Feedback and Suggestions

Feedback and Suggestions

Ultimate Balance: Changing Keys & Mori

Member Posts: 8,243
edited June 2020 in Feedback and Suggestions

Prologue

Keys and Mori are the most powerful things in the game; it can make a losing game turn into a winning game. They are pretty common for players who grind the game or stick to a main character to level up.

Therefore, my goal is to make both of these items fun while keeping the core aspect of what makes them powerful.


Key Changes & Reasoning

Key Charges

  • Broken Key: 20 Charges
  • Dull Key: 25 Charges
  • Skeleton Key: 30 Charges


Opening Hatch

  • All Keys can open the hatch
  • Opening the hatch takes 20 seconds with any key
  • While attempting to open the hatch, all keys consume a charge every second
  • Progress is NOT saved if you're interrupted
  • The HUD will warn all players that someone is opening the hatch
  • Once the hatch is open, the survivor who opened it will escape and the hatch will automatically close, starting the EGC


Key Changes Reasoning

This should reinforce the "whoever finds the hatch first, wins" statement. If the killer found the hatch first, they can easily see the HUD warning them and go back to prevent an escape. However, if they don't, that's tough luck, prepare for the EGC and try to prevent the remaining survivor(s) from escaping.

I increased the Broken Key charges to exactly 20 so that it can barely have enough charges to open the hatch. If I didn't, it would remain useless like it always been!


Mori Changes & Reasoning

General

  • When burned by the killer, this Trial will not affect players' rank and MMR.
  • Secret Offerings will NOT appear in the burnings.


Ebony Mori

  • After hooking a survivor, the survivor you previously hooked can be killed.
  • All players receive 100% bonus Bloodpoints post-trial.


Ivory Mori

  • Once the Exit Gates are activated, you can kill all survivors.
  • All players receive 50% bonus Bloodpoints post-trial.


Cypress Mori

  • Survivors on their last hook state can be killed.
  • All players receive 25% bonus Bloodpoints post-trial.


Mori Changes Reasoning

This seems like a heavy nerf, but I made sure to add some compensation. To be fair, given how powerful Mori Offerings can be, something had to give.

Anyways, let's be honest, against a determined killer, you're not going to win because the odds are so heavily stack against you. The rank and bloodpoint changes is just to reduce the frustration of being taken out of the game over something you couldn't control.

Secret Offerings shouldn't be shown in the burning phase of the game because there are only a select few of Secret Offerings and the most common out of all of them are the Mori Offerings. Therefore, it's pretty easy to assume in most scenarios, the killer is using a Mori Offering. Hiding Secret Offerings should put survivors on edge because they don't know whether or not the killer used one. This should also, as an unintended benefit, reduce the amount of DCs killers receive before the trial starts.


Epilogue

Overall, these changes should put the worst of both worlds to rest. Due to the nature of how common it is to get your hands on these powerful items, it's best that we change them accordingly. Hopefully, y'all will agree with my methods, and if not, I'd love to hear community feedback! 🙂

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Comments

  • Member Posts: 3,127

    I'm heavily in favour of these changes, for both sides.

    It would make keys less likely to be used during chases (which is one of the things I get annoyed about the most, since the Survivor basically has a free escape and if they are cocky, they can basically just mock you because you literally cannot touch them.) It also would make them fairer against the Killer who got a Survivor cornered, but they get a free escape because Key.

    As for Moris, I like that idea. It makes it so the Survivors don't feel like they're getting robbed of Bloodpoints and Rank Pips, and it would be a nice surprise to find out that a Killer has a Mori without seeing the """"""""""""""Secret"""""""""""""" Offering at the offering screen. Plus, once they found out that a mori is in play, the remaining three survivors can scramble to try and finish their objective as fast as possible because now there's a possibility of gaining more Bloodpoints at the end of the match.

  • Member Posts: 8,243

    I tried to categorize each Mori Offerings into separate classes / categories!


    Ebony Mori: Allows you to potentially kill all survivors before the Exit Gates are activated.

    Ivory Mori: Allows you to kill all survivors once the Exit Gates are activated.

    Cypress Mori: Saves you time carrying the survivor if they are on last hook.

  • Member Posts: 3,127

    I honestly like that idea of the Cypress Mori, basically gives every other Killer Pyramid Head's basekit.

    Also would make the Mori Daillies a whole hell of a lot easier without ruining the game for Survivors.

  • Member Posts: 4,467
    edited June 2020

    These are some great changes. I didn't think I'd like them as much as I do. The only thing I don't completely agree with is the Cypress Mori. It should be part of the Killer's base kit because at that point you're pretty much screwed, so why not go out with a badass animation? It would also help out a ton with the Mori rituals.

  • Member Posts: 8,243

    I wouldn't mind the original Cypress Mori becoming basekit for the killer because the game is already over and you minus well see the cool animation.


