An honest and baffled question to people hating Deathslinger
I'm not trying to badmouth or ridicule you, I'm just baffled. Because while some do have legit points about what needs to be tweaked about him (LBR, M&A is an overall broken perk, not just on him), I commonly see behaviour in matches against him (whether playing myself on either side or watching others) that are just baffling:
- The seeming refusal to learn about him on survivor side.
- The ignorance towards his powers.
1 : One of the first things a lot of Deathslinger players do in experience is get into a custom match and see what he can shoot through/over. Meanwhile a lot of people that complain that you can't loop him (at all) etc seem to try and run him at spots where it would seem obvious that he can shoot through/over.
2: The weirdest thing is still what some people do at the open gate. Like, sure, healing there gives extra points, but... if he's standing right there and you saw the reload animation going through, why would you still stand there, healing and teabagging? He has a gun that can pull you back to him. Forget those few points and run. Especially people who complain about his 'quickscoping' (which isn't actually something you can't pull off by default) should know better.
So, why? Sure, he needs some tweaks, but he's still not as impossible to counter as some seem certain.
Comments
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How many deathslinger threads are you going to make?
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The instant ADS however requires some FPS experience to be pulled off successfully with the frequency some people claim it's being pulled off.
And that's what I meant about learning what he can shoot through/over. So many people try to run him like they'd run Huntress, as if they believe doing so will suddenly change his ability.
Your average Deathslinger player will probably need about as long as a regular Huntress to ADS and shoot, the whole 'just have the surv in the middle of your screen' argument is pretty nonsensical (again, only pans out if someone has massive FPS experience).
And even giving him a definite wind-up time wouldn't do anything about the second point: people blatantly ignoring what his power can do. Like, the know he has a set range, the see the reload animation go through, and still they stand there as if they expect him to walk up and try to m1 them instead of using his power.
How long will people continue to call for his removal because he's 'unfun'?
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How does creating 5 threads with the same topic change anyone's mind about whether they think deathslinger should belong in the game?
Edit: Honestly feels like a bait at this point. You ask people why they don't like slinger, they explain. And then you use that as "evidence" to start a new thread about people disliking slinger. Endless cycle.
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I don’t see why a DS wouldn’t aim before ADSing. You just align the survivor with the middle of the screen and do a quick M2 M1.
All ADSing does is warn the survivor “HEY IM GOING TO SHOOT YOU!”
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I’m pretty sure during PTB everyone said he’s fun to play as and play against, in fact a lot of Killers said he was weak and needed some buffs. Now all of the sudden he’s unfun. People in this forum love to complain and join the band wagon
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Because you can't really aim before ADS (unless you do have massive fps experience) due to the limited range and miniscule hitbox. one small move on either side and the aim is off.
Also there is a chance the aim gets a sudden twist to it, which seems to be intended and semi-random.
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I don't get why people out of nowhere are hating on him now. Hes a balanced and fun killer (although very susceptible to rush) and huntress is still better in most occasions.
And what's the problem with that? Its far more easy to dodge his shoots than the ones from the huntress and he can't down you with the harpoon unless you have an addon.. He can't do that either from the other side of the pallet. Hes a nerfed version of huntress.
And not even taking into account that survivors can block his hits and break the chain. Why do you even bother about his ads being instant? God, if it wasn't instant.. He already walks and have to reload, like if that isn't enough slowdown.
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There are literally millions of people with FPS experience. You aim then shoot. He's the simplest killer in the roster.
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Why would you run Deathslinger out in the open to begin with?
That's like trying to run clown or doctor in one of the small bathrooms on lery's or the lower part of the church.
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When it comes to Siege, I’m all good
...but I can’t seem to consistently hit anything in DBD with that harpoon gun or those hatchets, for some reason, idek
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Because you can't run spinechill, look around in general... and... are you implying Deathslinger can look through the corn?
There's a reason a lot of slinger mains hate coldwind and swamp with a burning passion
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Ah just use spine chill, as well as iron will and fixated and off the record for spirit, an obsession perk so you don't get tunneled, kindred too for solo.
Oh wait 4 perks. Nevermind
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no. just spine chill and use your eyes.
Seriously, Deathslinger's counterplay is by all means the same as Myers... or are you usually the survivor who boosts Myers to T3 before the first gen pops?
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Ah yeah in yamaoka jungle gyms where you can't see over the walls unless you're using stretches res and can't hear his terror radius and can't see around corners just use your eyes. What a good idea why didn't I think of that?!
