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K so huntresses is some wanna be twins now cause this atrocious build
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Shadow step will counter BBQ, but you can't rely on it due to its boon nature. Let me reiterate the different things you can do to handle BBQ and Chili that work in any situation.
-Go in a locker. Obviously, Iron Maiden makes this a bad idea.
-Pretend to do one thing for the 4 seconds after the survivor is hooked, and then do something else. Work on a gen for 4 seconds and then run away. Run in one direction and then run in a different direction. If the killer chooses to head towards you - and they're over 40 meters away, so your scratch marks will be gone by the time they arrive - they'll enter an empty zone and waste time looking for you.
-Hug the edges of the killer's TR so that you don't show up.
-Using your knowledge of the killer's location from where the down happened, crouch behind a generator to obscure your aura.
And, again, there is always the option of not caring about BBQ and instead accepting that it's likely the killer will approach you, and using this information to plan your next move. Is your gen going to be popped or can you commit to it and finish it? What's the best escape route from your current location, and is there a good tile nearby? If you hear a TR, the killer's coming. If they don't come, odds are high they went after someone else, so they'll be in a chase soon if not already.
Lockers are only one of BBQ's counters. The only time I would consider them the best option is when you're on a gen that's well on its way to completion (survivors on gens are high priority targets for BBQ, and for a gen close to completion, you don't want it to be interrupted.) Otherwise, you're better off tricking the killer with your aura read. Same amount of time wasted on your part, but higher chance of wasting the killer's time instead of sending them straight to somebody else.
As for flashbang... some things in this game counter other things. That's just how it works sometimes. You can still use the perk, there's just an added element of risk to it. Try going in lockers to activate it when you know the killer is chasing somebody else and not close to your location. Super easy in a SWF; in solo, since this is Huntress, you can wait until you hear the sound cue for hatchet shots, do it right after someone is downed or right after an unhook that occurred soon after a down, or check if the obsession is being chased on the HUD. And if you can't hear the lullaby, she's at least 45m away.
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Here is a pro tip to hide from BBQ against a huntress.
Tip 1: stand inside her lullaby, it's 45 meters, BBQ is 40 meters, meaning if you are inside her lullaby, you just need to run for 1-2 seconds inward and you wont be seen.
Tip 2: crouch behind generators that arent finished yet, you cannot see aura's through aura's
Bitter Murmur is better than BBQ on huntress since you cant hide from it. Huntresses running BBQ give up guaranteed information for some BP.
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Its cool again really when it comes to swf nothing really bothers me on what a killer uses or not, its more annoyance in randoms , you and everyone am sure know this, see people complain on SWF so much but ofc it makes more sense swf is powerful, you can know things and make a plan to counter pretty much anything, random now says alot of difference until they put voice chat which will be a mass help of solo queue, not saying you but those who QQ about SWF so much like really. I wont be found for an example but every second you got a potato dropping like a fly in 10 secs its urking. Thanks though appreciate it , the unfinished gen part was quiet a interesting thing you mention ill will do that.
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no, look at the comment GrayEyes was responding to, that was advice from me to counter that combo.
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no problem.
happy to help! :)
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Hm, true. I wouldn't call it runnable - I haven't ever seen a Bubba with it, pre or post MMR, but it does cover a weakness. Though the locker tech is hard to do... it's probably different at top MMR, but most everyone who's tried it on me has jumped into the tail end of the tantrum or I grabbed them out. It takes a very fine timing to pull off. How often does this happen in his chases? Bamboozle seems like it'd be way more useful on the regular.
Though following that thread, IW is also better than usual on Doctor because his static blast encourages survivors in his TR to step in lockers when they've guessed he's about to use it. It counters people trying to evade his baked-in detection, and survivors are more likely to exit the locker while he's still nearby because of the presumption that he doesn't think anyone is in the area (and one bonus is that solos can't tell he has Iron Maiden - Doc makes survivors scream all the time, it won't make anyone think "hey, why was there a scream without a health state?"), but it's still a weak perk compared to other things he can run.