    Something I'm really proud of is my Ebony Mori changes, there's really nothing wrong with it. It still has the power of the previous Ebony Mori, but you actually have to hook some survivors. Most importantly, you can't cheese mori survivors because the unhooked survivor can't be killed until the next survivor is hooked. Therefore, this should allow unhooked survivors to get some time to recover and not get taken out of the game instantly. 🙂

  • Member Posts: 8,243

    That's what I aimed for with the Cypress Mori, but given how some killer mori vary in duration, it's like a grey area if it can save time.

    However, at the very least, you can avoid DS, flashlight saves, pallet saves, and so on. It should be used to either save time or avoid potential hazards that would otherwise cause you to waste a lot of time. 🙂😅

  • Member Posts: 2,727

    Better change for moris. Make them require all 4 survivors getting hooked at least once before they can be used, for both ebony and ivory.

  • Member Posts: 8,243

    There are three reasons why I didn't do the classic: Hooking all survivors allows you to mori change.

    1. If you're the last survivor left to be hooked before the can use their Mori Offering, the killer can hook you then comeback to cheese mori you.
    2. A single survivor can prevent you from getting use from your Mori Offering, which can be frustrating.
    3. My suggestion prevents cheese mori since the survivor you want to cheese mori can't be mori'd until you hook the next survivor. This gives the survivor a chance against killers who just want to tunnel someone out the game or gives a survivor breathing room to recover.
  • Member Posts: 8,243

    The main reason why I picked 20 seconds to open the hatch is because an Exit Gate takes 20 seconds to open and the hatch can be opened early.

    Furthermore, if the killer is busy with a survivor, they have to drop whatever they are doing to prevent a survivor from escaping. 20 seconds should be enough time for them to reach the hatch, unless they are greedy. 😊

  • Member Posts: 1,274

    So I have my own opinions on keys (mainly that their primary focus should be on their aura reading and less on opening the hatch), but I'm not against the suggestion you've presented for them here either.

    I'm of mixed opinion in regard to these changes for moris though. I will say that I do really like the idea of the extra BP bonus and how the Ebony and Ivory mori's would be adjusted to feel marginally more 'fair'.

    However, this new idea for the Cypress mori is the one I don't like. This is not a nerf to this mori by any means. This would be an incredibly useful effect which is actually probably stronger than the Ivory mori as you've laid them both out. My fear with this working like a stronger version of Pyramid Head's "Cage" power is that this could heavily reward tunneling survivors off hooks. You wouldn't have to worry about DS because you aren't picking them up, and Borrowed Time only lasts for 15 seconds at best. Yes you would need to have hooked that survivor twice, but this just feels like it would turn the struggle phase into the true "death hook" of any match where this mori is involved.

    But in the end, I still just really don't like the fact that these offerings can have such a drastic impact on the match. Mori's are frowned upon by survivors because they usually result in survivors being ejected from a match early, which feels distinctly "un-fun" after the lengthy matchmaking queues. Killers also tend to treat them as gaining an early advantage, often using them as a tool for easier wins. What I'd prefer is if they were provided as a reward for skilled play. It's why Devour Hope mori's don't bother me; either the killer had to play very well, or the survivors had to play poorly for those to come into effect. At least for me, they don't come off feeling like a cheap or unfair mechanic; especially since they cannot occur until later in a match when everyone has had plenty of time to actually play the game and they are preventable/avoidable, as the totem can always be cleansed.

    I personally would like to see the mori offerings removed, but instead gain more killer perks which can award them (this could even be used to add more value to currently-unpopular perks like Monstrous Shrine). I also think it would be fine if they implemented a base-game mechanic where the final functional survivor in a trial (as in, not dead, sacrificed, escaped, or in struggle phase) could be mori'd by the killer for additional sacrifice points, provided the killer achieved a certain score threshold during the match (maybe at least 8 hooks, enough for a Gold Devout emblem). Sort of like a final option to "Finish Him".

  • Member Posts: 2

    I wouldn’t mind this change at all... I honestly feel like Mori’s are too much anyway because personally when I find out a killer has a Mori I think to myself what’s the point in continuing the match? If I get hooked once before 2-3 Gens are done I’m not even going to bother.

  • Member Posts: 518
    edited June 2020

    Overall the idea sounds good, but I seem some oversights here and there that can cause issues, for the keys they all sound good my only issue is a 4 man escape via hatch will still need to be possible since there is a achievement for it and I believe it is more complicated then one would think to change a achievement. Then for Mori, I would rightly assume the devs wouldn’t like the idea of a killer offering that disables ranking gain or loss for “All” players in the trial. What if someone is racing to rank 1? It would be frustrating to try to get to a higher rank but be unable to rank up because the killer brought a mori. For example say you run this killer all game, got several unhook saves and overall got enough points to double pip, but since the killer brought a mori it wouldn’t matter because it doesn’t affect rank. Now the obvious solution to this is simply make it so that this game makes it impossible to depip, then I can get behind this.



    EDIT

    Also the extra BP added to the mori offerings will be unhealthy as it will encourage killers to bring them almost everygame, now they may be rare but I know myself and others who don’t use them but have like 78 of them on each killer saved up from my total playtime

  • Member Posts: 569

    no to the mori change.

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