There are 25 killers... and only 3 of them are truly viable. What fantastic balance
Listen, I completely understand its a survivor meta right now. In fact, no matter what meta we are in. There is no shot that over 50% of the killers will be viable at a time, at any time in this games life span. Just due to how the game functions. But only 3? It is really pathetic at this point. Only 12% of the killer roster is viable. That being Blight, Spirit, Nurse. Other killers like Pig, Legion, Trapper, etc. ESPECIALLY are just in very sad states. I do not want this killers to be viable, I do not expect them to be. Like I said I expect only like half the cast to be viable while the current C-D tier killers to stay unviable. But for gods sake can you at least make them playable with some small changes?? Trying to play these C-D tier killers at high MMR is just not possible, going against high rank survivors that understand the simple tactics to mitigate the value the killers power gets just proves just how weak they are. Playing an M1 killer against them when they know how to maximize times at every loop meaning you have to leave tons of chases as there is no way you will not waste 3 gens worth of time trying to catch them. especially on maps like Red Forest, it is NOT possible to NOT play one of those viable 3 and being able to end chases and rotate gens on maps like Red Forest in high MMR . and many others, Red Forest is just the biggest offender. They are plenty of small tweaks that could be made to the other 22 killers to help them especially the ones towards the bottom, with pillars of the community and content creators making 2 hour longer videos suggesting changes in detail. and many others suggesting improvements to at least think about. But after all this time I see killer after killer just get forgotten and left to rot. Very disappointing. I took an almost 2 year break expecting the devs to somewhat fix my main, Legion and Legion is still bad on my return about 2 months ago...how?
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Small tweaks aren't going to change 90% of the killer roster. Lol.
There is not even a point to slightly change killers to be perfectly honest. Qol changes are nice, but it would be easier to just wait and hope the next killer is usable.
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I would rather they just build on what they already have instead of just cash grabbing and pumping out DLC after DLC hoping something sticks. and no, while small tweaks wont make killers nurse level. It would still help them
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Nurse is probably 60/40 in my experience. The other day, while rare, we all escaped a Spirit who was using survivor pudding. Blight's gotten up there but so has Wraith, regardless of how many killer mains want to protect him from criticism. Hag and Ghostface are still super sneaky, cheap killers. People main Trickster enough to be decent with him now. Pinhead is doing fine. I've seen people killed, or been killed by, everyone from Deathslinger to Demogorgon. Leatherface is still guaranteed to get at least one kill, especially if he camps like he pretty much always does. I get 4Ks with Doc on a regular basis.
My point is that this is anecdotal but no, I disagree that only a negligible percentage of the killers in this game are effective.
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I would rather they just build on what they have instead of just cash grabbing and pumping out DLC after DLC and hoping something sticks. and while small buffs will not make killers viable, It will still help them overall/
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The best course of action imo is to nerf the top 3 and then balance around that instead. Much easier than making every killer nurse/spirit strength
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No. The content "creators" have spoken. BHVR must do as they say.
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We would have to nerf the survivor side very heavily as well, as they are only viable because they are the only ones strong enough to stand a shot vs high MMR survivors. but it could work yeah. I can agree to an extent
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How is Ghostface sneaky and cheap, but Myers and Pig are chill? What is the difference?
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Bhvr don’t listen to content creators. Not even their own fog whisperers like otz
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This sounds way too reasonable.
but I guess at least in Nurses case she is just too different from the rest of the killer cast to actually balance her to the general level.
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Perhaps,your MMR not Extremely high.
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All I said was that they made suggestions and BHVR should think about some their ideas that they bring to the table, not immediately send them live. Making this seem bigger than it actually is lmao
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Yeah I’ve alway wanted nurse to be more balanced but I can’t think of any reasonable way to do it
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I didn't specify that they aren't, in fact I agree that Myers is sneaky and I generally don't enjoy facing him. In fact I generally don't enjoy facing any killer that can just turn off their terror radius, one of the few allegedly guaranteed tools that a survivor is supposed to be able to defend themselves with. That said, I think that there's more to Pig (the reverse bear traps) and Michael's power is at least rooted in fidelity to the character. Ghostface is just the "turn off the TR, creep in the grass, and get one-hit down" guy. No offense to anyone who uses him (including yourself, I presume, as you have him in your avatar), but I just don't think that there's a good balance between what is required for what he's able to accomplish. I can respect that he's not as easy to use as some other killers but I still find him cheap.
