Dbd is NOT ready for a SBMM system.
This system is going to fail with the current state of the game. I get that the idea is to get a better grip of the games balance through performance of players, but BHVR doesn't work fast enough to make it bearable. I guarantee there will be another dark period of the game where killers only go against meta slave key swfs and survivors only go against deathslingers, spirits and nurses. Both of which will be a response to one another. Because MMR will dictate that this is the highest skill level.
Dbds balance is only in a bearable state. It's not terrible atm because you dont always see the 4 slowdown perks or the exodia swf.
Since MMR doesn't count perks or items a 4 stack with DS+UB and a key will be considered skillful. A deathslinger with monitor, corrupt, ruin, undying and double reload will be considered skillful. Things that are so piss easy to win with and borderline unfair are now skillful and encouraged. Because you will reach a point where you have to use the meta to compete. Because the only way to fight fire in dbd is with more fire.
All this system is going to do is make que times longer because all the high skill players are going to leave until it gets removed. And those who do stay are going to be miserable.
Comments
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My body is ready and that’s all that matters.
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Ya know, seeing how many people that leave BMs at the door when playing say they had a good experience during the last test, while only those people throwing a tantrum over how unfair it is that bhvr won't just give them an iWin button... you might wanna rethink how you're playing this game when you are convinced it will be bad for everyone.
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This.
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I wanna get matched with people at a similar skill level & not get a dice roll for skill like matchmaking currently is now. How is going against people of your skill level a bad thing?
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Ask yourself this, if you were good as your main before they implement the change what difference will it make if you go against easier or more difficult survivors or killers, it will not make a big difference and if it does then you will know there is still more to learn.
Despite this you will most likely still improve or win. However, if you lose you will know your main slightly better and know yourself better. Best make peace with a decision beyond your control and prepare for whats next.
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There are not as many high skill players as you think there are. If they go, because they can´t stomp noobs anymore, then so be it.
The rest of the playerbase will enjoy the fair matches.
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If - and I don't believe this will happen - but if all high-skilled players left because of this, then I would assume they shouldn't have been at the top to begin with. Probably because they fear sweat-squads or sweaty killers (I hate the word "sweat" in this context, for the record) will expose their hidden weaknesses. However, if someone is paired against a really good player or squad, it could be becquse they themselves are of the same ilk. So, people of highest skill will face those of highest skill and so on, so forth. Those of middling skill will face equal skilled players as well. It really can only be better than the mismatches we're getting now.
Also, there's no way to know what is skillful, since the devs won't be releasing that information. But they have said it's a lot more than a simple win/lose ratio, so it will probably take into account chases, escapes, average game results of actions within, etc.. It's a lot more complex, and whilst getting a high sacrifice or escape count will have some bearing, it's going to take much more into account than that. Also, this idea of "meta" needs to stop being used as an excuse for being beaten. Perks are worthless if the player does not have the skill, and if I can have 4k's against great survivors with combinations of Brutal Strength, Deerstalker, Distressing and Unrelenting, for example, then certainly many others can if they actually experiment.
This new system can only be a good thing for balance. Maybe not for deliberate derankers or people wanting to look like wannabe gods by slaughtering newer or weaker players, but people who want fair games and to actually be tested against similar-skilled people will have a much better time of it.
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You realize when you say:
"BHVR doesn't work fast enough to make it bearable."
It implies that either way, things would never work out anyway. Yet here we are.
SBMM was great for me, I don't see why we have to stop everything because the 5% of players who are sweaty are gonna get sweaty together.
They are meant for each other. How is that a problem for the rest of us?
Also How does the new system encourage that behaviour? You will literally never see it the value.
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The game is definitely going to be based on meta, if killers and survivors are not going to run at least two meta perks, they are going to lose.
The game is going to become a ridiculous thirst, no different from shooting games of battle royales.
I hate this already.
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Not all of us care about winning- I can take losses. I just don’t like being paired up with 3 bad players and be expected to carry them against either a) rank 1 nurse or b) rank 12 camping/tunneling bubba. A few of those games you literally don’t even get to play.
At least with the current system the majority of my games are decent and I have competent like-minded survivors who do objectives, as opposed to the potatoes I get for teammates during SBMM.
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Personally I can't wait for it. I had a great experience with the last test on both sides. Yes my killer games were tougher, but I actually enjoyed the challenge and when I did win matches it felt like an accomplishment rather than winning against potatoes.
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Ready or not . . . here it comes! 😁
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This. It has been demonstrated repeatedly the devs make changes with the entire playerbase in mind, not just the more vocal "sweats" on both sides.
