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😭 So many DC's....
Comments
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Why do you think dc penalties do exist? I literally hope that once bhvr has figured it out, you just end up each game with the situation you hate the most. Everytime you dc, you stay longer out of the game. Or you end up with the same type of players, everytime something goes like you do not want or they are in a situation they call filthy or whatever they dc, hf in those.
Until you either grow up or until you leave the game, nobody needs you in their game. I mean it, people who dc should just quit. you ruin games, nobody likes you, not killers not survivors.
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@TransverseCaster your posts are too long and I don't even know what your point is anymore, but I'm curious, so, I'll give you one yes or no type of question to help me out here:
considering how the game currently is (slugging, moris, clicky clicking...), are you in favour of DC penalties?
If not:
do you agree that when you DC, whatever your reason, you make the other players experience worse (sometimes the killer experience, sometimes the survivors' one, sometimes both)?
if not:
would you agree to play a version of DbD where everyone could, at any point (*), "surrender" (basically: DC), regardless of when the trial started?
(*): actually, let's do your version - a survivor can surrender whenever they are downed, a killer can surrender whenever they want.
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"There is nothing altruistic about cheating the Killer's player"
I was the killer and I lost maybe 2k bloodpoints tops when this happened to me. The player who did it had to take a 30k bloodpoint loss and at least a five minute penalty timer for it(there were timers active at that point). That is, by any definition, selfless. He did it to help his friend. Did it screw me? I'm not worried about 2k bloodpoints. Maybe you are and that's okay. The ultimate point is that he did this not because of a whim or because he was selfish but to help his friend. Whether you would or not is moot. He took a sacrifice of BPs and time so his buddy could make it and this does happen to be a game that encourages altruism through saves. That means the reasons for DCs-whether you like them or not- are multifaceted. Now I'm not saying it would be fair for him to DC you, but clearly there should have been an option that negated that DC. Personally I don't think I should have been able to bump hatch before he got to it. I played around the whole purpose of that mechanic. On the other hand, if he was slugged and couldn't reach the hatch then a bleed out option would have meant he wouldn't have to DC either which would allow for bloodpoint compensation on both ends to prevent that from happening. This solution was already mentioned by someone else and I think it's good.
"Any use of something outside the game (and a disconnect most certainly meets that criteria) to affect the outcome of the game, is a cheat."
This was never in contention whatsoever. You will never find this in contention anywhere. I'm not sure why you felt you had to reiterate something everyone in this thread has agreed to from the beginning, both explicitly and implicitly.
" You have been literally hit but a BUS with the words "DON'T ADVOCATE CHEATING" painted on the side"
I never did. Show me a single point where I said that other people("advocate") should be doing this("cheating"). Never happened. Doesn't exist. I said it has happened and I pointed out a case-where I was the killer- where this happened. The entire point of that discussion was to bring up alternatives for gameplay development that take this into account and prevent DCs for a multitude of reasons-including selfless ones.
"that you are incapable of understanding such a black and white issue"
...What? Look this isn't that hard to figure out so I don't know why I have to repeat it back to you every single post: I'm not arguing that cheating is bad. I'm arguing that DCing is done for a variety of reasons and if you understand those reasons you can mitigate it drastically. I'm trying to discuss the reasons for DC and how to move forward past those underlying causes to prevent them. Nobody is disagreeing about cheating being bad and no one ever was. I don't know why you're still having trouble moving past this because every single post I've made has elucidated on this point. I think this must be a case of Dunning-Kruger because we're no longer talking past one another. I'm addressing what you're saying and you keep repeating it like a broken record after it's already been addressed.