I know (or at least have heard). That was just one of my jabs at the worshipful nature that the community at large has towards "content creators" (AKA people who play this game a lot and thus are assumed to know what's best for it).
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Perhaps. If that's the case I'm glad for it, it seems like everyone who considers themselves to be high MMR is miserable.
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Nurse need 500~1000 hours pratice, I think nerf nurse not fair to nurse main.
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Yes she does need practise but that doesn’t excuse her game breaking capabilities
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I was just curious because I put all three in the same category, myself. I use them all. Personally I feel like Evil Within is way easier to use because survivors cannot break your power by looking at you and I can mass slug, and I find Pig to be more "cheap" because of rng. So I just personally found it strange that you specified Ghostface as I always say him as the more "honest" of the 3.
Either way, I see where you are coming from. At least Myers and Pig kind of have conditions to remove their radius and their powers are finite with some tradeoffs.
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So if survs needed to have more than 500 hours practice to get to the overpowered level they are said to be it wouldn’t be fair for survs to get nerfed and the state of survs is fine?
Post edited by Mooks on1 -
To be fair I have a bit of objective difficulty separating Pig from Ghostface since they are, in fact, very similar in several ways. I guess for me it's the fact that Ghostface is pretty much all silence all the time, whereas Pig's powers require her to make noise. Also the secondary element of her traps which add more strategy (in my opinion anyway). Plus, some of it is admittedly confirmation bias because I see Ghostface probably eight times more on average than I see Pig.
Don't get me wrong, I think that very, very few killers in this game are simply "pick up the controls and start your killing spree". I'm sure that to use him effectively takes time and effort. The cheapness I speak of refers more to how unfair it feels to be trying to get through a match only to suddenly be ambushed out of nowhere by a silent killer that can hardly be seen.
I know, I know. One of these days I'll start running Spine Chill. :P
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How many killer can you play? twenty one
How many Survs can you play? lamo
Nurse almost counter SWF 3Q 4Q finally insurance.
If one game can counter SWF group remain 3 killer,that is pathetic.
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Post edited by fitch on0 -
I genuinely don’t completely understand what you are trying to get at here.
but for the record: @Phasmamain has stated those 3 viable killers should get balanced to the level of the other killers AND THEN the game should be balanced according to that. Meaning that you shouldn’t have to use a certain killer to counter 4 man SWF.
but sure..if you think it’s good g ame design needing to have 500-1000 hours practice on the one killer while almost all others stay not-viable you are entitled to that opinion.
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The devs don't think killers like Legion or Pig are weak because statistically, they aren't. Obviously, if you look at it from an "actually play the game" perspective, yes, they're weak.
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Just bad survivor stay not-viable ,not all others .
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RIP Billy
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Yes almost every killer is "effective" at Low MMR. Im talking about high MMR here dawg
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Considering every content creator I know didn't want MMR and have been very vocal about it but it still getting added just proves your assumption is wrong but please, go on.
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Not every killer has to be an S rank. It's not about scoring easy 4ks every game, but making killers with unique power so the game wouldn't become boring.
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Killers should not be powerful. But all of them needs a passive slowdown like Nemesis and Pinhead.
There is no fun from getting down in 10sec vs god Nurse/Spirit. And everyone rush Gen so hard before 1 death at 1 Gen left, incase Killer decides to tunnel/camp into Noed.
The game is unbalanced to watch between a survivor down really fast, or having a survivor at Aayrun,Zubat level.
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Because there's no actual way to balance her, since basically she sets the power level. She doesn't need nerf, she needs a rework.
And yeah, yeah, I know Nurse mains will start yelling, but that's true sadly, you cannot make content, that breaks fundamental rules of your game. For example; in MTG there's a rule that you can have max 4 copies of each card in your deck, BUT they've made cards that said 'you can have unlimited amount of this card in your deck'. And long story short, in one of the formats you can really break the game so quickly with it. Or even better - players have turns in order - player A than B than A (or A, B, C, A, B, C, depending on number of players) etc. And there are cards that say 'take extra turn'. It's not only not fun to play against, not only not interactive, but extremely, extremely powerful or even extremely overpowered.
