also seen killers say I'm SWF when I play solo so a lot of those threads I chose to ignore because too many killer assume SWF when they get beaten, which in turn leads them to get angrier and angrier about SWF when they don't even really know if it was SWF or a decent set of solo players.
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Four strong randoms can still dominate a killer, depending on how the match unfolds. I can't help the fact inexperienced randoms that never touches gens are getting dominated.
You want a watered down DBD so every match has no surprises or threats to survivor.
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Killers can mostly see keys unless pulled from a chest & mories are not a surprise, lol.
aaaaand killers are definitely a threat to survivors.
As Solo/SWF I'd much rather be taken out by a good player than some cheap offering he brought for a "surprise".
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You really can’t complain about killers needing “crutch perks” like Ruin/Pop/Spirit Fury etc...when survivors will use THEIR meta perks like Adrenaline, Iron Will, Unbreakable, DS, Dead Hard, etc. You know, all the perks to give you a second chance. Killer is not “easy” when you could upwards of four players running second chance perks.
I play both sides pretty frequently and I don’t have an issue with what perks the other side is running. Just deal with it and move on. It’s not that hard or serious. I’ve come to terms with the fact that I can hook somebody across the map and down another survivor and still get DS in the face. I’ve also come to terms with the fact that my game can end in two minutes because a killer brought a mori. You’ll forget about your bad rounds after a couple of other rounds.
SWF are just friends playing together. Some are sweaty, some are not. Some are good and some are potatoes. I don’t see why people complain about it.
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Sorry, can you quote the bit where I specifically complained about killers using certains perks? or do you mean the bit where I say killers rely heavily on those perks and when they don't have them, they don't do as well because they rely on them too much?
Yes yes yes, "second chance perks" etc etc terrifying, little known fact is adrenaline doesn't even pop if you kill the survivor, ds is very avoidable, and dead hard is just about the worst exhaustion perk at this point, 90% of the time it doesn't work, its very easy to bait out especially when you have seen the survivor has used it earlier, iron will is a second chance perk? lmfao
Killer is definitely pretty easy, and it is definitely the easiest it has ever been.
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Why would you say killers heavily rely on these perks when survivors also heavily rely on their perks? Both sides kinda rely on perks quite a bit.
DS isn’t an “anti-tunnel” perk like players make it out to be. It’s “I’m invincible for a minute” perk. You can hook another survivor and run into a guy you hooked 50 seconds ago and get DS in the face. Darn, guess I tunneled. Or either I’m that damn good that I can down multiple survivors within a minute.
Dead Hard is bad if you use it to bait a hit. It’s the best exhaustion perk if you use it to make up distance in a loop. Gaining you more distance and more time to waste. Especially if you have a strong structure like the main building on Torment Creek.
Little known fact for you...sometimes you can’t avoid Adrenaline because the map is Ormond and I’m playing Clown against a good group with three commodious toolboxes. You just get those matches where it is impossible to even do anything. Yet if I were to play Spirit with an ebony I’d get hate :/
It’s not hard for killer to seem easy when comparing it to times of insta-heals, old DS, old BNP, and old infinities. Of course killer is easier than it was in the past but it’s still not an EASY role to play against an optimal group of survivors. You’re acting as though it’s a guarantee 4K every single time.
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Because I don't have to say it? I did have to say it for killer to give context for my paragraph that I had written, I really don't understand why you make it seem like I have to ALSO say survivor rely on their perks too when I wasn't talking about survivors.
"DS isn’t an “anti-tunnel” perk like players make it out to be. It’s “I’m invincible for a minute” perk. You can hook another survivor and run into a guy you hooked 50 seconds ago and get DS in the face. Darn, guess I tunneled. Or either I’m that damn good that I can down multiple survivors within a minute."
Ok? Did I specifically say it was an anti-tunnel perk? Not at all, like you said "players make it out to be", I don't. Additionally, I don't think you understand what "invincible" means, killers love slugging but when you tell them to use it to counter DS for some reason they have issue with it as a tactic, it's hilarious. Slugging applies just as much pressure as hooking does.
Dead Hard is bad if you use it to bait a hit. It’s the best exhaustion perk if you use it to make up distance in a loop. Gaining you more distance and more time to waste. Especially if you have a strong structure like the main building on Torment Creek.
Again, doesn't work 90% of the time, I can't count the amount of times I used dead hard to gain distance just to end up on the floor exhausted anyway. Dead hard is also seeing less and less use anyway because of ho janky it is.
