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Stop with the whataboutism already. The Mori nerf was necessary.
They said keys are next. Calm down. Also if you feel like Moris are necessary to win you should really rethink the way you're playing killer.
I've been very critical of the devs' recent, very questionable, decisions but I thank them for getting rid of this, it's definitely a step in the right direction. Hopefully it doesn't take them 6 months to rework keys considering all the bugs that still need fixing. Guess we'll have to see...
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Still personally waiting for the OoO nerf but apparently its fine.
Post edited by Mandy on11 -
They said it'll take some time to get the key change through, knowing them it'll be 4 - 6 months
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my guess is its in like a month at the midchapter. Wish they disabled things that are going to get nerfed in the future though. So we don't get players spamming op items before it happens
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I'm just a bit surprised it's such a ... simple nerf
They have been talking about changing mori's for a while and just adding a extra hookrequerement does not seem that ... much work i guess is what i'm saying.
I have a feeling this won't be the last change to mori's.
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It's really not whataboutism, people only use the word whataboutism because "mR sCoTt sAiD iT".
It's more complaining that they weren't addressed at the same time.
Imagine if ruin undying was nerfed and DS UB wasn't (or vice versa), the game would have a massive strength increase on the side that didn't get nerfed. All the time however this massive strength increase could be avoided by simply changing both at the same time.
Also as @chieften333 said, it's gonna take decades before keys are addressed.
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Moris are the killers' answer to keys. Nerfing moris but not keys at the same time is absurd.
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I'm mad because the change was beyond lazy and we waited months for ot
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Lazy changes are never good.
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At least mori saves you the trouble of dealing with DS/UB/Pallet Saves/Flashlights and other nuisances on last hook.
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I think people forget that whataboutism with keys and moris was so that it was a level playing field so one didn't get nerfed without the other
no one really brought anything else into it, it was keys need nerfs but so do moris, or moris need nerfs or so do keys, not moris exist so ds is fine
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A great change. Moris were not fun. I played a lot of killer/survivor and they were too powerful.
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This right here. The fact that it was such an easy change and they waited this long to implement it is concerning...maybe even embarrassing?
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Dude what are you talking about. You're literally describing playing the killer side, unless hooking and killing people is the only thing that you should be doing. How long are you gonna keep playing before you accept it is part of the game and plan around it? Maybe change your build if you see a key in lobby? Or how about you just go into it and try to play smart regardless of the outcome...
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Franklins is an answer to keys. Other than both sides complaining about the other, there is no relation to them. Keys are in the same slot as a killer ability, and just like killer abilities they have counterplay outside of pure skill. Mori's have no counterplay outside pure skill, or at least they didn't, this fixed it. Conflating the two makes you and everyone that does the same sound short-sighted at best, and willfully biased at worst.
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I am saying that Moris are not useless. If the killer downs someone for the third time he still needs to drag that player to the hook to remove him from the match. Mori allows you to avoid picking them up and, therefore, being stunned by DS, suffering a Killer Grasp Rescue or having a slug on a pallet bc there are ppl around.
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so are 20 to 30 minute queues for survivors until the bot killers come, and by bot I mean dev implemented AI killers and not the players staying afk for bp or rift xp (since they could do it multiple times for every one single survivor lobby they'd find while hoping to god nobody up and left it especially their killer) and/or to derank to avoid the purple/red twf groups popping up as often for them.
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Quick question. What if you don't have Franklins?
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then you dodge the lobby and let themw ait for another killer until they learn both to not have keys equipped and to not have their friend go unready expecting to swap their keys/toolboxes/fleshlights out at 16 seconds expecting to not have the killer's ISP fart during the offerings screen. Theey don't get to eat their cake and have it too. It's one or the other, queues that might still be under 20 minutes without that bs, and queues well over 20 minutes maybe up to an hour to hour and a half as a 3 man group pulling their bs on killers that can no longer swap in lobbies (3man is probably the toughest lobby shape to tetris into lobby's during matchmaking due to how common duos seem to be to me as both survivor and killer and usually soloing survivor I tend to get sandbagged and ignored on hook by 3man once or twice a day sometimes thrice so 3man premades are on my mind even as survivor and I'd love to see their queue times suffer a lot).
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lobby dodge? or go and try a possibly harder match?
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Its not about the fact that moris got nerfed, they had to be nerfed.
Its about HOW it was nerfed.
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OP: "Stop the whataboutism"
You: "But what about..."
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It was a joke because he was talking whataboutism for killers saying "but keys" so i said but OoO instead.
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The mori nerf wasn't the right way to do it. They effectively made them pointless. If they are on second hook. What's the point? Most mori animations are longer than hooking and you lose out on a lot of perks that activate on hook or picking up like BBQ/pop/thrilling.
It should have worked on a token system that was tied to number of hooks that is able to be reduced by survivors that do gens.
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I had expected something much more interesting , I even proposed a great rework for them that people actually liked..but this is what we got
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Mori nerf was necessary...
But them nerfing them to the point that they are ACTIVELY DETRIMENTAL to use is not as most moris are longer then just hooking the survivor.
