How is Dead Hard still a thing that exists?
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Please don't make fun of me. It's really hurting that you say it with such arrogance. It doesn't even relate to this thread at all. I feel bad now..............
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"Yes you can. You can literally just run up to the killer and get hit for free. Being injured is NOT something you work for, unlike a hook. A hook requires you to chase a survivor, successfully down them, and place them on a hook. You cannot just get a free hook. Being injured is something the KILLER works for, not you. This makes LITERALLY no sense."
I mean, yeah, sure, it's a free DH, at the cost of a severely reduced chase. I dont see a problem there. What I am talking about is trying to keep the killer distracted as long as possible, THEN getting injured, THEN you get rewarded with a DH. If a survivor runs up to you for a hit so they can use DH is like being able to kill a survivor with Tombstone Piece because you hit the Obsession while using Dark Devotion. Both are essentially "free", but they do come at quite a risk.
Again, it's not free if you have to SACRIFICE something for it. Vigo's salty lips giving 3% extra luck on unhooking yourself isnt a free 3%. Using an Ebony Mori isnt a free instakill. You sacrificed something to gain that ability. Just like Dead Hard, you sacrifice something to gain something. The question is more at how skilled you are at actually pulling it off. So no, not free. Sure, it might take "less work" than getting a down, but it's still a perk that gives you an advantage for playing normally. That's why I compared it to Pop, BBQ and others. The reason YOU have an issue against it, is because it's used against you. That makes it annoying, not broken.
"something the killer has to do. You do NOTHING to get injured. I think you need to give up on this one."
No, it's something part of being survivor. Again, not a single match against a competent killer has survivors remaining uninjured all game. Becoming injured is part of being a survivor. It's up to survivors to find ways to avoid getting hit as long as possible, and find ways to use getting hit against the killer as much as possible. This is why good survivors dont drop a pallet if they suspect getting hit anyway and just hold W. Which, FYI, is more damaging to you than Dead Hard.
"Depends on which it is and what the conditions are + how strong it is."
Just. Like. Dead Hard. There are certain situations Dead Hard can be absolutely disgusting in how long they make a chase going, but in the majority of situations, it doesnt really extend the chase by much. Same with instadowns. There are many locations where they can be absolutely uncounterable(bubba with his chainsaw for example, or Spirit with Haunted active), yet, there are also many locations where those abilities arent that great anyway. Same for Dead Hard.
"You're punished for injuring survivors. You admit this by arguing that DH does not work if you're one-shot. You're not punished for "unsuccessfully baiting Dead Hard." You cannot bait a DH for distance. They will always get value out of it."
What is this logic? You're not punished for injuring survivors just as little as survivors are punished for not being able to finish a generator when you have Pop. Pop doesnt work on gens that are finished, so does Pop punish survivors for not finishing gens? In which case, making Pop punishing for survivor for not succesfully finishing their objective, which, is the same as killers not succesfully ending a chase?. And yes, you can bait Dead Hard for distance. It might only be 1-2 seconds of value that they get out of it, but 1-2 seconds of value for an exhaustion perk is terrible value.
Head-On gives a 3 second stun, meaning 3 seconds of distance gained. Smash hit gives massive distance as it includes a 2 second stun and perhaps a pallet break. Sprintburst pretty much always adds 10 seconds to chase time whenever its used. Dead Hard "guarantueeing" 2 seconds extra being a criticism is kinda laughable. Let alone that exhaustion inducing things exist, you literally cannot use Dead Hard if you're exhausted prior to a chase, while Sprintburst works before most exhaustion inducing things apply. Again, Sprintburst can do anything Dead Hard can, but better. More distance, not needing to be injured, works longer, can be a simple press of a single button either. So if you consider Sprintburst to be fine, Dead Hard is fine too. You just know how to deal against Sprintburst, but not against Dead Hard.
"You wouldn't say it's basically the same thing as another extremely awful mechanic that was removed for being busted."
In that case: remove thana, old dying light was removed because it's genprogression penalty was too powerful, yet Thana is still in game, and 4 stacks of Thana is very close to what old Dying Light used to do. Or remove Devour Hope, it gives you the ability to mori someone who has never been hooked. Or remove Resillience, as it reduces generator speeds back to 70 seconds, which it used to be back in the day but was changed. I can pull a massive list of awful mechanics that were removed from the game for being busted that still exist in a nerfed form. Dead Hard is a heavily nerfed version of pallet vacuums. Pallet vacuums could be used when healthy, dead hard cant. Vacuums could be used regardless of exhaustion, Dead Hard has an exhaustion penalty.