" You seem to be one of those people who has to have the last word"
I was never advocating cheating even once. I pointed out a reason some people are doing it that is not inherently selfish. The entire purpose of that example(where by your definition I'm the victim) was to make clear the reasons people DC and what could be done to solve it. If you can't figure out something I've already been telling you since my second post, like a dozen posts ago, then you probably should leave because you're so utterly hopeless you can't even begin to figure out what I'm saying even after I've written a book explaining it. But if you were being honest here you would just admit you never actually cared about anyone else's point of view or improving the game- you just wanted to scream cheater until you felt like you personally took down someone that DC'd against you before(which I promise you, was not me).
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"I literally hope that once bhvr has figured it out, you just end up each game with the situation you hate the most. Everytime you dc, you stay longer out of the game."
I never said I DC'd? Why would you think I did? The whole example I gave was where I was the killer(Ghostface as usual) and someone DC'd on me.
"Until you either grow up or until you leave the game, nobody needs you in their game. I mean it, people who dc should just quit. you ruin games, nobody likes you, not killers not survivors."
I don't know who you think you're talking to mister but it ain't me. I think what happened here is that you read someone else's post saying I advocate for DC and I never did. My experience with DC that I gave was where someone else DC'd to save their buddy, which is why I said that I've seen someone be respectful before by doing it. Was it disrespectful to me? Well I could see why someone would think that. It's not something I do for others and even admitted I was selfish enough not to DC in order to save someone.
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"considering how the game currently is (slugging, moris, clicky clicking...), are you in favour of DC penalties?"
Yes. Big time dude. Five minute ramping penalties were effective and I don't know why they keep taking them out.
"do you agree that when you DC, whatever your reason, you make the other players experience worse (sometimes the killer experience, sometimes the survivors' one, sometimes both)?"
This was an if-not question, but I already gave a situation where I was the killer and someone DC'd to save their buddy and I respected them for it. It's why Mound was losing his mind. For most cases yeah it sucks, but I tried to screw them out of hatch and they outplayed me by DCing to save his buddy, which was morally selfless. It's a shame the game would encourage that action but I don't feel cheated by it and he was a complete bro for taking a 30k BP loss and taking a penalty timer(at the time we had them).
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"No. You're saying "we should talk about DCs! These are the reasons!""
Well yeah. If you don't want to hear it that's fine but then again why bother posting at all? I didn't make you come to my FredTalk. My whole thing was that people are DCing for a lot of different reasons, not always just because of whim. I never once said I like to DC and the best example I could give is when someone saved their buddy through hatch by DCing on me while I was Ghostie.
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"If two people are left and there is no chance of winning, then it's respectful to DC so the other person can get the hatch."
Status Effect: Poor Sportsmanship
"First off, there's no reason not to be selfish. Second of all, as a survivor you're part of a team. If you can help someone get out on your team, that is selfless. Thirdly this has nothing to do with abuse. If you feel abused from video games you should not be buying nor playing them. Grow up."
Status Effect: Rationalization.
Obviously if there are other options then use them but sometimes there aren't. It is extremely common for me to be slugged at the end game and just sit there doing nothing while my teammate could be going for hatch. It's actually penalizing that teammate because the killer now has an unfair lead on looking for hatch.
Status Effect: Premeditation.
"If a survivor feels they have to DC in order to save a teammate or not be staring at a slug for five minutes then that's the game's fault-not anyone else's. Maybe stop slugging the third person because you desperately crave that final kill."
Status Effect: Apologism.
So if I slug them and let them bleed out to death every game, that's fair? And what the actual [BAD WORD] is the point of the hatch if I can just bypass it like that? It's a direct contravention to a game mechanic. This is basically systemic toxicity and probably the main reason why this game has unparalleled rage quitting.
Status Effect: Denial.
TransverseCaster Posts: 239
"I never did. Show me a single point where I said that other people("advocate") should be doing this("cheating"). Never happened. Doesn't exist"
Status Effect: Oblivious.
Status Effect: Delusional.
Status Effect: Deceptive.
Status Effect: Shameless.
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You said in one post that people have not to put up with the filthy way a person plays this game but that is where you are incorrect, they indeed have to because that is why dc penalties do exist. There is no reason but the tantrum they throw, you click ready, you are ready to deal with whatever the game throws at you, everything that currently is in the game and within the rules of the game.
