This entire update was bad for killer
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Moris and Keys should've been nerfed together. Also, Mori on death hook feels very pointless. May as well scrap the mori altogether.
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Did you even read what I've written? This is simply a nerf to the Twins and not a slight nerf, they are butchering them. It is not a matter of learning how to play a killer if the strategy to counter them is simply unfair.
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I think they are referring to the hotfix patch but anyways to your points. Ormond was not nerfed to the ground, it still stands as one of the strongest survivor maps with multiple 'god' pallets. Opression was nerfed, not nearly as useful and not a meta perk. Twins are mediocre. They are currently still broken- like, literally broken. But once they get completely fixed they still won't be A tier material I don't think. Still a little early on that one. And lastly, undying wasn't released with this chapter but last chapter.
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Flashlights are kinda bad right now
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Ok and if they have no killers to play against because the old players leave due to the updates coming and all the new players are now wanting to come back because of all the tryhards then what like I've played for so long but now I'm just playing other games at this point because the updates are meh
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I mean moris aren't near as scary anymore and the nerf delivered a huge hit to killer lethality, and them being used as an equalizer against a potentially strong survivor team. No longer being an option, it just means more killers dodging and survivors pulling lobby switching.
You can suggest franklins all you want but it's meaningless to people that don't have it.
The Twins are likely worse off thanks to the locker interaction with Victor being fixed. Even a hot fix will take time, and the devs will need to get data on how screwed the Twins are now. Then there's the hoarder issue.
Legion is screwed up more than usual with reports of fov and/or speed issues.
That's just off the top of my head, and what I glean off the forums.
Seems like a laundry list of issues which will not be fixed, counterbalanced or adjusted any time soon for killers.
There doesn't seem to be much good here for killers, just good news for survivors.
And the idea of keys being fixed soon just feels like a dirty lie since if it was actually "soon" the mori adjustment could have waited and been done "soon" too.
Post edited by Rebel_Raven on3 -
Apart from the tiles, shack and the one or two pallets which may spawn upstairs, the rest of Ormond is unsafe as heck loops or dead zones. It is no where near one of the strongest survivor maps now. I’ll take Macmillan or autohaven anyway over that map as survivor, two realms which are considered balanced realms.
Oppression was nerfed?
Twins may not be top tier but some of the plays you can make with them are insanely busted. Ever had one block the basement entrance or use victor to camp hooks or slugs?
Point I was making is that undying is still in the game and didn’t get a nerf whatsoever even though it’s completely game changing and what 80% of killers run.
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There are at minimum 4 god pallets that spawn on Ormond. Two upstairs, one on the side of crane and one in killer shack. Go ahead and name any other map that has 4 god pallets. Undying at least has sufficient counter play, which earns survivors points. Sorry I had Oppression confused with Coup De Grace.
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Yeah, the locker should only save you from being downed imo.
If you are healthy and go into a locker, then victor should injure you if you escape the locker on your own.
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Crane is not a god pallet. Idk who’s telling you this but it’s more than bloodlustable. You can literally just walk around the rock side and catch up. And the pallet upstairs next to the drop off isn’t a true god because the survivor will get stunned for a huge amount of time once they jump off the ledge, giving the killer more than enough time to jump down and hit them after they break the pallet.
That leaves two god pallets, almost every map has more than that. And apart from those pallets what else have you got? How is a god pallet gonna help you against half of the killer roster with sufficient anti loops?
I think you mean coup de grace, which was the perk that got nerfed. Oppression is still a very strong gen regression perk.
Undying has no counterplay unless A ur in an insanely stacked and skilled 4man or B you’re willing to throw the game away and take a chance that the killer doesn’t know how to down or pressure properly.
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Seeing as the game for some bizarre reason gives me ormond non stop I have to disagree. You can run down the stairs on balcony pallet up top and the second one allows for quite a bit of mind gaming if you have enough distance. I don't think you can catch someone from behind that rock near crane with bloodlust 1. On top of the already mentioned pallets the tracking on ormond is terrible. I don't know if it's due to the graphic change but it is definitely harder to track scratch marks on the new maps. I think the grass all over the place and scratch marks appearing in odd spots or not appearing at all is definitely affecting things.
