I genuinely don't understand why killers are playing like this

scenekidtrash
scenekidtrash Member Posts: 51
edited September 2021 in General Discussions

I'm sure this is not a new experience for many people since SBMM was implemented, but there have been a drastic increase in the amount of face camping and genuine tunneling killers I have gotten. SWF or solo queue, it really seems like every game. Before SBMM, it was once in every 10 games, it really wasn't that big of a deal to me. Now, it is literally every single game. I've started taking screenshots and posting them in my discord when I get face camped. It doesn't matter what perks I run. It doesn't matter what I do. Decisive strike, borrowed time, unbreakable, soul guard, dead hard, sprint burst, flashlight, no flashlight, medkit, toolbox. It genuinely does not matter: someone on my team or myself gets face camped to death or tunneled to death. I mean genuine tunneling. Like, going out of your way to not hit other survivors tunneling. Waiting out for BT tunneling. It's not even like these killers are getting "genrushed", they are genuinely face camping at 5 or 4 gens left. What is the big deal? I play killer a LOT, I have probably 2,000 matches on Huntress. I have NEVER played like this. Then they complain about their queue times going up. Do you understand that you are the problem? People complaining are the ones contributing to the issue. No one wants to play survivor when they get face camped every game. No one wants to play survivor when they get tunneled at 5 generators for no reason. My friends and I have contemplated just straight up quitting the game when we've all dedicated 2k+ hours into it. The better question is: why have the devs not addressed it? There's NO way they don't know what's going on. There's NO way they haven't been reading forum posts. I want answers because this is absolutely ridiculous. This game is rapidly going downhill because 50% of the playerbase wants to play like animals. Playing to win =/= playing like a jackass.

Post edited by Rizzo on
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Comments

  • IrishRedCap
    IrishRedCap Member Posts: 153

    2 specific reasons I can think of here.

    1) PInhead being the new killer his perks and kit are better designed to fight a 3v1 than they are a 4v1. It had led to many people tunnel a single person out in a game where they are pinhead or to abuse the perks to get rid of as many survivors as quickly as possible (thx to the new gen blocking perk [Deadlock that has drastically cut down gen rushing). It's encouraging, in my opinion, a bad style of gameplay that makes the killers appear sweaty as overweight trolls seeping in their parents basement. This in turn has made survivor go more, what i like to call, "offend the killer". Emoting, body blocking, holding game hostage for no reason (seriously seen many survivors that have no teammates on hooks just camp around 99% doors refusing to open them lately.). Tit for tat.

    2) MMR and SBMM encourages camping and tunneling. If it is in any way reading off the pip system as long as a killer gets brutal they have safety pipped and they're MMR won't drop drastically, if they get ruthless i imagine it grows as that is considered a win. Climbing quickly means lower skilled killers are getting frustrated hitting high MMR survivors and the only applicable way they know to deal with it is to camp. Honestly to cure this I think the EGC needs to be shorter and doors need to regress when left alone.

    Unfortunately I think BHVR is proud of the MMR/SBMM system and all the work they spent on it so I wouldn't expect to see any drastic changes soon. Maybe when the community revolts, or when they actually see a dip in sales/player base.

  • Sleem
    Sleem Member Posts: 182

    I felt like I seen this post a second time...

  • Sleem
    Sleem Member Posts: 182

    Glad to know I'm not crazy.

  • ObscurityDragon
    ObscurityDragon Member Posts: 710

    MMR means compétition and getting better ranks

    With no objective infos survivors just gotta escape and killers kill

    So they do just about that

  • malibu_barbie_26
    malibu_barbie_26 Member Posts: 79

    Camping/tunneling at 0-1 gens being done is not necessary. Camping /tunneling at 4-5 gens being done I can understand.

  • thisisntmax
    thisisntmax Member Posts: 231

    Campers actually rank up faster since rank is determined by kills.

  • ThiccBudhha
    ThiccBudhha Member Posts: 6,987

    Oh, yes, definitely. I was more talking about those people who face camp the first person they catch and refuse to leave. Proper camping is very strong.

  • scarletxxx666
    scarletxxx666 Member Posts: 5

    face camping is part of the game

    stop crying about certain tactics just because they annoy u

    camping is as valid as not camping

    camping counters gen rush also

  • Gwinty
    Gwinty Member Posts: 981

    I do not agree with 1.

    I think Pinhead is a good killer in the 4 vs 1 simply because you have your box and his perks. When you run him with only his baseline than you got Scourge Hooks which you want to apply to all survivor and Plaything. Both perks get their best value when you apply them to many survivors and even more in combination.

    Think about it: You end your first chase and pin a survivor to a Scourge Hook which also applies Plaything. This survivor is now pretty useless. He is mangled and has to heal because he no longer hears your heartbeat to evade you. After healing he is slowed down quiet a bit.

    Meanwhile another survivor has to carry the box to delay the chainhunt. Leaving out only 2 to do generators normaly, 1 of them should be chased by you. As such only one survivor can work on a generator normaly. After your second down this accelerates even more and this is not considering you getting your own box.


    Tunneling one survivor out would basicly deny me all value from my Hex: Plaything and Scourge Hooks: Gift of Pain.