The literally only reason as to why a dc would be ok is when you game is bugged and you are stuck and nobody be it killer or survivor can get you out of it. So there you have it, i meant what I said about people who dc in general to me they are a bunch of crybabies and we are all better off without them.
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I'll tell you what, this was an original post with good,readable form so I'll respond to it. You see that part where I first said that it has been used respectfully? That's what the entire argument of advocation came from. I never did it. I never said anyone else should do it. The whole reason I brought it up is because it happened to me, when I gave the Ghostface example and the guys DC'd on me to get hatch because I tried to circumvent that mechanic. They were trying to be selfless because they were in a SWF, but I myself get slugged pretty often and I absolutely hate it so I can see why people ended up doing it while they watched other people running around and playing the game. The whole purpose was to expose two underlying causes for DCs.
I've got to say that you got kinda greedy at the end. The comedic effect was there until you just started spamming. Not bad overall but sometimes less is more :)
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Status Effect: Pathetic.
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"You said in one post that people have not to put up with the filthy way a person plays this game but that is where you are incorrect, they indeed have to because that is why dc penalties do exist."
What we're talking about is the kind of DC. The real people we want to target are those DCing on a whim. They just feel like they have a slight disadvantage and want a new match. Those are the people that penalties exist to stop. The infamous line "just take a break and play Civ 6" (paraphrase) kind of clues us in to other kinds of DCs. There are selfish DCs(being Tbagged and DS'd into submission are common causes), selfless DCs(letting someone else get hatch), necessity DCs(life happened), etc. The main problem children are the whimmers. The people that just don't like the way the game started or went so they DC on a whim.
The kind you're referencing are those that are selfish DCs. People that get bad mannered out of the game and they need to go play Civ 6. Penalties actually don't effect them because they're just leaving the game sometimes and that's fine. The fact they were BM'd is a bigger problem in my opinion because that drags the whole community down more than a DC. The penalties are great because they target the whimmers, which I think are the worst types because it's not even understandable why they would just throw the towel so quickly.
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So if i may, may i sum up your stance in my words?
It seems like you're not arguing that people purposely DC to dodge or anything else, strictly as a way for a last survivor to get the hatch. Any other reason is *not* valid in your opinion? Do I have it right?
I'm not being snide or snarky, I promise! In just trying to sum up your thoughts/stance so I can see it better.
This is a nuanced opinion I can understand and even lightly get behind since the person doing it is out of altruism rather than malice or frustration. I still don't think it's right because you lose your BP too but it's at least not a selfish self centered reason
If im wrong, then my bad.
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Then they should take it up with the developers and not punish their teammates or the killer. The killer should not be punished for playing their best and using their most efficient tools. I hate this idea of people holding the killer's experience hostage because they refuse to play the way they want them to.
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No one is thinking “oh im a bad boy for dc”ing” when they get a 15 min ban. No they just go make food, take the dog out or go play 1 of the millions of other video games
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i still think this game is survivor sided so i never feel bad for killers who leave, its a joke
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As long as they're not ruining other people's trials, I'm cool with it.
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"It seems like you're not arguing that people purposely DC to dodge or anything else, strictly as a way for a last survivor to get the hatch. Any other reason is *not* valid in your opinion? Do I have it right?"
I mean I don't ever feel cheated when people DC, but I get why people would. I never report for DCs is what that amounts to. As far as DCing to let a survivor get hatch, I can see why people do it because the game rewards a sense of altruism and those guys I was playing with knew each other. I tried to bamboozle them out of the hatch and they worked around it using reportable means. I thought that was selfless and clever but I could see why someone eager to get a 4k for whatever reason would feel cheated. I'm not saying it's valid, but they really shouldn't have been put in a position where the morally altruistic thing to do was break the games strictures.
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OK that's that one situation.