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Good killers dont cry complain about all you just posted. Get better snuff the boon out, fake the dead hard out just get good, my you love swearing its cute it sounds like your the angry one xD. Let me tell you this last statement since you and most seem to not read something cleary, I do not give two cents about what killers bring when SWF we always will counter whatever they plan or find a way to work it out , the complaints I make is it having to do with random queue, get it? SWF there is 0 reason to have complaints about anything. How do you communicate with randoms with a no voice built in feature? So get the facts now.
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Boons having a stronger effect than Ruin, thats heavy grasping tho. You dont really need to do anything to gain any value out of Ruin. Survivors would literally need to never leave gens and never do totems to not give you any value. Once they cleanse Ruin, it already gave you value.
Boons require quite a lot of good decision making, timing, placement and coordination between survivors to gain value, and even then, if it's easily accessible, it would be gone before you gained value out of it. Boons need to actively be used multiple times to gain value, Hexes are pretty much guaranteed to give you value. Boons are strong, but they are only as strong as survivors can manage to make them, just like Self-Care(dangerous in the hands of good survivors, practically a 5th killer perk in the hands of the average survivor). Not even coming to the fact that Boons are nowhere near mirroring old Undying. Old Undying with Ruin literally meant you didnt need to defend your hexes untill you saw an aura, at which point, it was a 50/50 of it being Undying or Ruin. If it was Ruin, another 50/50, assuming they could find it. You as a killer could ignore the vulnerability that hexes are supposed to have and just focus on getting people off gens, while with Boons, survivors have to actively stop their objective to set up boons and use it multiple times for it to start having some value. Old Undying didnt have risk, worst case scenario for you, survivors needed to cleanse 2 totems to get rid of ruin, best case scenario, they needed to cleanse all 5 and couldnt find the 5th. Boons do have a risk, worst case scenario for survivors, they wasted 14 seconds to set up something that got removed, best case scenario, the killer is actually visually impaired and doesnt see survivors run to the same area to heal up or refuses to accept the fact that Boons are a thing.
Not even talking about ways how Dead Hard is counterable.
As for NOED, you're forgetting comms. Good survivors with comms have no issues countering NOED. That is why NOED is a problematic perk. It's a perk that's extremely strong against solo survivors, but weak against SWF.
I do agree with most of that you said prior to this, as this guy is complaining about Iron Maiden because it counters BBQ(guess he hasnt seen Iron Maiden on a Doctor who uses Whispers yet). But you should have stopped before you jumped into personal bias.
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I have been running Iron Maiden on Bubba a few times. I am not a very good killer by any means, I am probably not on high MMR, but Iron Maiden has helped out tremendously on my Bubba.
It is one of those perks that people do not really expect, but work surprisingly well. Another example of this is HEX: Blood Favor on Huntress and Legion. Since the perk now works on their special attacks, or on injure I should say, instead of M1, it has so much more use. And I am having a blast with it.
I also wanna try out Blood Favor on Plague. That should be fun...
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Thanks man, oh that is interesting thing with doc indeed never had that experience yet it actually strange sounds fun😊
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Going in a locker to use my perk makes me a scaredy cat? oh so scared cats use inner circle/head on or any locker perks ok cool. Cookie already mention calm spirit so thank you for being way late on that with your negativness.
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There are good killers I did not say there was not, who punishes dead hard really good. Yes you can bait it out I can show many videos of good killers who totally make me giggle how they badly punished me when I tried dead harding, the pyarmid heads and docs seem very exceptionally good at faking and punishing it. Its not trolling its true, even some good killers say they dont have issue with dh and find other exhaust perks more a hassle.
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Figures. I'm not high MMR either and while I have seen survivors try the locker tech, they pretty much all ended up dying for it. The perk would be useful if they were consistently pulling it off, though.
For a second I thought you were talking about Blood Echo, but Blood Favor - huh. I'm not sure? At the start of the match, sure (though she doesn't even really need that - Vile Purge straight into M2, no speed boost to reach anywhere), but after that there's two predominant situations - either you're M1ing and they're all broken, so Blood Favor doesn't help the chase unless there's more survivors in the area, or you have oodles of Corrupt Purges to use. Pallets are very useless against Corrupt unless they're trying to sneakily bean you on the head with one - Blood Favor would help if it stopped them from throwing a god pallet to make distance, but in most situations you're just going to shoot over the pallet or walk around it.