If it works correctly it'll provide more even matches for almost everyone, and keep the game in that party/non-competitive zone.
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Mmr is 5 years late, but better late than never. And also lol at Deathslinger being what people run against high mmr players.
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If you think so...
What's the point of posts like this? You think DBD devs will read this and say: "Oh this guy from the forum with 0 knowledge of the MMR implementation details must be absolutely correct, let's just throw the 2 years of MMR development into the bin."
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Its obvious you didnt read ######### i wrote then. This isnt complaining about "waaah its too hard". Youre generalizing the people who are against this way too much. "I" alone am not part of "the problem". Neither are the people who agree with me. The problem is that no matter what you do as an experienced player you are going to go against significantly less skilled players and lose just because theyre bringing the most unfair add-ons and perk combos to guarantee their win. Now, there's nothing wrong with this in general. Some people want to win the game more than others. That's fine. But there's a point to where what you bring is playing on ez mode. And anyone can bring it whenever they want. And the concern is that eventually people are going to just hit a plateau of people just playing ez mode against each other. And it isn't "oh just dont play that way and you wont get there" because you have to go out of your way to lose an uncertain amount of matches to get out of that mmr. You have to essentially shoot yourself in the foot to dodge another bullet. You are literally being punished just for playing the game and being good at it.
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agree, if the game was balanced it would but sicne is not, a competitive MM setting makes no sense to me. is a casual party game sometimes you get hard games, sometiems you get easy games, every killer is different and some opf them are incredibly strong and others extremely weak so unless they balanced all killers to be equally strong or something liek that and plus that the maps, tehre are maps incredibly strong and incredibly weak (or killer sided or survivor sided, hard to find a grey area with some exceptions and even then RNG comes to play in those sitautions were the map could of been a grey area results in another black or white) so yeah TOO MANY THINGS to consider before adding such a competitive MMR.
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This sounds ridiculously hypothetical.
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I get the whole noob stomping isn't fun but just imagine your in the upper echelons of dbd's skilled players and you have to face high quality players regardless of what build you want to explore. Imagine being locked into ruin undying on your killer because you played a couple of games with it and now are stuck with this build otherwise soak 5 loss games.
Tldr you better be willing to soak a lot of losses if you want to meme around and since that will derank you and screw you on rewards players will be more inclined to fight to keep there ranks playing killers and survivors builds that are cookie cutter strong meta builds. I saw what sbm did to lol and I see it happening to dbd. People say they want a skill intensive dbd game but when they realize the side effects and cost comes at a lack of diversity in characters and builds played, significantly more toxic environment where individuals turn on each other over losing then they start to realize maybe dbd is better as a casual fun party game.
Am I the only one who thinks pushing dbd to be more competitive and skill based might be bad for a game which is slow to update and a large rooster of characters who simply can't compete in the higher levels.
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Nice try. But look at the forum. YOU are the one who didn't read anything. Lots of people had good to decent experience with the system, citing a variety of reasons why. Only thing they all say about WHY it was better was that there were fewer tryhards.
And it's quite literally only the tryhards that are crying bloody murder right now, because they KNOW that if things go even decently right (and the game is actually good at doing things 'Decently right') they'll have to actually play and stray from their crutch-meta and BMs, or leave the game altogether.
So, if you are this upset, then, by evidence you are upset about the game not being ezpz for you anymore.
Been nice knowing ya.
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Better teammates = more efficient on gens = less time for killers to perform = more meta builds to compensate
Devs built the balance around potato skill, guess we'll see what happens when that element is segregated to the lower end of sbmm.
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I was playing a lot when we had a test period and as far as I know I had almost no situations where killer has disconnected or camped is such many circumstances as it is now.
On top of that I had a feeling that Im playing with smart guys who know this game and not bots. Ofc it wasnt always perfect but you cannot have ranking system of players' mentality - there will be always a rotten root somewhere.
Overal, I cant wait for this new SBMM system because this is boring at this point.
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I do not want to say it, but perhaps that is part of their monetization strategy. Instead of constantly deranking, climbing, deranking, PC players will be encouraged to buy smurf accounts and console, I think would need to purchase the licensed killers again? No idea. But Overwatch basically has that as their main source of revenue. Lol. Maybe DBD wants some of that dank double dipping?
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What exactly do you think the pip system was supposed to be?
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What is bothering me is the fact that if you play and win some matches with a meta build (full slowdown for example) you may lose the opportunity to play "fun build" with that killer because you will go against survivor that are at your "sweat", all out level and not your fun level.
But with that said i didn't play much recently so maybe i'm worried for nothing and there won't be many problem.