And going back to Nurse, she also breaks the fundamental rule - walls, as silly as it sounds. And yes, it's possible to avoid her blinks, but dodging her has nothing to do with game mechanics, you don't have a 'dodge' button or something. Game is painfully basic when it comes to the movement and defense against killers that survivors have are pallets and vault mechanic - both next to being useless against the Nurse.
I think she should've been reworked completely and then as the power level of the best killer drops, some changes to other killers, perks could be made to make stuff that's now 'not meta' more viable. But I think if Nurse stays the same it's going to be progressively more difficult to create killers that can be 'competitive' and by competitive I just mean viable on higher MMR.
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Totally agree. I’ve been trying to find ways to rework nurse for awhile but I don’t want another Freddy situation where it doesn’t please anyone. I think maybe making her a power burst style killer could work where her blink needs to be earned could work
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It is kind of crazy when you think that only three killers stand a chance of competing against a top tier survivor team. Even then they can still lose depending on perks, maps, gen spread etc.
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I mean I'm not sure why someone should ever care about people who waste this much time into one killer. Especially one that people learn so they can win every game except vs comp.
More than the top 3 are viable. You are not facing comp teams in public games. You can win most of the time with even mid-B tier comfortably if you take the time to learn them.
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Thats a bit exagerated. Trapper is viable and he always was, you can end games really quick if you placed your traps right. To the contrary of what you said more than half the killers are viable.
The only ones that feel like a pain to play are Pig and Legion against competent survivors of course. And gen rush its a problem that affects every killer not only the weakest ones.
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No reason to, you already missed the point.
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What point did I miss? You imply that if content creators want something, it happens, not a single content creator that I know wanted it.
What point did I miss? Or do you just say that when something is provably against what you say?
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Every killer is viable in any ranks it's u who's isn't able to play them correctly
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nice bait buddy, made my morning
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Once it's bait you'll know it, just watch otz and streamers like him getting 4k's each match with any killers they play you wonder why's that? Oh it's because he practiced and has invested his time into game instead complaining on forum and I'm playing trapper and Demo only and I get 4k 97% of times and they are considered lowest tier killers... So instead typing how unplayable they are on forums go and practice with them
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double good bait. even otz himself that you praise so much has said that a handful killers are not viable and need help. also where are you pulling that 97% stat from? can i see proof, thats a very exact number.
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Otz literally got over 100 streaks with most of killers even the ones y'all consider lowest tier which just proves he had to play 100 games around 1000 hours to lose once... With the killers u said that aren't viable... So instead blaming devs and everyone else for ur lack of skills practice more complain less
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Then go watch Otz making tier list and explaining why half the killers are unplayable against decent suvivors not to mention competetive teams.
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exactly ^^
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I did and he never ever said the word "unplayable" you're making ######### up at this point he just sorted killers based on their powers which is right thing because there's stronger and weaker killers but he never said they aren't viable he got 50 wins on blight and 50 wins on trapper aka same number of wins with one of strongest killers in game and with one of weakes if not the weakest killers in game
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Win streaks don't mean diddly squat. Even Otz will tell you that. He just does them for fun.
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Not every killer has to be top tier. You can play any killer you want and will eventually settle into a good MMR ranking. I think every killer has a niche and could perform in the right hands. Scorpionz is great with Pig. Doctor and Huntress get fairly consistent kills. Cenobite, Ghostface, Bubba all perform decently as well.
Even Trickster and Twins can be viable. It depends on the playstyle and build tbh.
Dont forget Wraith. He's been getting so much traction lately and I bounce between him and Doctor as my mains
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but what if i want to hit max MMR? I do not just wanna sit at "good" and be content because im playing a weak killer like Legion. I wanna hit max, but the balance of the game makes it impossible.
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So make the game more survivor sided for how many months while they decide to balance?
Imagine the uproar...i have friends that are only holding on to playing killer because of these 3.🤣
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I've played solo for over 4 years and all killers are STILL a threat to me and will kill me if I don't play well or keep out of trouble.
Blight, Oni, Hag can all beat good survivors and are completely 'viable'
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