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imo i think the nerf was a bit overkill
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what was the nerf and also WHAT??? Was not expecting something like this from BHVR
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imo i think the nerf was a bit overkill
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Does everything need to be such a complex change though? And is rather they do things the simple way, everytime they overcomplicate a change it gets bugged to hell, takes too long to be implemented or isn't a good change In the first place. This is much better. Now if only they could make other simple changes like increasing Wraith's movement speed while cloaked or give trapper 2 traps to carry by default...
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Lol OK it's hard to tell sometimes. My bad
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Comparing ooo to moris lmao. You dont need ooo for map awareness especially with swf. Ooo is nothing but a meme/troll perk. Clearly it's working on you.
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Ha And i thought i was joking good one.
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Keys and moris are NOT comparable. For all 4 survivors to benefit from a key they have to complete all generators. For a 3 escape, you need 4 gens done and the death of another team mate. You have to work all game to achieve a key escape.
The best time to use a key is when you're playing with randos because it's the best counter against garbage team mates who die early.
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Didn't really mean that a simple nerf is a bad thing, i just find it strange that if it's that simple that it took so long. And in a random hotfix instead of a actual (mid)chapter
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From the creators that brought you: We don't feel like adding with more features to custom game cuz nobody uses it now comes:
Why would we waste time reworking Moris when we can just get rid of their effect and still keep them in the game?
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True, it's ######### bizarre that it took them several years to do something like this to moris. Then again, it's BHVR, so I'm honestly not all that surprised. It'll take them 3 more years to fix oni's camera freaking out after a demon strike.
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Ya no please waste your energy complaining about ooo instead of other actual good perks, I have no issue with that lol.
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Pretty sure you could talk to any fog whisperer or any rank 1 in general and theyd tell you their opinion of OoO and no big surprise even survivor mains say its bs. (Ayrun doesnt like to use it because he finds it cheesy. Thejrm has said himself it should have been reworked long ago) im not really gonna bother on why walkhacks is dumb against a 4 man swf.
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Franklins is not an answer to keys at all. The key can be switched to at 6 seconds or looted out a chest, negating franklins unless you just run it at all times.
And even if you DO bring franklins for a key, the survivor can just pick it back up and go hide it somewhere; unless you waste the full 90 seconds camping it to death. And spending 90 seconds camping an ~item~ to death? You are practically throwing the game.
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The Mori change is a bandaid fix... I think. They’ll get to all those pressing issues in time.
I would just like to bump this thread because whataboutism is an epidemic on this forum.
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Both complete you objective faster....They are comparable. Killer kills everyone, survivors need to escape, even if you are the only one to escape through hatch, you still escape nonetheless. Imagine having it where you can only use a key when the gens are done, have a 10 second channeling time, and be the only one to escape period. You are just upset that your precious little keys are next on the chopping block.
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Just remember that survivors lose add ons now for no apparent reason other than killers do, so that should make everyone who is salty about this mori change a little happier.
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I rarely agree with something but nothing to say here. (I'm a killer main, never used moris)
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It's not whataboutism. Moris are the only reliable counter to keys, if they nerf moris, but not keys, they have buffed keys in the meantime.
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1. I found the survivor main
2. The problem with it I see personally is just the fact that they didn't release them at the same time they just changed the mori without warning without any testing or anything they just changed it and they didn't even change the most OP survivor item so people are allowed to be upset over it
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Then maybe you should look into, getting tue cannibal so you can aquire it, hmmmm sounds like a pretty common sense option to me, kinda have to be pretty brain dead not to think of that.
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If I had to describe these forums in one word whataboutism would be the one. I doubt that's gonna change.
What I find funny though is how the community somehow decided that mori=key, while the thing most similar to a mori equivalent for survivors was the BNP and that was nerfed into oblivion a long time ago.
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Im sure you got a bunch of snarky answers to this but i'll assume you are being genuine. If you dont have franklins first look for it in the shrine weekly, its been there I think 5 times since it came out which is better than nothing if you cant afford the DLC or dont want bubba. In the mean time you can dodge lobbies, i've done this many times because I personally hate using franklins. You can use offerings to stick the hatch where you want it. But over all you can still just camp the person.
In the end if there's all four people alive and they take the hatch instead of gates you had lost anyways, this is the same as when the last survivor gets the hatch it is still a 4k in terms of pride for the killer. Its the reason many killers give the hatch to the last survivor, because they already won. The only times I think it feels truly bad is if two or three get out, but i've personally only had that happen to me 4 times in 100ish hours of gameplay as killer
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I wouldn't say enough to say a lot.
But yeah, I feel like telling people to run a perk, especially one like Franklin's is just lazy, and ignores the obvious fact that not everyone has the perk to use.
With the way matchmaking is, "out played" shouldn't be confused with "matched against people you shouldn't have been" since it's still common, unfortunately.
I give the hatch for a lot of reasons if I have the choice.
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But...what about keys? Why was generator animations prioritized over key unlocking animations? What about the graphics update that broke the blight on those maps? What about Legion? What about a better balance for Moris? WHATABOUT being able to talk about multiple problems at the same time? WHATABOUT the perception of favoritism this creates?
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