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Why the "looping mindset" that survivor players have is detrimental and is slowly killing this game.

We all know how killer games go. Find your first survivor, he runs in circles for 3 minutes, all the gens get done and they escape with Adrenaline/BT/DS/DH. This has become so bad that there are only 2 killers (Sally and Rin) that can consistently perform well in Red Ranks if they want to double pip and retain their Rank 1. Even worse - Rin was broken last update so unless you were Nurse your pip was a heavily weighted coin toss. Some killers such as Caleb and Triangle Daddy can sometimes beat a strong Red Rank SWF, but can't compete if they use the Genrush Strategy.

This is why I think the game should try and cut down on this stupid running in circles strategy to win every game without thinking. Instead, we should focus on the Stealth aspect of the game. I think most survivors (who aren't pathetic bullies) can agree that the suspense of a killer almost finding you in a hiding spot is far more thrilling than running around a pallet 10 times rinse repeat. The fact that there are 10+ pallets which can each last from 30 seconds to a few minutes (Bloodlust takes way too long to kick in) pushes the "chase killer only" meta that has plagued so many players into only playing Rin Sally and sometimes Caleb.

We want to play Amanda and sneak up on survivors.

We want to play Anna and line up a sweet hatchet on a Zarina who didn't quite hide well enough.

We want to play Lisa and scare survivors with our Phantasms.

But we can't - because the meta right now is looping, and any killer that doesn't excel there isn't viable.

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Comments

  • Alphaphalt
    Alphaphalt Member Posts: 259

    While I mostly agree, I think that some of those perks should be looked at if the games hopefully goes in this direction. When stealth is meta, I think survivors will realise how strong perks like Lightweight and especially Red Herring are!

    Thanks for the feedback! <3

  • Sonzaishinai
    Sonzaishinai Member Posts: 7,976

    Very slowly

  • Moundshroud
    Moundshroud Member Posts: 4,458

    This is a GREAT video. I studied it for a long time, and managed to work my way up to "average" and that alone allowed me to achieve my goal.

  • Shroompy
    Shroompy Member Posts: 6,676

    The stealth aspect of this game imo is very boring, not only for survivor but for killer. Because the fun part of the game is the interaction. And if youre looping some one for more than a minute thats on you. Playing killer is not all about having to deal with loops, its about pressuring survivors, taking advantage of their weak points, mind games and so much more. Are some loops in the game unhealthy? absolutely and they should be looked at. Should loops be put aside and stealth be the main option for survivors? no

  • CashelP14
    CashelP14 Member Posts: 5,564

    I swear this sounded like Trump making a speech about dbd lol not every single game needs a Nurse or Spirit to win. If we look at the kills at red ranks that the devs released it disproves this immediately. Against the best survivors the Nurse and Spirit are the best, but not your only option.

    Now for me I find the chase the most exciting part of the game from both sides. If I want to play a game where I need to hide the whole time it definitely wouldn't be dbd. I love out smarting my opponents on both sides during chases. Nothing is worse as killer than just walking around trying to find survivors, it's dull and boring.

    If you love stealth gameplay that much I'd typing in "4 blendettes on Dead Dawg Saloon". Probably the best 30 mins of stealth gameplay you'll find.

  • NekoGamerX
    NekoGamerX Member Posts: 5,292

    that how I play too and it can't be balance for fun between those very well.

  • TheButcher
    TheButcher Member Posts: 871

    To be fair. This problem would be easily solved if they changed all Long/Long loops into Long/Short loops, and Short/Short loops. So then some actual strategy, gameplay, and mind games can happen at every loop - instead how it is currently where survivors will mindlessly circle a LLP loop and never get touched.

  • Axe
    Axe Member Posts: 1,060

    I would love holding CTRL non stop around the map hiding as much as possi- zzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzZZzzzz


    Your argument is poor and illogical. You dont need to play Nurse or Spirit to get consistent 4k, any killer works. You just need to get good as a looper and mindgamer. Learn and adept to survivors behaviour and how they play.