And you can't hear his terror radius either because of how quiet it is + m&a but just use your eyes 8head.
The rest of the perks, too, weren't for deathslinger. They were for spirit because that's what this forum has told me is a good counter to her. And kindred and ds had their reasons given.
But it's fine. Just use more than 4 perks honestly Karu how dumb can you be
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Alright, question:
You are up against trapper: do you run past a pallet trying to stun him?
You are up against clown: do you run him into a narrow area/gym corridor?
You are up against hag: do you run towards a hook/a glowing totem? Do you ignore totems?
You are up against Plague: Do you cleanse?
You are up against Pig: Do you rush gens?
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That's not how that works in many maps and please stop saying "just use x perk" already.
The counterplay to a good deathslinger is dropping safe pallets instantly without attempting any sort of mindgames (even then he can potentially hit you with good addons on some loops) or using your skill anywhere with the exception of some certain pallet loops. Really fun right?
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so you are saying he's 'unfun' because some people know how to play him?
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Which part of "you physically cannot react to a shot or an ads because it happens faster than the server can transmit it to your screen" equates to "people can play him so he's unfun"????
I'm so confused
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No they aren't, they're saying he's unfun because there is no reliable way of mind gaming a good Deathslinger, because of how fast you can shoot you have to guess whether or not he's going to shoot you every every second that you're in an area where he has the ability to do so, there is no windup for his gun and if he is ADS there is no way to tell if he is going to pull the trigger or not.
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The simple reason they hate him is that he alters the exploits they're used to using against most other killers, and they simply do not want to change tactics. In fact, for many, doing so never occurs to them. So they keep playing in ways that work great against other killers, but not against him. It doesn't occur to them that maybe they shouldn't have gone for the low loop. Maybe they should have stayed away from certain areas before the chase began. Maybe they should have ignored the window, and so forth.
You see the same thing with Pyramid Head.
"theres no avoiding the hit once you're at the window/pallet! He beats DS/BT/unbreakable etc.!
"Ok, so you shouldn't have ran for the window/pallet. Don't rely so much on those 4 meta perks, use other skills and switch up your build with 1 or 2 others." and they just BS their way through this conversation, refusing to address the idea that they might consider new tactics, claiming it's unfair that new killer X can beat the narrow set of skills and approach to the game they've focused on.
It's also a problem with the fact that survivor play never changes. I mean, every killer is different, and must be played differently. It would be absurd for a Billy main to complain that Huntress is too slow, because obviously she shouldn't be played like Billy. Yet survivors expect every killer to work the same for them. Their gameplay style sort of breeds this narrow viewpoint on how the game should work.
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^^^
this. and it's what I mean when I'm baffled at things like the gate healing. Especially in a scenario where they have gotten injured near the gate and they still sit down to heal and teabag while Deathslinger reloads. I had high ranks that still healed and teabag when I missed that shot and reloaded again.
Why? The amount of points for late heals isn't that high...
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Nobody wants to answer an “honest question” when you proceed to argue with everyone who answers it and agree with people who circlejerk about how everyone who disagrees with you is just incapable of adapting.
“Honest question: why do Deathslinger players enjoy playing him? If you play Deathslinger you’re just incapable of learning how to chase well as killer and want easy downs I guess. Just asking!”
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Your argument would have more weight if you wouldn't have said
'You might as well ask why Deathslinger mains don't go and play the way some survivors demand every killer must be played so that survivors don't have to adapt'
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This basically.
You're not having a discussion here, you're not listening to the points of the other side, you're not refuting them, you're ignoring them and spouting the same things over and over man. That's not a discussion.
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I’m an avid Deathslinger supporter (you can check out my posts) and While I agree with your comment, I am also able to look at the other side, and the problem for me is that you can’t blame survivors ( too much) for only being able to play against him one way.
Not when the devs’ way of changing the interaction between killer vs survivor is creating things like breakable walls and giving survivors more pallets at very unsafe loops. Where a Deathslinger would basically just feel them around the pallet.
I think that is my biggest gripe about this game right now, it’s the way the developers introduce something different, because they don’t look at the full spectrum of how something is going to affect gameplay. It’s the problem I see with Deathslinger especially in maps with entire dead zones.
The game has literally become very RNG dependent when it comes to countering certain things for both sides.
Post edited by Johnny_XMan on0 -
Getting really tired of seeing these posts. I and many others literally go over the same points as to why people hate him in detail and people still refuse to listen. It's like we're talking to brick walls at this point. I'll say it one more time: instant ads with no time to react to any part of his power, with near instant travel speed on his projectile at short to mid range is not fun to play against and it's dumb.