I haven't seen oppression in my survivor games, only when watching streamers, seems kinda mediocre, just a better version of surge. If you are a solo queue player, I'm assuming you are, you will definitely run into issues with undying. At red ranks, not as much. I'd suggest using undying at red ranks for a couple of days on killer and see if it changes your perspective on it a bit.
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I’ve ran ruin undying for a week straight on blight. Not one loss. Not one. Then used it in a tournament where survivor are meant to be some of the best, yet again won fairly comfortably.
i hardly play solo anymore since the addition of undying, and when I do I come in with the mentality of I’m probsbly gonna loose this match anyway so it doesn’t matter. It’s just so boring.
i will give you tracking is awful on ormand, but that is far less of an issue now considering most of the map is open with hardly any LoS blockers.
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The magic counterplay to undying is to do totens, maybe you need to do 2, maybe five. If you remove one of your second chances perks for small game (as I do), you remove half the killer perks 2 minutes into the game.
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Ahh here we go, the just do bones argument.
it doesn’t work if the killer is half decent. You physically do not have enough time to clear the totems without throwing the game unless you get insanely lucky with the spawns. That’s not even starting on the points about how killers can see when ur on a totem and just push you off and not taking into account hooked or downed survivors or killer powers.
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Shouldn't the little Gremlin be puntable when it's holding a locker closed? I thought when players assumed control of Charlotte that made him vulnerable. What exactly makes this scenario the exception? To me, it would logically make sense that a passing survivor could crush him while he's occupied holding the doors shut on another.
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The killer can't possibly protect totens and pressure gens. If you know he has undiyng, you keep baiting him getting near the totem and going away, ruin is not gonna do ######### if don't pressure gens. And if you know he's coming and you get easily downed, that's not a problem with the perk
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Sooo, they instead always hop in the locker because they know that it wil never be bad for them? In cases where Victor is n play, 90% of the time he is a considerable distance from Charlotee, making the grab pointless
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General "your"
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Guess you’ll have to learn a NEW way to play them. Darn
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Yep, its pretty egregious overall.
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I definitely agree that 10 seconds is a conservative value. After having played the Twins and using this new mechanic, it does feel a little useless unless you already have Charlotte standing in the immediate vicinity. If you've been chasing the survivor on Victor for any amount of time, you won't get to the locker in time to actually punish them. Then, it is back to being looped around the killer shack. Overall, it is a huge time sink for the Twins with little payoff. I definitely think that if it were given a slight buff to maybe 12-15 seconds, it could be a lot more viable. For now, I will probably just move on if a survivor hops into a locker in front of me unless Charlotte is already super close.
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A new way that is unviable such as 80% of the killers? Ok, sure.
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I think Midwich does have 4 god pallets but I refuse to learn that map since I hate it both sides
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You could be right, I can think of 3 that are pretty strong. Both basement pallets and killer shack. Upstairs school pallet probably should count too.
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First of all if you want to be taken seriously maybe don't type like you're ten years old.
Second. That's bollocks. Anyone who has ever played killer regularly at high rank knows that totems can and regularly will go down instantly in regular games and ruin especially does nothing against a really good team who are constantly on gens because the gens will never get time to regress. As for DS unbreakable not winning games I'm not even gonna bother showing the overwhelming evidence that it does because the evidence is everywhere for anyone to see.
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I've been having the most fun with the Twins. Super effective and strong when played well. I have never felt weak. My only complaint is that survivors shouldn't be able to do any actions with Victor on their back. Other than that, you guys did great with this killer. So unique. I love the two killer concept. BTW, there is still a bug when switching back to Victor - your camera is sometimes tilted.
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You keep using Blight as an example of Ruin and Undying being OP as if Blight isn't practically a 115 Nurse with 5 blinks when played optimally.
What about every single Killer who doesn't move at the speed of light and is countered by holding W? Yes, believe it or not, Ruin and Undying are next to useless on most Killers because, shocker, most Killers aren't Blight. They simply don't have the kit necessary to pressure gens and totems at the same time.
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I’ve got over 2000 hours on killer so yes, I’ve played killer regularly.
if a team is on gens constantly and they are never allowed to regress, then what are you doing as killer? Partying in the basement? Go pressure them off and get downs and hooks and pressure.