How do you feel about people DCing because they don't like X thing in the game?
Edit to clarify - do you think people should have or not have a penalty based on DC? Should it be long?
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they will when they get 1 day time outs or 3 day time outs. and if not they keep getting them they'll eventually go away and you won't see them again and people will not have to worry about that one person dcing. it takes time but people will either stop dcing or they'll stop playing.
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"How do you feel about people DCing because they don't like X thing in the game?"
Outraged! Nah but seriously it's tedious because it denies survivors good games. As a killer I don't mind so much personally, but I know the other survivors do. Obviously I never report so I'm not hurt by it or anything.
What do you think? Do you think penalty timers should make a come back?
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talk about taking something completely out of context: what I said was ""If the killer walks sideways two inches then backwards four then runs forward 10 it's ok to dc" and then say well i don't advocate for people to dc, because you JUST DID! (yes that was not what you said but it was for an example)" (you did not say the bit before the parenthesis) so who's the one with egg on their face? lol You ARE advocating cheating if you CONDONE and say they should be able to do it outside of the reasons the developers have stated it's use is for. that's plain and simple. STOP misquoting and quote the WHOLE thing till you learn to stop manipulating things to get a favorable reaction by omitting the true things said, till then you are just as bad as politicians.
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"1)Understand why DCs happen.
2)Offer solutions for why DCs happen.
3)Attempt any method of offering or playstyle that mitigates that behaviour."
1) DC's happen because people are selfish and decide that they don't like something then stop playing that match hoping to get a better match.
2) solutions: disconnect penalties as per EULA, rules and ToS.
3) there is no method of offering a play style when it's a selfish reason and not play dependent.
thus your ideas are not going to work people will dc at the drop of a hat.. there is a thread that shows 3 disconects on the first HIT a legion gets without them even engaging the killer or the killer even downing a person, how can you change that behavior? PENALIZING those that do it.
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" so who's the one with egg on their face? lol You ARE"
I'm so humiliated... I'm sorry guys I was just trying to figure things out.
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Honestly ever since ds is bugged i've seen killers tunnel and camp every single game for 2 weeks straight, today i played 10 games all 10 the killers just either face camp or tunnel. Can't even blame ppl for dc-ing, if ppl dc they are doing it for a reason dc penalties won't even stop that since guess what if im willing to dc idc about the penalty simple as that. Also if anyone is screwing up the game for others its the killers that decided to camp slug until bleed out or tunnel can't screw up the game for others if they are just gonna get camped or tunneled anyway. Thats the only time i would dc personally and won't blame others its just boring and unfair
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Got my Shape to P2-50 so I decided today to try 8 times for evil incarnate. Every last time when it was down to me and one last time they would just try to spite me by going into lockers. Some maps I couldn't do anything about it, but on maps where I outplayed them in dropping them in places where there was no locker nearby, I had them DC in the middle of the final Tombstone, ending the game before it counted as a 4th Tombstone kill. Was super frustrating, but honestly I think that was an issue of bad game design over 'DC penalties should be enabled.' But man would it have been nice. After one survivor tried to make my life hell with it, I decided I'd keep them on the floor, wasting their time until they bled out or egc got them. Managed to cap it out at 5 minutes. I'd normally be the first person to attack someone for that, but my god these people were being so toxic.
DC penalties I'm not sure would have even stopped that; people on both roles love to spite the other in this way, even to their own detriment.
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Some people disconnect their laptops every time someone replies to them something they don´t like!
Now try to imagine these people in the game xD
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OK so I think we're roughly on the same page then. You just don't feel as strongly as some of us. Got it.
I can't say "come back" because I haven't played full time that long, but I would say I see no issue with them. I played Smite for a very long time and it had them and I didn't have a DC/quitter every game like I do here. I would personally like to see them though.
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I don't DC when I get tunneled. I die then move onto the next game. It's not hard.
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eh doesn't make a difference if u dc or just die
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