"just like spirit is fine because iron will, and NOED is fine because of small game. /s
as much as I actually really like mindbreaker because it's a simple, mid-strength passive perk, and do run it, no. I don't agree"
If you refuse to use perks against mechanics that you really hate, then its pretty much on you that you still hate the mechanic. If you hate Ruin, you use maps or perks to make getting rid of totems easier. I dont mind facing Dead Hard. Never really had issues with it, even if I faced high tier survivors. I do have issues with the auto aim system aiming for survivors that arent in the center of my screen, I do have issues with survivors being able to work on 3 gens at the same time without having any penalty added to it, I do have issues with dedicated hits that are more against my favor rather than in my favor, I do have issues with medkits being as powerful as they are. But Dead Hard? I wait 1-2 seconds if they look behind themselves and then start a lunge. Lunge animation lasts longer, Lunge animation makes more distance, thus I hit survivors at the end of the Lunge. If they save it for a pallet early on, I just break the pallet and see if it's worth to keep chasing the survivor. Sometimes its better to swap targets, keep in mind that some pallets are gone and that there is an increased dangerzone. Other times its best to keep brute forcing pallet drops, making the dangerzone even bigger and maybe getting a quick down. You're thinking too much about the 1v1 of the situation, while its a 4v1, and not all survivors will be aware that pallets are gone in an area.
"again, this would make sense if dead hard activated after X amount of time in chase. currently, it just activates even for shitter blendettes that get hit for hiding in a tiny bush. that blendette isn't being rewarded for anything lol."
Again, starting a chase injured massively reduces the chase time in general. Let alone that blendettes dont really use Dead Hard well anyway.
"it's not my mistake for injuring a survivor. this makes no sense. i injure someone as pig, recover fast with stbfl (a perk that I have to actively work for in order to be effective), am back on them again, about to lunge at them at a pallet, and they dead hard and stun me. woops, outplayed. guess that was my bad that they have a dash for free."
Again, you're talking this position, when you literally have a dash that you get for holding m1. You made the mistake of not considering their perks. Besides, it's not your mistake for injuring a survivor. Its your mistake for DEDICATING to a chase you know will last much longer than you can afford. There are more than 1 survivor, that survivor just used their exhaustion perk, they are likely to keep running around the map untill they find a generator to sit in, then it takes 40 seconds from the moment they touch that generator to lose their exhaustion. In that 50-ish seconds, you could be able to down a survivor, hook them and go back to the gen you expect them to work on, to find them injured, without dead hard available meaning they are a quick down. It's your DECISION MAKING that is lacking in this situation. You have to deal with survivor perks, just as much as survivors need to deal with your perks. Dead Hard isnt breaking any games in a significant way. It's strong, yes, but not overpowered. It's annoying, yes, but not broken. You're arguing from emotion, and sorry, but individual emotion doesnt mean #########. Pretty much the entire roster of killers can deal with Dead Hard. Pig and Myers are 2 that have a few issues, but that is due to them needing some balancing love, not due to dead hard being broken.
"all of these things that you've listed are either missplays on the survivor part or outplays on the killer part. it's also a little interesting that we're comparing a little survivor perk to entire killer power capabilities."
JUST LIKE YOU DECIDING TO HIT, WHEN A SURVIVOR IS INJURED AND LOOKING BEHIND THEM TO WAIT FOR YOUR LUNGE. THAT IS YOUR MISPLAY. IF I CAN DO IT, YOU CAN TOO. IT'S NOT THAT HARD.
"the last thing I think is acceptable is being forced to run perks just to make up for bad game design. running old enduring for old DS didn't suddenly make DS ok."
I mean, kinda did, you were literally able to hit a survivor before they could reach a loop. It also applied to pallet and flashlight saves, it was pretty much a killer meta perk at the time, just as much as DS was. Both needed to change, both have been changed. Dead Hard isnt like old DS tho. I dont run exhaustion perks and can deal with DH against high tier survivors just fine. Survivors have to deal with a lot more broken ######### than DH. Huntress being able to hit hatchets because your animation is locked, Bubba being able to hit you twice while you have BT and Sprintburst on you(seriously, Sprintburst is more powerful, and we're talking Bubba being able to hit you TWICE when using Sprintburst and having the 3 second haste boost after being hit), Spirit, Nurse, Oni and Blight flicks. Having Dead Hard available is one of the few reasons many of these killers can be as powerful as they are. Without Dead Hard. Bubba would only have 2 charges, Spirit would be nerfed into the ground, Blight wouldnt get more than 3 bounces, list goes on. The entire game has been designed with perks like Dead Hard in mind. The devs have admitted such. They dont look at basekit survivor, they dont look at basekit killers. They look at what survivors have access to, and what killers have access to. Considering everything that's in the game, Dead Hard isnt even close to broken. Odds are more likely that certain killers need to be buffed to the modern Meta. Myers is from an era where Dead Hard didnt exist. Pig is from an era where her headtraps used to activate regardless if the exit gates were powered, making Dead Hard not that big of an issue for her. The traps have been nerfed, but Pig hasnt been addressed to compensate for that nerf. Both killers need to be updated to more modern standards.
"decisive strike was meta for 4 years too."
And it has changed MULTIPLE TIMES. No one really had issues with DH. DH can be counterplayed. DH is an exhaustion perk. DH requires you to be injured. Just because some survivors play builds that make them perform better when injured doesnt really mean there is an issue with DH. My biggest guess why you think DH is an issue, is because survivors can finish 3 gens at the same time. Which is the real issue here, not Dead Hard.
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how come half the replies in this thread are actually just straight up lies? do people actually believe that stuff?
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Both second chances for playing badly that can cost the other side the entire match or be avoided.
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