     Without looping and aggresive playstyles survivor que would be longer, we would probaly have no more survivor content creators as they would A) leave and encourage their community to do the same or B) Become killer mains. Looping is not a outdated mechanic, its one of the few things that keep this game alive. I live for the thrill of a hunt (no puns intended)

  • TheButcher
    TheButcher Member Posts: 871

    Also reduce the amount of pallets, make them more of a resource you have to consider not running out of. Players will learn to preserve pallets.

  • Xpljesus
    Xpljesus Member Posts: 395

    How do you have 2.8k hrs and think that you need to play a certain killer to win matches at rank 1??? You can be Wraith and get 80%+ killrate at rank 1 if you're decent

  • DaKnight
    DaKnight Member Posts: 720

    If you want to ignore looping there are plenty of killers in the game that practically already do it. I find them relatively boring to play, because having to go down into the loops is what makes killer fun and rewarding for me; having to work for the downs and outplay people instead of teleporting on top of their heads with nurse/spirit/etc.

    I usually hate playing killers with a ranged attack. Getting someone with a knife / chainsaw / baseball bat / etc is what makes DBD so satisfying to me.

    The new maps and reworks are more unsafe than ever as it is.

  • WestX
    WestX Member Posts: 120

    Most of the time I see loops that are too strong and waste a lot of my time chasing the survivor, and many MANY people have talked about how at high levels you CAN'T CHASE. You have to either end the chase in a few seconds, or chase them off them immediately go rush to another gen, because you have to pressure each generator equally.

    Honestly it feels like a fundamental flaw in the game design and it seriously needs some looking into. It wouldn't be so bad if like you could continue speeding up over time in a chase, but loops are the entire reason why only around 3 or 4 killers are able to be competitive in red ranks, those being 2 Killers with a full on map teleport (Hag and Freddy) and 2 killers with a "pseudo" teleport that counters looping (Nurse and Spirit). With the current way the game is played because of the mechanics these 4 are "the best" because their powers are the ones that actually enable them to win chases fast enough that they don't lose the game going after a single survivor.

    Another issue is generator regression being so slow that its meaningless unless you have ruin.

  • RoboMojo
    RoboMojo Member Posts: 1,326
    edited November 2020

    No thanks, I don't play DBD for hide and seek. I play it to have chases. If you want to reinvent the way chases work to shake things up and make things more interesting then that's cool. However I'm very much against turning the game into immersion simulator. I don't think going in that direction would be healthy for the game. I can't speak for others, but me personally, I would probably quit if the game went down the path you suggested. I respect your opinion but I think you're wrong on this one.

  • Pepsidot
    Pepsidot Member Posts: 1,662
    edited November 2020

    I can't possibly begin to comprehend how boring DBD would be if it was a constant 'hide and seek' rank 20 simulator. I don't want to consistently walk from gen to gen to gen to gen without seeing anyone or spend minutes looking.

    Before the hatch rework I had a game that lasted 20+ minutes of me just looking for an urban evasioning Nea. Wasn't. Fun. At. All. I happend to loop around a tree twice and found her... pure luck. She could've been anywhere on the map.

    Chases are fun and challenging. Mindlessly looking behind objects for survivors for minutes doesn't offer any challenge at all. What about the survivor gameplay? Hold M1 on a gen, hear the TR and hold C behind a nearby object and die instantly in a chase? What? I don't want forced rank 20 gameplay.

    Also, you realize the game would have to have a complete overhaul to be a 'hide and seek' simulator? If you want less looping, there'd have to be considerable changes to become on par to 'Hide Or Die' ... and we all know what happend to that game.

    Also also, just to note: Stealth is still part of this game. I'm going to respect good killers and not actively seek a chase with them. I will hide from major threats such as NOED or Devour Hope if I need to. I will try and lose a chase if my survival depends on it. I will be more cautious on death hook. I just don't want stealth to be a 24/7 thing. It's good where it is now imo.