He zones people for free because, like we've said dozens of times, instant ads means there's nothing visual or auditory to use as survivor, and he basically zones you at 110% ms. I don't know why you're baffled when people tell you exactly why they dislike DS.
You're against a killer that can shoot you instantly with no time to react to any part of the power so your skill as a survivor is useless, your knowledge of Deathslinger is useless because it's literally point and click and nothing you learned playing him can translate to playing against him, you have to hope the Deathslinger misses.
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If you think that survivors hate Deathslinger simply because they can’t adapt, why even make this thread? Your mind is made up. Nobody will convince you because you’re incapable of being convinced. You have the answer you think is right already. So no, you’re not “asking an honest question” at all.
Post edited by xenotimebong on3 -
Your comment makes no sense. No, he's unfun because you can't do anything skillful to counter a good deathslinger. There is pretty much nothing you can do besides just dropping pallets instantly (which is boring) except some certain loops like I said before.
You can't really juke him with his insta ADS and how fast his shot goes. If you don't get shot against a deathslinger, it's usually because he messed up, not because you actually juked him.
He has insane zoning ability because he can constantly spam M2 and you'll either try to juke by going left and right, allowing him to close the distance between you and let him M1 you or go straight and get shot anyway.
If you still can't see why he's boring then I don't what to tell you. People explained this so many times already.
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I believe I am the counter to that particular argument. I do not have massive amounts of FPS experience. I am a decent Slinger. And even if it were true... Nurse syndrome. Just because something seems hard doesn't make it fair when someone comes along that can do it, especially if many, many someone's come along that can do it.
I see someone within 10m, I can shoot them, and there's physically no counterplay because of the limits of human reaction time and the projectile speed of the Redeemer. Fair, balanced gameplay.
TLDR: DbD taught me to quickscope.
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"You are up against Pig: Do you rush gens?"
Yes. :P
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I am the complete opposite lol
I can consistently hit people with Huntress's hatchets, then you have me being unable to control the AK-12's recoil and missing every shot lol
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Dude that's what I'm saying I used to make a ######### ton a few months ago asking for counterplay and hes doing the same thing except hes on the slinger side.
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Karu he has ignored every single one of your comments making valid points. I day leave him be. If it isnt to say how survivors are cant adapt or cant change their playstyle he isnt having it.
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she or they, thank you.
pot kettle black. You kept ignoring every legit counterplay in your threads.
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He is still weak killer and needs a buff to map control but that doesent mean his downing potential isnt good. His problem is his insane downing potential being his only thing going for him. It is very very bs to play against but if you actually nerf it to fair level in his current state he is going to start being outshined by clown by alot.
Ofc in the ptb its fun when you play against new players and you can destroy them while playing with one hand. Now that the community has had time to play with an against him for more peoples opinions naturally evolve.
Give him extra power preferably map control so they can make his gun being fun to play against.
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As a little FYI, there is actually not that many people who hate deathslinger, it's just that small minority is very vocal and "wElL mR bIG sTrImMeR sAiD iT sO iT mUst bE tRuE!!!11!!" is used a lot. Plus all of casual streamers just follow the bandwagon because if a killer isn't billy or demo, they're immediately deemed "unfun".
The influx of deathslinger threads we had a while ago were pretty much all made by one person with a few exceptions. Not saying that there wasn't any hate, but there was far too much for how many people "hate" him.
A good example is looking on threads that ask "Which killer would you want deleted/reworked?" or "Which killer is most unfun to you?". Most of the responses are a mixture of Hag, Ghostface and Legion. There are a few people saying deathslinger, but nowhere near the amount that most people say there should be, people expect him to be universally hated, which isn't true. They're just kinda stuck in this hole where if anyone else thinks otherwise that deathslinger isn't fun, then they're wrong, and opinions don't matter. Of course this isn't everyone that hates slinger, some can accept opinions, but some people can't.
Obviously, I cant take the entire playerbase off of the forums, but judging by the fact that a good majority of people on the forums are actually decent at the game, I can make a pretty accurate guess that deathslinger isn't hated near as much as you might think he is.
Back to the actual topic, yea I agree with what you said. I don't think he needs tweaks tho, he's fine where he is now.
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Im a guy. Why are you saying thank you exactly?
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It baffles me how extreme these interpretations of countering his power are. you don't need to zig zag so much that it slows you down, a small wiggle while you're running is enough to encourage a miss and yes i say encourage because with enough skill he can hit you anyways that's just how fps games are.