    Juggeling if far more effective and also more fun for the survivors.


    With number 2 I agree. I think that deranking in the SBMM should go faster than ranking up and safety pips should be reduced. Killers have to be punished for camping a survivor to death just to get 1 kill. This however can still be implemented. I think BHVR qill monitor their system and tweak it here and there maybe even without us knowing.

  • psionic
    psionic Member Posts: 670

    Toxicity pushes people to play sweatier.

  • Myla
    Myla Member Posts: 1,551

    Game isn't going downhill.

  • Squirrel_Thicc
    Squirrel_Thicc Member Posts: 2,677
  • Smoker101
    Smoker101 Member Posts: 52

    I honestly have no problems with killers camping, tunneling, or face camping. What I have noticed from my experiences is that many survivors don't want to help the guy that is on the hook. Do as many gens as possible before the person on the hook hits stage 2, then trade with them. Everyone can escape using this strategy. And if the killer is tunneling, them take hits and body block to help the survivor escape. It isn't that hard.

  • IlliterateGenocide
    IlliterateGenocide Member Posts: 6,025

    agreed. tunneling and camping are necessary sometimes. camping at endgame to secure kill. tunneling mid to late game to catch up. tho I will agree with the poster that camping and tunneling early game is not necessary and a little crappy. but all saying do what you want.

  • Apollos
    Apollos Member Posts: 1,052

    I haven't noticed much of a change. I've been having matches like this since before the anniversary event.

  • IrishRedCap
    IrishRedCap Member Posts: 153

    I've been sick the past few days so my comments might be a little off kilter. Pinhead kit and perks are optimized in a 3v1. The most common occurrence in a 4v1 against Pinhead with his base perks and base kit would result in 1 survivor being chased, 2 doing gens, and 1 finding/solving lament configuration. This is by no means detrimental to Pinhead, I think he can and does play well in this situation.

    Compare it to his strength in a 3v1 though. In a 3v1 you would optimally have 1 in chase, 1 on gen, 1 finding/solving box. Plaything becomes much stronger by forcing a totem hunt or stay oblivious. Deadlock massively slows down remaining gens if the 2 survivors decided to split and ignore box. Scourge hooks also punish 3 survivors exponentially harder than 4.

    In short, trying to clarify my first response. Pinhead kit appears, in my opinion, optimized for a 3v1. For newer killer players that decided to buy Pinhead it would be a noticeable difference how their experience becomes a lot easier in 3v1 over 4v1. This will encourage the bad gameplay of tunnel 1 person out and always excel easily with an optimized killer.

  • GoodBoyKaru
    GoodBoyKaru Member Posts: 22,791
  • Shaped
    Shaped Member Posts: 5,870

    So how would you people punish camping/tunneling?

    I don't see any way to make it work except survivors punishing it together.

    Just don't suggest things that were tried before in the past and abused.

  • scenekidtrash
    scenekidtrash Member Posts: 51

    Don't let killers pip off of camping and tunneling. It's literally that simple. If you are camping and tunneling the ENTIRE match, you shouldn't be allowed to pip/gain MMR from it. The new SBMM system rewards that playstyle because a 4k=win=more MMR. However, when you get to the higher MMR players, they will legit just sit on generators and not give a crap about the hooked survivor. You will lose that game and get frustrated. If you play in a non-scummy way (get more than 4 hooks total) and get a 4k, you deserve to pip and increase your MMR because you are legitimately winning your match. People who face camp and tunnel KNOW what they are doing is messed up, they just don't care. It isn't even fun for the killer to do that stuff because they just sit in the same spot the entire match until someone dies.

  • Shaped
    Shaped Member Posts: 5,870

    While I agree that piping with killers is alot easier than solo q, I am not sure piping is that important since sbmm.

    You said it yourself, it is all kills/escapes now to boost your mmr.

  • JohnWeak
    JohnWeak Member Posts: 854

    Will tell you. First i'm not a killer main. I'm a good killer but not awesome. I'm a really top survivor though.

    When i play killer, if i play fair, i got gen rushed, spammed with flashlight/"insta" heal... and at the end, when i have one kill only they call me noob :)

    So now i play terribly, i come back on saves, down again the unhooked survivor, slug to get another one down etc... Most of survivors are toxic and they do this in group.

    They are so ######### that they go with 2 flashlights, 2 insta-heal; blinding you at every pallets. What do you expect when the majority of the community behave like this ?

    Community is toxic BUT BHVR is also responsible for all this. Why is it still possible to bring so many items and broken same perks for all the survivors in high MMR ?

    I mean, facing 4 good loopers with DS, BT, DH, really ? And this with the standard map layout with 12 pallets, 5 windows, 2 semi-infinite loops.

    You see, BHVR does nothing about it and it looks like they never will.

  • DieGräfin
    DieGräfin Member Posts: 227

    Like Scott says, I think the community is fault for this behavior. More and more are playing unfair or sweaty because they want to increase the MMR. A value that you can't even see. It really got worse, but nobody cares. My conclusion is that I play less. Also because of the rank reset. DC'ing or self sacrifice too. If you can't lose a pip it's like a big welcome gate ...