DS unbreakable shouldn’t be a game changer when ur playing killer unless ur actively tunneling or you get extremely unlucky in endgame, but it’s endgame then so the games fate is pretty much already sealed.
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It’s not like half of the killers have some form of map mobility? Billy, Freddy, nurse, spirit, demo,wraith, hag, twins.
Im using blight as an example because I’m showing you how lethal the combo can get on some killers. It’s still very strong on ur average killer because it negates a huge part of the game, gen regression. The perks literally do it all for you and you hardly need to worry about it.
If it’s not strong on other killers when why does the majority of killer players use it on every killer?
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Multiple of the Killers you mentioned either have extremely mediocre mobility enhancements or their mobility requires time to set up/can be dismantled, making it still easy to cleanse their totem.
Against Survivors who actually do gens, the Perks don't do anything for you unless you're playing a Killer who has high mobility AND high pressure intrinsic to their base kit. You can still only pressure one Survivor at a time with most Killers, and the other ones either doing bones or, better yet, just doing gens means your Perk combo is effectively useless. The counter to Ruin and Undying is literally just being an efficient team. If Survivors can get gens done without Ruin and Undying up, they can just as easily get them done with Ruin and Undying up.
Most Killers run Ruin and Undying because stall is absolutely necessary even against mediocre Survivor players, and Ruin and Undying are the best option for most Killers. That doesn't mean it's good. It just means that everything else is worse.
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You’re not taking into account any other things survivors have to do and other things killers can do. A hook/down immediately takes one survivor out of play. Then another survivor is forced to jump off their gen to go for the save, allowing the gen to regress TREMENDOUSLY. Then it’s not hard to go and chase/down one of the other two survivors or pressure them both. This isn’t even taking into account the slowdown which every killer power applies, Oni forces heals, stealth killers encourages heals and makes you jump of gens earlier and be more wary, nurse spirit and blight literally down survivors at insane rates that finding time to do gens is very hard, Freddy has insane passive slowdown, pig has head traps, trapper and hag require survivors to go out of their way to look for and pop traps etc etc. You see how much slowdown a killer has at base when they use their power correctly and you look at it?
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You're not taking into account the fact that just because one gen is regressing doesn't mean two more aren't being repaired, or how slow Ruin's regression actually is, or Survivors splitting up after an unhook, or Survivors wasting a Killer's time with immersion so the Killer gets nothing done, or Survivors actually knowing how to loop and use safe pallets and windows, or how none of the things you mentioned about heals or passive slowdowns are actually nearly that effective or true.
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If one survivor is hooked, then it’s not hard to go an pressure one of those two gens being worked on you treks about, like I said previously. Ruins regression is absolutely not slow, idek how you can think. If a survivor runs to a hook save and it takes say 15 seconds to run there, 16 seconds to heal and another 15 seconds to run back, that’s 45 seconds of ruin regress, which is 22.5 seconds worth of survivors progress down the drain, more than pop would take out of a gen. Sure you could say they don’t have to heal, but regression is still happening and now that survivor is vulnerable to being one shot by the killer and will have a much shorter chase.
At the end of the day, survivors are naturally forced off of gens all the time, and if not, then the killer isn’t doing their job properly. By the sounds of things you want a gen perk which baseline makes gens 30% slower or something without not requirements or anything.
”Survivors using immersion to waste killers time,” so we need to play like blendettes to beat ruin undying do we? That’s boring for both sides.
Reworked maps have a very limited number of safe places for survivors to run to, everything is fair game for the killer and can be mind games or played around. Plus there’s also half of the killer roster which completely counters looping or makes it a million times harder.
How are they not effective? You may not see the active results of slowdown but play a trapless trapper or something and you’ll see just how much faster gens pop without a killer power providing secondary slowdown.
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This argument is full of cherry picking (only stealth counters Ruin and Undying), outright falsehoods (reworked maps not having a large number of very safe pallets, unless we're talking about Ormond this is just outright wrong), and once again ignoring the possibility of Survivors knowing how to loop. You act like all Killers are this unstoppable force in a chase but the truth is, all the above scenarios where the Killer can "apply pressure" relies on the Survivors making enough mistakes to give that pressure to the Killer unless they're playing one of the three ez win Killers I mentioned before.