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Survivors don't like a killer they can't bully. If pallet looping doesn't buy you enough time for your team to finish 3 gens by the first hook they say the killer is "OP" and needs to be nerfed. They don't like a killer who forces them to mix things up. Common example is Nurse.
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correcting you on that I'm not a 'he' and the rest is vitriol
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Counterplay shouldn't be limited to "hope the killer doesn't have FPS experience" or "hope the killer's aim twists" or "hope the hitboxes suck". Survivors should be able to play well to extend chases.
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Not even close. Myers can be looped easily. Deathslinger can only be looped on very specific tiles, and you're taking a hit regardless if you can't pre-drop the pallet.
"Use Spine Chill" isn't a fair counter either. It's not realistic to run a perk just in case you run into a Deathslinger. Perks should help, but they shouldn't be needed to counter killers.
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It'd be nice if he could get a terror radius. One that is both audible when it functions, and at a radius that is actually relevant. Otherwise, he's basically ranged EW1 Myers right now.
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What about those survivors that hate chases? Because whenever your argument is brought up, there's this undertone of 'everyone who isn't drawing the biggest fun out of chases is playing wrong'.
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I'm confused... is your point that we should have killers that don't have counterplay because some survivors might not like chases?
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No. To clarify:
A lot of people declare Deathslinger to be the worst killer ingame (to the point of calling for his removal) on the grounds that you cannot engage him in chases.
Which, according to said people makes him broken, unfun, uncounterable.
And yes, a lot of people have brought up that the main counter to him is to play different. Stealthily.
Which is often met with the statement that only chases are fun (their claim).
And this is the question that I am asking here: Why are people so insistent of playing the always same way, to the point where them doing their, well, routine, becomes counterproductive (the waiting in the gate for example)?
Related: There has been a threads calling for massive nerfs because an attack at the gate threshold ended in a different animation (the backflip) allowing the killer to pick up the survivor who was certain the attack would get them over the threshold to safety.
There have been threads about removing various killer perks (bloodhound for example, iirc) because the make chases unfun (on that note, I'm all for barring Deathslinger from M&A)
As, yes, others have pointed out, a lot of threads concerning nerfs boil down to some people demanding that there is just one way of playing a match, and that it must be favourable to survivors. And I'd like to understand how someone can be like that.
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People aren't insistent on playing against him in the same way. There is literally no effective way to play against him. You can't effectively stealth a killer with a microscopic terror radius (24m base, M&A is rampant, and his TR spins up slowly). "Just run Spine Chill" is not an answer. Perks should not be necessary to counter killers, and it's unreasonable to run a specific perk 100% of the time just in case you get the right D20 roll and face a Deathslinger.
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or, any killer, lbr.
People justify running the infamous 2nd Chance build by basically saying 'but what if', so why not run a perk that has a substantial advantage against many killers?
To come back to comparing Caleb and Michael:
One argument brought up is 'if deathslinger sees you, he can shoot you', but you'll never hear 'if michael sees you, you're screwed'. Because I had a ton of matches against a Michael in which i was the only one with spine chill, and each time it went the same. SC triggers, I look around, spot michael, and signal others to get away. they don't. you can guess the rest.
There's a number of killers that strike me as designed with a non-chase based counterplay in mind, but Deathslinger's the first one where it bites people in the butt if they still try to pull their routine.
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I'm a slow my bad my point still stands though you continue to make these slinge posts and refuse to actually listen to points.
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I have read a very big chunk of this forum and I would stop trying to explain to this person the issue with DS. I mean personally I have just came back after a break so have not dealt with any issue yet but I can see your point. This person is so dead set on not wanting to hear or believe he has a issue that you could point out every known point with valid facts and proof and just like most arguments it simply will end with just use X perk. Rofl I hear this for so many killers. As an example use Spine chill for DS and use Iron Will for Spirit and use Calm Spirit for Doctor and the list goes on. If we knew what killer we were up against sure but there is no way we can predict the killer so unless survivors can get more perks to use there is now way to always use all the perks JUST IN CASE you get one of these killers. Overall to me if you need to constantly equip one perk the entire time in hopes you finally go against the one killer it counters then the killer may be a little broken and hard to counter.
I am not saying Death Slinger needs to be removed and heck I think all killers are interesting. I will say some are certainly less fun to play against. I mean when I see spirit I am like well this is gonna either be horrible or great and then Hag I expect a very campy killer even with her traps in play. The list goes on so yeah some killers are harder than others but all are fun.....sometimes. lol
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