    My thoughts 😀

  • KerJuice
    KerJuice Member Posts: 1,902

    @scenekidtrash what Rank were you before SBMM? I’m assuming Red or at the very least hovering between high purple to low red (6-3)?

  • Tostapane
    Tostapane Member Posts: 1,651

    Dude, things goes in both ways, don't think that it's only killer's fault... Since they have implemented the new mm, I don't even remember the last time that I had a chill match without toxic survivors carried by the usual meta build and BNP, instaheal and keys...

  • JohnWeak
    JohnWeak Member Posts: 854

    Ye, as i have said, i play both side and i haven't seen so many items since SBMM is out. In every trial, all survivors are bringing an item. I often see 2 flashlights and sometimes 2 medkits full equipped with purple or rose addons.

  • Avignon
    Avignon Member Posts: 133
    edited September 2021

    Before i go on a rant i do have to say "face" camping is often caused by the survivors themselves. The easiest possible games you can have as a killer is vs altruistic lemmings. Like someone will go for a save immediatly, obviously, trade, then the survivor that just got unhooked will "loop" around the tile near the hook, instead of getting distance, near a gen with ruin on..... like i won't even TRY to mind game in this situation , just run the "genius" around the hook, force a stage two / another trade.

    Second face camping is a HORRIBLE strategy, the instant you see this happen you either a) recognize you have the perks to prevent this or b) go prove yourself on gens, yes one person will die, the killer will depip. Also if you're really REAAAAALLY worried about face camping i present to you the most OP perk in the game.... Camaraderie.

    Third "PROXY" camping on the other hand well..... welcome to MMR. If you watch any single competitive match you'll see tunelling / proxy camping is pretty much the norm, and commentators will be fairly puzzled when a killer DOESN'T tunell. Personally at my MMR i'm hitting the "all DH DS UB IW" lobbies of legends, the ones everyone whined about tho they weren't really running rampant. NOW i'm more surprised if my lobby ISN'T full meta survivor build, swap prove thyself in and out as convenient....

    Patrolling gens is not a thing vs good survivors and you should know this on your 2000+ games of killer. 3 survivors with 2 braincells to rub together between them will be slamming away at gens every 10-20 seconds you go for a hook add in the time to find another chase after a hook that noone is going for and you've lost 3-4 gens after 2 hooks - and i wouldn't even call that 'genrushing'

    Best way for killer to play atm is pray to the Entity you get a hook before your first gen pops, trade the first unhook, slug the guy that just got off and then patrol that quarter of the map, hitting survivors that are coming in for the save a good 20 meters away from the hook / slug. Ofc all this works untill the slug unbreaks himself unhooks the other dude and everyone scatters off to reset....


    PS: I will say one thing about SBMM / MMR - i'm getting NICER survivors. I seem to be at that MMR where survivors are fully AWARE of the bullshit they can pull off and actually have no problem with "camping" / ######### killers. Many games i've had since SBMM hit that i was thinking "whelp, here comes the racist report train! Choo choo!" only to be greeted post game by gg's. I've prolly seen more "ggs" from survivors in the last week than in the last 5 years.....

  • IronKnight55
    IronKnight55 Member Posts: 2,947

    Survivors should punish this kind of playstyle, but it's still terrible for the person on the hook. They just had their game ruined and nothing they can do about it. Most killers that facecamp probably don't care about escapes or points. They do it to ruin the game.

  • NaigEtarip
    NaigEtarip Member Posts: 60

    Obviously if you advocate for a singular definition of fun you are not going to understand others...

    In fact if a player is playing however he wants while not giving negative connotation to others playstyles or choices is probably less toxic than you.

  • PigMainBigBrain
    PigMainBigBrain Member Posts: 1,893

    Welcome to the reality of DBD's balance. Any time killers are pressured and forced into the dogshit that is red ranked play (and I mean actual red ranked play not the previous boosted ass survivor with a red 1 by their name, you can no longer be a boosted survivor) you start to realize just how imbalanced this game is. So all those "MR NICE GUY" strategies and that made up bullshit fake rule book survivors like to tote around, goes out the ######### window. Camping and tunneling are back on the menu when the pressure is this high.

    Now me as a killer player, I think its gross, and actually enjoy some of that "Mr Nice Guy" rule set. But also me as a killer player, I 1000% understand exactly why so many killers are doing it. And I'm not even mad at it, given this games stances on balance and leaving things unfavorable for so god damn long and being lazy enough to only look at "IMPERICAL DATA!" Instead of look at what the players are actually experiencing since WE ARE NOT ROBOTS, EVERY GAME, AND KILLER, AND PLAYER, ARE DIFFERENT!

    Its hard to play the "NICE GUY" game when the odds are stacked against you so high.

  • thrawn3054
    thrawn3054 Member Posts: 5,897

    What you just described is the definition of understandable though. That's an actual tactical choice. Alot of times camping isn't tactical, it's just ######### trying to ruin others games.

  • Brokenbones
    Brokenbones Member Posts: 5,169

    Remove map offerings

    Survivors players abuse them

    Killer players abuse them

    They have no reason to exist.