  • DaKnight
    DaKnight Member Posts: 720

    Every killer is more than viable in red ranks. This is from like a month ago. I assume the higher skillcap killers (nurse, blight, deathslinger, demo, huntress) have lower kill rates because you are given so many opportunities to screw up with their power.

    I wonder why pig is so high though, maybe because all the red rank pigs run the RNG mori headtrap addons and it only takes 1 person getting unlucky for them to 3-4k off luck alone.

    And I disagree with your logic, there are really 2 ways to play DBD at high ranks. You rock full chase perks and tunnel / camp / slug the heck out of everyone, using the chase perks to power through the loops and BT/DS. Or you do ruin / undying / discordance and play a game of attrition, clearing out safe pallets while regressing gens until they run out of resources and start to go down. (Or you just play braindead spirit / hag and do whatever you want).

    But don't complain the "loops are too safe" when there's really no god setups anymore on all but a handful of maps. You should know as a killer not to chase into really nasty setups if your killer doesn't have the power or perks to deal with them.

  • carnage4u
    carnage4u Member Posts: 338

    The last thing we need is this game any hard to see with may ways to for many characters to become 99% invisible directly in front of the killer.

    It does amaze me after 4 years there is not another alternate game mode, or more elements to this game. its like the developers came up with 1 idea and just stopped worrying about any other possible ways the game could be played.

  • Aneurysm
    Aneurysm Member Posts: 5,270

    I don't think I've ever had a killer game where most survivors were stealthy that I thought of as a good match.

    Some aspects of looping are unfun. i.e. survivor runs around a piece of debris 3-5 times, dead hards, circles another time, throws pallet: dull as shìt.

    Jungle gyms and the shack are both really fun to run on both sides imo, possibly my favourite part.

  • Laffle
    Laffle Member Posts: 82

    So you want to encourage LESS interaction between the survivor and killer...?

    Survivors already have it boring enough- most of their gameplay is just mindlessly holding m1. Gens, healing, chests, totems, etc.

    Stealthy survivors are so boring it's painful. I would rather get ran around the map for 5 minutes than spend 5 minutes trying to find someone hiding in a corner. At least during a chase a survivor has to use their brain, even around little ######### loops.

  • Withered8
    Withered8 Member Posts: 1,241

    Why do people constantly assume looping involves just this? That's only the case for safe long survivor loops, how can you apply that theory to a loop like shack or a jungle gym or a t and l wall or an unsafe pallet where the survivor needs to watch for which way the killer goes and pay attention? Plus look at how many killers have anti-loops these days. I would have agreed with this statement 2-3 years ago but not now.

  • Snowbawlzzz
    Snowbawlzzz Member Posts: 1,419

    There are enough killer perks to counteract stealth in the game that stealth is completely meaningless and obsolete. Looping is the only viable way to play because the devs made finding people so easy.

  • oxygen
    oxygen Member Posts: 3,325

    Trying to "eliminate" looping is quite simply the wrong way to go about it. Not only is there no chance the devs would ever do it when it's firmly established as a sort of emergent gameplay thing, it's also better to have several options.

    A much more realistic option is to cut down on the truly brainless no LOS blocker "hold W until the pallet drops" loops. Think the low autohaven scrap loops, the ones I still associate with the "pallet sea" in the middle of Blood Lodge. Those are completely different to actual proper tiles where there's gameplay going on that requires more attention from both players. So I don't mean turning every pallet into "stun the killer or you get hit" ones either. Those have a place, "proper" tiles do as well, and even a limited supply of "god pallets" do too. Anything is better than low-wall loops in most cases.

    And it's not a good start to a thread to essentially use words like "bully" and "pathetic" for people that basically just disagree with you, lol.

  • SilentSlayer
    SilentSlayer Member Posts: 20

    It’s part of how the game is played. If you change it, you completely change the game.

  • Swiftblade131
    Swiftblade131 Member Posts: 2,051

    Blame the devs

  • Sluzzy
    Sluzzy Member Posts: 3,130

    It's impossible to hide near generators due to how bright and bare the maps have become. Looping is the only thing you can possibly do. If you don't like it, play an anti-loop killer for even easier wins.