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BHVR said that the SBMM system brought balance to the game and that trials statistics had never been as good as with the last SBMM test.
You can't fight the statistics, if the average kill rate was 2 for every killers, it means the SBMM works great.
If you have lost most of your trials when the test was live then you didn't play at your skill level but higher. Your experience will then be fixed when the system will find out what is your real skill.
:)
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It really won't be so bad.
Especially for killers who have like 20ish different mmr ratings.
If you are scared of difficult matches just play killers on rotation. It will take ages before they all will be high mmr.
And it's safe to assume mmr will also drop if you haven't played a killer in a while so that makes it even less likely every single on of your killers will go against dead squads.
People are over reacting. As per usual.
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You can still play your fun build - what you are saying is: I wanna play my fun build and win. There's absolutely no guarantee you can play with a fun/meme build now on either side and "win". There will be nothing to stop you from playing your fun build with sbmm - except you.
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People are going to continue playing their favorite characters, using their favorite perks. The point of the new system is to decrease the frequency of squash matches. Good on BHVR for making that happen. There's literally nothing to complain about...unless you just want squash matches...which would mean YOU are a part of the problem 🤔
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You are somewhat right, and i think that maybe i didn't express my point good enough.
I'll take my specific experience to illustrate so it may not be worth a lot to weigh my point.
Let's say i use a meta build on doctor and get to my highest mmr with him.
There are also time where i enjoy playing anti heal doc with the game offering and watch some beginner self care for ages through the wall with nurse calling, even if a gen get done for free. With the new system, while playing doctor i will mainly go against player of my highest mmr, which mean that they probably won't heal much and focus gens because their playstyle is most likely ruled by the slowdown meta that most killer will be using, and now the build i have the most fun with while playing doctor is just a less effective build with the same player that won't do the one thing i want to see.
So, you are right, the thing that will be stopping me from playing fun build is myself, because i won't play a "fun" build just to have the match end in 6 minutes and get t-bagged at the exit gates.
You need to realise that wanting to win isn't the only reason some player want easier matches. By that logic player wanting a different mmr on every killer is just them wanting to win game with a killer they suck at, but the real reason is that they want to train in less stressfull matches and then slowly climb as they become more experienced.
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Since the first day it was clear that MMR was à bad idea (and too pricey fpr what they ciuld have done quicker and better otherwise)
In the 2 years pf developpment we STILL have the exact SAME questions over the MMR, it still is unclear what your rank/objectives etc is,
The game is not balanced enough for that and got way too much RNG
Games will only get more sweaty
But yeah, i guess the forum players that play the game à lot cant give any form of feedback (that will be ignored anyway) to some devs that dont seem to be above rank 10 and dont seem to play the game that much in the end
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It is absolutely not clear why it should be a bad idea.
Quicker and better? They should hire you then I guess.
You don't need to know the win conditions. They just use it in the end to create balanced matches and by balanced they mean that the most likely end result will be 2k 2e and there is no huge difference between "skill".
Not sure why RNG is a problem. Sometimes it is in your favor sometimes not. After a few games the bad and good luck averages out.
If by sweaty you mean no more easy 4k for killer or easy 4e for survivors then yes.
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I don't think anything could ever convince me to use the meta if I don't want to. If you feel the need to bring out the sweat to enjoy this game then maybe you should be put with others doing the same
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The interesting thing about change is that nobody is every truly prepared for a major change to a systme they are already familiar with. I think if this change doesnt occur now, when is the best time for it to release? With a game like DbD, it will never ever be completely balanced until new releases stop.
There is no intention of stopping releases any time soon and therefore the game will never be balanced, so when is a good time for the SBMM to be released?? For the game to be "more balanced" is a matter of perspective and opinion.
I think the only reason this project will fail is if they lose a large percent of their player base due to the change, however, the devs have stated that this system is way better than the old one. Is it perfect? No. Are you perfect? Probably not. But if it is believed to be better than what they are currently providing, what is the harm in testing the waters. If it blows up in behaviors face, they may choose to revert back, however I don't think they will
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For me it's completely reversed. MMR on has generally given me great soloQ teammates who coordinate very well, do gens, last a decent amount of time in chase...
Quite a few even forced the killer to target them when they could afford to get hooked and the others couldn't, which is generally not a thing you ever see outside of swf.
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You’re lucky man, some of us keep getting screwed over with bad teammates. Hopefully it’ll finally go right for me this time.
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Hope so!