Little known fact for you...sometimes you can’t avoid Adrenaline because the map is Ormond and I’m playing Clown against a good group with three commodious toolboxes. You just get those matches where it is impossible to even do anything. Yet if I were to play Spirit with an ebony I’d get hate :/
Ok? Why does this always happen, I have a discussion with someone and then they always do the "insert super specific scenario that happened personally to me as proof of this perk being XYZ"
and I definitely don't make it out like it's easy to 4K, I don't even aim for 4Ks when I play killer, I am for fun because I'm totally over the being rank 1 every season because ranking is irrelevant, you can have one bad game as killer and be deranked, no other game does this, therefore, for me rank is the most irrelevant thing ever, and so are kills. I do still 4K most of my matches though but that's what happens when you don't rely on ruin and actually play well.
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*grabs popcorn*
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The game can fast by survivors hands too. Especially with no ruin.
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What I never understood is for people always complaining about Mori's when killers can't just kill without them anyway if it's such an issue change the mechanics so keys and Mori's are just gone and given to the last killer and survivor of the game since it's annoying having to find a Mori to enjoy a kill animation and with having the hatch closed it can give a chance to use that again or run for the gates with a key
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Swf is just an organized team, and good nurses still rejt them
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This is such an idiot example it makes it pointless for me to argue with you
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Tell me the counterplay to keys besides pressure more
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*overly adds salt to the point where you cringe*
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which is rarely the case because ruin is brought every round (even though i’m not affected by it because it always hit my greats)
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I've been mori'ed at least once each day this month. I played at red rank all last season and am still rank 5 after reset because I didnt play much survivor outside of the daily experience and dailies since reset.
While I view Keys = Mori while fundamentally different things and function differently. The idea between them remains the same. Deprive the other side of something by using a incredibly powerful tool. They both require minimal effort into doing the objective.
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agreed.
and the thing i have with moris is i have no heads up for it as well (even though it’s super OP). if i had a heads up that the killer had a strong addon/offering (assuming that the devs made it to where you couldn’t dodge), then i could prepare and put on powerful counters. because it’s not fair if i have a brown toolbox against a ebony mori while being solo
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That's the point. Red rank we normally hit the greats.1 In a chase 3 on gen. Boom 3 done 2 to go so that's what 5-6 min.? You think those fast matches because of a mori isn't fun for survivors. Well those 5-6 min. Done gens aren't fun for killer.
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Honestly you have some time to mentally prepare by looking during the offering reveal. After that it's time to hope the killer is bad or your speciality. Honestly it feels bad on both sides.
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SWF are more than an organize team, they can know where the killer is, what he's doing, whose he chasing, what gens he's protecting, etc.
The same can be said about a good SWF destroying good Nurse.
SWF=Old Basekit Nurse
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how are you even comparing SWF to old nurse right now??
oh no...
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Specifically talking about killers relying on “crutch perks” is super hypocritical if you don’t bring up the other side is all I’m saying.
I don’t get the point of bashing other players for using perks they have and then calling them out for using perks like Ruin or Pop just because YOU don’t use them. If you can have fun without them then cool, you do that. Doesn’t mean others are the same way.
Rank is pointless, yes. I don’t want to be at red ranks every season either.
I don’t want to HAVE to use Ruin but it’s easily the best gen slowdown perk. I mainly play Plague, a killer with zero map pressure. If I don’t run it then three gens will just pop back ti back to back. It can be crucial for early game with all survivors are healthy and uninjured. Just giving you an idea on why I use Ruin.
I also play on console so I do get cucked out of a lot of hits due to framedrops and lower sensitivity. Not a pleasant experience to play on console. I also play for fun but it’s not very fun when your games last four minutes. Guess I’m bad for using Ruin :/
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What are you even talking about? How is what I said even close to hypocritical? You clearly don't understand what the word means, saying people rely on something and then YOU saying "Well survivors rely on these" does not in any miniscule amount of the word make me a hypocrite, lmao.
You clearly don't understand the point that I'm making, I'm not even complaining about anyone using the perks, all I'm saying is that game has gotten to a point where killers put on these perks, and then when they don't have them, they play badly, and blame it on imbalance, instead of playing without the perks, and getting better without them, so when they do get destroyed or they don't have them equipped there playstyle isn't' so reliant on it.
Youre absolutely missing the point and arguing for nothing.
" BUT WAIT THE SURVIVOR USE..." etc ok lmao.
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Yoooo....you’re getting a little bit too defensive my dude.
I most likely read the post the wrong way the first time. It happens ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The game is the point where the game is circled around a few perks (like Ruin, Pop, BBQ, DS, Unbreakable, Adrenaline, etc). What do you really expect players are gonna being in? Monstrous Shrine and Deja Vu? Or perkless?
I get what you’re saying about “getting better without perks” but that’s simply not going to be the case against players at your skill level. Playing as Wraith without meta perks isn’t going to be fun or go over well against players who are just as experienced and good as you are. You can beat up Rank 15’s all day but going in as Wraith without good perks is going to be hell in red ranks ESPECIALLY going against the meta survivor perks.
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