You can practically just sit at safe pallets and chuck them as soon as the Killer gets near and as long as other Survivors are on gens whenever this is happening, the gates will open in minutes. Or you can just hold W and most Killers have no chance of catching you. Wasting the time of most Killers isn't hard to do at all.
Ruin and Undying takes effect when Killers apply heavy pressure. But most Killers are so weak that Survivors need to make continuous mistakes for that pressure to be applied.
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Sorry but this isn’t 2016 dbd. There aren’t safe pallets at every corner of the map. You don’t NEED survivors to make mistakes in chases in order to catch them. That type of mentality will never allow you to down survivors fast,
Let’s look at Macmillan right? Potentially most balanced realm in the game. You have shack pallet, and that’s pretty much it. The next safest pallets you’ve got are jungle gyms and pallet gyms, but those are only truly safe pallets if the killer has let the survivor pull the pallet the way they want to or if they drop it instantly, which will get the survivors no where because now one of the few safe pallets is gone and the killer can rotate after a ten second chase which lead to a free pallet drop. All tiles a mindgameable, rock loops are mid gameable, shack is mindgameable, the boxes pallets are a fair game as if the survivor chucks em at the wrong time the killer can go around the side and just smack the survivor. Once again this isn’t taking into account survivor mistakes OR killer anti loops OR free hits from stealth and low TR killers.
Stealth is the only half decent counter you’ve given me which helps tackle ruin undying. Just do gens or just do bones is not a valid argument, especially considering all the scenarios I gave you which proved it wrong.
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Oppresion sucks and ruin undying is more balanced than ds unbreakable
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Lol
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Opression sucks? No it just takes skill and effort to use as opposed to easy mode ruin.
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So it’s objectivley worse than ruin? Plus it has a stupid long cool down,, it doesn’t take any effort to kick a gen btw
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He's not wrong the entire update was pretty awful for the killers. It opened a lot of bugs for the killers even killer related perks lmao.
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You hold 1 button and it triggers every 80s ruin you have 2 juggle 3 or all survivors while getting hooks and hoping they dont find your totem but oppression is better
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The whole point of this killer is that you can be in two places at once. Most maps take you 15-20 seconds just to cross the other side. With a 3 second switch time, you couldn't even get across half the map before they get out of the locker. It needs to be long enough so you can at least get to another part of the map. If not, then this killer will be relegated to just being a killer that can facecamp without facecamping, and it is going to be unfun.
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Why would you not have to juggle two or three surviovrs when not using ruin? And you don't need to hope no-one finds ur totem when you have undying, the odds of a team even good ones popping all the totems before you've snowballed is very very low.
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It takes effort to use it and time it right. You can't just kick a gen whenether and expect to get results from it. That's why I like it as opposed to ruin. Makes me think about how i'm using it rather than just chucking on ruin undying which allows me to not worry about gen regressions or anything. Literally makes me loose brain cells running it.
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So it’s worse than ruin
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Under certain conditions being any time charlotte is more than 18 meters away?!
You may as well not spent the time on this because it's still universally almost always better to just leave when they enter a locker. 10 seconds with the 3 second transition AND the fact that charlotte takes about 3 more seconds to be back to speed... It actually hurts killers because they waste time TRYING.
Also can we get another killer perk or 2 since survivors got 4 including hoarder?
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Omg... Killers got an obviously lopsided map slightly adjusted😧.
Yes we got oppression... Decent perk that has 0 synergy with other regression perks (ruin undying mentioned by YOU makes oppression non viable... You can't argue both 😂). And we even got hoarder for you survivors.
We're spoiled
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😆😆😂🤣🤣🤣🤣. Play killer? Like ever?
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An obviously loopsided map became a killer main's haven and a deadzone land, you think you can loop a killer at any of those filler pallets do you?
So ur upset that ruin undying, already an insanely strong and busted combo, wasn't buffed by opression? Opression isn't unviable, comparing any gen perks to ruin undying they will look garbage but that's because ruin undying is broken on a whole new level.
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comparing somethign to ruin is stupid because A) It's a gambling simulator and B) with undying it's broken beyond all other gen regresison perks.
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