I'd think Blood Favor would get less value than usual on Plague because you will often have games where survivors remain injured and on-hit conditions stop affecting their chases, but the new version of Blood Favor is a pretty solid perk and it's fun to use, so I still say go for it, see what it does.
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Hit and run was never viable in high ranks, so irrelevant. As for slugging, same reason why Boon Exponential isnt as strong: you'd have to be downed there. Let alone that you'd essentially have to allow survivors to gain value from boons. There are only 2 maps where I'd say boons are somewhat of an issue, and that reason is similar but actually the direct opposite of what allows Twins to camp basement hooks from 2 meters distance(even though she needs to be 16 meters away from other hooks). And even then, hexes on those maps are even more deadly.
Ruin affects survivor playstyles a lot more than boons affect killer playstyles.
Survivor objective isnt really that fast. Finishing 5 gens isnt the survivor objective. Escaping is. Gens are simply 1 part of it. Once 5 generators are done, the game doesnt end.
Oh, and it's not counterable? So, Bamboozle doesnt exist? Kicking pallets doesnt exist? Exhaustion inducing perks and addons dont exist?(Fearmonger is actually very good on a lot of weaker killers, partially because it fully denies Dead Hard), instadowns dont exist?. Let alone that using an exhaustion perks always gains you distance, and Dead Hard objectively gives you the least amount of distance while using the most resources. If you Dead Hard to a pallet, you lose both an exhaustion perk AND a pallet. If you 99'd Sprintburst in the same scenario, you wouldnt even need to drop the pallet. Let alone that Dead Hard is always a straight line, meaning if you didnt angle up right, you'd actually be quite some distance away from where you wanted to be. Dead Hard is heavily annoying, sure, but it's not even the strongest exhaustion perk in the game. It's one of the easiest to use, sure, but even then, Balanced Landing will have a bigger impact on most of your games than Dead Hard since survivors gain more distance. The only benefit Dead Hard has over other exhaustion perks, is i-frames. Survivors pick dead hard, because it allows them to dodge an attack they otherwise wont be able to dodge. Yeah, there are some other uses, but every single other use is outdone by Sprintburst alone.
And yeah, I have countered NOED plenty of times, but that doesnt make it less of an issue. You could be hooked, have NOED spawn next to you, and you're dead. You could have killers camping their first kill, then use NOED to kill 1-2 or maybe 3 more survivors depending on if survivors know you're camping.
I can make a huge list of things that are wrong with survivors, but perks aint it. Items are, especially medkits. 1 grey medkit is more powerful than CoH(seriously, you would have to pretend Boons dont exist at all and be surprised everytime someone gets healed in 8 seconds for CoH to beat Medkits). If I would change anything in this game, it would be for survivors to have a specific chest in the killer basement where they would need to gather their item if they want to use it. Spending 12 seconds on gathering the item while giving the killer some actual counterplay against items(3 people using BNP with purple toolboxes and socket swivels on a gen literally makes it impossible to defend that gen, spending effectively 36 survivor seconds in the most killer sided room on the map would be a fair mechanic to obtain your specific item with specific addons). As for things wrong with killers, perks also aint it. Maps are. I think DBD has been experimenting with killer seed based maps, as I have seen certain configurations be common for killers like Blight and Nurse, configurations that are near impossible for killers like Clown or Myers, while when Myers or Clown is picked, the configurations are very doable by those weaker killers(example being: the game room in Dead Dawg Saloon doesnt have a window against Blight and loses survivor beneficial doors so they can dodge his power, while when facing Myers, all doors are shut and the window is open). It's not perfect, but if it's true, it's at least a start.
And yeah, you dont need slowdown, at all. Which kinda contradicts the statement that survivor objective goes too fast. If you dont need slowdown, how is it going too fast? It would be going too fast if you need slowdown.