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You can't see your MMR anyway so you won't really know if you're actually in high ranks or not. If you play the game with a casual mindset like you normally do then your MMR is going to mostly reflect that and if you think you're getting too many sweaties, just lose a few games and bump your MMR down, it isn't that different to what people are doing now with depipping into low ranks to get easier matches. The whole idea behind MMR is to make matches a little more even and while I can't provide hard data since only BHVR knows that I can say my experience with SBMM definitely felt more fair.
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Quicker and better: an easy rework of the current rank system while making pipping harder and spreading the points more in the 4 different categories to force Survivor to do more then just gens, leave = 1 pip
It would have been at least worth à shot, because people complain about how bad survivors or killers are still all gathered in the red ranks because of how pipping is super easy
Also having an MMR means competitive gameplay, and for that you NEED to know your objectives to rank up and down, why? Because of not, players will just take the basic objectives and rush through them as quickly as possible, so surv have no reason not to gen rush, and killer not to tunnel, which leads to an unhealthy and bad gameplay
And thus what i mean by "increasing the sweatyness" as people that wanna go high ranks will tryhard even more for that
Also RNG is a big problem for an MMr, imagine you wanna climb the "ranks" as you play, say, Billy, and now you see you are on a map lile Lery...basically you gotta play almost powerless, and this is one exemple over so so many, How Loops chain, which loops you got, which BUGS are gonna f over you
Beside since the system probably doesnt care which perks you got, add ons and map offerings...it will basically mean only strong addons and only strong survibor maps for high MMr as they can choose whoch map they wanna go in, and basically, why wouldnt you just play on your best maps?
MMR will also mean that fun build/certain killers will be less and less seen as you climb the ranks and face only the same 3 killers, 5 at best
Also it will not create à "perfect balance of 2 kills and 2 escape" the higher the MMR the more youll see that survivors can do the gens with minimal casualties and so make 4 escapes with very fiew hooks, unless you play the best killers with the best meta perks to even compete
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It is ready for MMR. See only Nurse and Spirit at high MMR? Other killers can be buffed to their level as a result. Sweating too much? You'll probably lose and go down in MMR so you don't have to sweat as hard. There's no downside to this system!
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just one thing i will have to disagree on:
you will not be seeing Deathslingers at high MMR.
yeah he is good at chases, but he is also slow and immobile, meaning that its impossible for him to keep up with the gens.
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No disrespect to anyone but have you seen the devs play this game? They are...not top-tier players.
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I don't watch them, so I don't know.
But in general, you don't need to be a top player to be able to create something for top players. Just think about sport equipment manufacturers, competition organizers, etc. Or another example, you don't need to be a top singer to be able to manufacture a great microphone for top singers, etc.
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Long story short, comment crying over people using perks, move along nothing to see here.
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Can´t wait for it to release. Because then the issues will be more obvious to everyone.
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I'm excited for it because I'll finally be able to use the other killers without getting stomped on since each has its own rank. Especially for achievements and variety of killer/perks. Im rank 1 killer. You'll never catch me playing the twins or trickster at my rank. Recipe for disaster. And im forced to play meta perks because of the swf /Gen rush
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There's no easy way to determine skill, via coding in this game. The biggest issue is everyone at the top is just gonna be Nurse, Spirit, Blight. It'll make an already stale meta the boring status quo where every game you're in it's the same pile over and over. You're gonna see the same perks in every game because they're the most abusable or the only thing that lets killers stall the game long enough to at least get a few hooks or some kind of pressure before the gens all pop and the survivors BM at the gate or teabag at the hatch with their key.
The fact that BHVR said they hope this helps them balance the game is laughable. They've proven they don't have a clue how to play their own game or how it's being played. The content all over twitch / youtube is similar, even their fog whisperers are sick of seeing DS/DH/Unbreakable in every game. Every time a new playstyle emerges or a mechanic is exposed as being either too weak or strong rather than fix it they just release more perks to address the issue and then those perks get ignored because the underlying problems were never addressed and the same meta we've had for years remains.
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All the more reason for SBMM to become a success. If people try newer killers with assorted perks, then it'll rank them with those. I randomize my build every time, and have beaten meta survivors, as they have beaten me.
The perks give benefits in different areas, and some people are affraid of using no more than a select few for some strange notion they'll be useless without them. Maybe if people want more chill matches, they'll be more experimental in their builds, or do no perk builds and meet similar skilled people.
Anyway, my experiences were tough, fun and it was clear that whatever builds were run that they were all the same skillset. Whatever they have done, it's been done well. And whilst some people aren't happy, some of those are probably the supposed "sweaty" ones anyway (I hate that term). For me, at least, it was a success.
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I just want to say, I love the term "Exodia SWF"
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