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Also, considering Dead Hard, I am not even going into killer specific counters yet. As Hinderance also slows down the boost that Dead Hard has. Doctor fully denies any survivor action(vaulting, dropping pallets, hopping in lockers, and yes, dead harding) for 2.5 seconds for everytime he hits a shock. Huntress can get around DH in chase by holding a hatchet and throw it when they need Dead Hard to dodge it but cant afford to use Dead Hard at the time. Plague with red puke can easily burn through Dead Hard. I am not including instadown killers for obvious reasons. Trapper now has a common addon that gives him the ability to essentially surprise survivors who Dead Hard over traps, you'd literally gain 20 of these addons for every match you play. Wraith's lunge, believe it or not, is more than long enough to take longer than DH's animation and dashes further, meaning you'd easily catch up to a survivor and still hit them. Nemesis has a very niche one: his zombies can hit through i-frames(if you place a trap next to you while you pick up a survivor who has DS, they wont be trapped because of their 2 seconds of i-frames, Nemesis can pick you up next to a zombie and it will instadown you, this also applies to Dead Hard). Hag can down so efficiently that she doesnt even care if you have Dead Hard. Heck, Dead Hard is pretty much required if you want to succesfully face a good Hag. Freddy and Clown have hinderance effects, which reduce the distance DH can make. Demogorgon, same reasoning as Wraith, except the timeframe is smaller(Pig too, except for the fact that her charge time and recovery time is a bit too punishing, but she has hats to compensate). Blight, Spirit, Trickster, Artist, Nurse and Cenobite all kinda fall under the rule of Hag, where they dont really give a ######### if you brought Dead Hard. Twins does care, but not much as she can simply use elevation to bypass the 16 meter rule.
That leaves Deathslinger, Pyramid Head, Ghostface, Myers and Legion who have some issues with DH. Myers and Ghostface because they need to expose survivors, and the more aware survivors are, the harder it is to get them exposed. Deathslinger, kinda depends on the addons, otherwise doesnt really care too much about DH either, it's that he isnt 115%, otherwise he would join the list of Blight and Spirit. Pyramid Head, well, he can bypass DS. If you can bypass DS, you're already strong enough to not really care for DH. Leaving pretty much only Legion. And yeah, Legion is in that perspective quite a sad killer. Luckily for Legion, he can keep survivors injured very easily and Blood Echo is a perk.
Leaving no killers that dont have ways of dealing with Dead Hard specifically.
As for killers that have no real ways of succesfully dealing with Sprintburst.
Doc, Freddy, Pig, Legion, Ghostface, Pyramid Head, Trickster, Nemesis, Demogorgon, Clown.
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Beautiful tons of key points there careful though I dont think he wants to her your lovely valued facts =) but yes you are real correct. I agree with what you been trying to get a valued point across.
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Slugging being gutted by the new boon? Excuse me? Since when does the boon spawn near downed survivors? A slugged survivor would need to CRAWL to the boon, moving at 0.7 meters per second. If that boon is 12 meters away, that means they spend 17 seconds just crawling there, only to pick themselves up 16 seconds later, meaning they were laying on the floor for 33 seconds. You'd be able to hear the boon if you are in range of the boon as a killer. Faintly, sure, but it's a sign that you cannot slug this survivor for longer than 14 seconds. And that is assuming the boon is close. What if only 1 survivor brought the boons? What if the boon was on the opposite side of the map? 12 meters is what a killer walks in less than 3 seconds. You would literally be able to walk to the boon to deny the self-pickup and keep the survivor slugged, meanwhile, the survivor is only 1/3rd of their way towards the boon. Being slugged is insanely boring and non-interactive. Exponential gives survivors essentially an objective that allows them to pick themselves up after spending a long time crawling to the position. Which is still boring, but at least it is interactive, let alone that in the vast majority of cases, the boons would be towards the outside of the map, as central locations are too easy to snuff, pretty much guaranteeing that the survivor spends at least 30 seconds just crawling there. Meaning they would be picked up faster if they didnt move at all, but in the case of a 2v1, it denies the slugging for the 4k in a 2v1 scenario.
Hit and Run is absolutely dogshit when it comes to high mmr. Hit and run works when survivors do not have comms. CoH doesnt really do much to affect that. It just makes it easier for solo survivors to work on the level of SWF.
Ruin isnt found extremely quickly, that's RNG. Ruin can last anywhere from 16 seconds up to 10 minutes. If you have to reapply a boon every 2 minutes, you'd be wasting easily 1 generator worth of time alone. Since hit and run isnt viable in high mmr anyway, you can see how this is a waste of time.
5 seconds of walking in chase is an eternity. If a survivor gets the 5 seconds back without you closing the gap for a hit, you're simply outmatched.(also, good survivors can use Sprintburst on-demand in situations Dead Hard only wishes it could be used. About to injure a survivor? Haha, now they are 20 meters ahead of you and didnt even gain damage, with Dead Hard? They gained 1-2 meters at best and had to use a window or a pallet). I am not going deeper into this, as I already used a killer specific list.
And no, I played 20 matches today with 0 slowdown. Playing Trapper, Doctor, Myers(I am a doc and myers main, so the survivors are quite competent, I do play trapper enough to face very decent survivors at the very least), even some on Legion(Blood Echo carries hard).
So no, you dont need slowdown perks to win the game, if you hook survivors in the right locations rather than the most convenient ones, if you know when to pressure the hook(example, 10 seconds for a survivor to hit second stage/die, its worth to stick around and make sure it happens), if you know to care about which gens(you are not supposed to defend all gens, try finding the 3-5 closest generators and limit your activities in there to create a deadzone), slug when necessary(when done in your patrol area, you would know where survivors would have been since it's effectively 50% of the map), use things like BT in your favor, trigger DS early if possible, if there isnt a DS, they are a free kill when you need one, find creative uses for your power that could surprise survivors. It's high risk high reward. If all else fails, bruteforce a chase untill they leave your patrol area.
Thing is, you have to play as someone who actually cares for wins and wins alone if you want to win in higher MMR. You would have to go for the most optimal strats. You might not want to camp, but you would need to camp if necessary(especially if the hook is within your patrol area). If you do leave the patrol area, make sure you hook the survivor as far away as possible that still allows you to return to your gens before one pops. It costs you less time to walk back than survivors, meaning 2 survivors are slowed down by 10-15% on their way back, meaning you only have 2 survivors in your zone. Let alone that at least 1 survivor has to cover that distance there, slowing that survivor down even more. If that survivor happens to be spotted, even more time is wasted and another survivor would need to go for the rescue, only leaving 1 survivor. That is using 0 perks. And survivors would need to use 5 perks just to try and reduce that amount of vanilla wasted time.
There are a lot of vanilla mechanics that killers have access to that are often ignored in game. If you hook a survivor on the nearest hook and go to a gen that is gonna pop anyway, you might aswell spend some extra time making sure the survivor is harder to get. If you know the gen isnt gonna pop for a bit, see what hooks are available and hook a survivor on the least reachable hook. If you know a gen is gonna pop if you're not gonna be there ASAP, then you hook them on the nearest hook to contest the generator.
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I didnt cherry pick, I gave killer specific counters. Seriously, you're now just trying to validate your own argument.
Sprintburst is by far more powerful than Dead Hard ever wishes to be. Dead Hard is simply easier to use. There exist plenty of counter measures against Dead Hard to make it far from OP. I mean, how specific are your situations where a survivor has to be pretty much the perfect distance away where Dead Hard buys them enough distance to reach a pallet or window(the net gained distance is 1 meter at best unless the killer swung)? Half the killers I mentioned have equal, if not more oppertunities to deny DH.
So who really is cherry picking here?
Yes, Dead Hard in some very specific scenario's, especially against the second list of killers I mentioned, can be practically uncounterable, but guess what? There are plenty more scenario's where a survivor has no chance of dodging a hit, even if they had Dead Hard. At best, they postponed it for 1 second. Do that times 12, and you'd have 12 seconds gained from 4 survivors having Dead Hard if they dont get the oppertunity to use DH to use a window or pallet. The longer the game lasts, the less pallets there are.
Seriously, run bamboozle, you'd be surprised how little effect DH can have.
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The pyramid head one is SO ON POINT, his hit box is stupidly huge and he is the top killer that will hard core counter my dead hard when I try it. Sprint burst disses ghosty and myers real hard when they trying to stalk you and you vroooooooooom away from em.
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I... Don't think that build makes them play like Twins. They could do the same thing perkless, bruh.
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Closing this here, since OP insulted and attacked anyone who disagreed with them.
Just a side note, when you open a thread on a public forum, you need to be open to criticism, not everyone will agree with you and not everyone will like what you say.
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