Visit the Kill Switch Master List for more information on these and other current known issues: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/299-kill-switch-master-list
We encourage you to be as honest as possible in letting us know how you feel about the game. The information and answers provided are anonymous, not shared with any third-party, and will not be used for purposes other than survey analysis.
Access the survey HERE!
Killers need something to counter boons
I play both sides , recently since noon perks came in they impacted the game enormously I like the idea but for killer they should be aloud to either break the totem or have a perk that counters boons. My survivors games are after getting way easier and the boons are after affecting some killer perks like nurses calling bbq and sloppy butcher. I was wondering for the new perk that’s coming called Hex pentimento would be even be a good contender to counter boons?
Comments
-
inb4 "just run thrill of the hunt"
3 -
It’s not good enough that’s the thing a killer can take so long to defend especially high level and boons are infinite thrill of the hunt isn’t
0 -
Also another point killers waste more time to constantly light out the boons time is very important for killer especially in high mmr
1 -
Good idea, to create a perk, you can use infinite times and the killer can't destroy the totems.
3 -
Infinite healing infinite unbreakable and hidden aura scratch marks what’s next infinite endurance
0 -
Doing the bones is the counter you are looking for. Or does it only work in defense of killer perks?
3 -
Shadow step completely makes nurses calling and bbq useless it counters aura perks as well as hides your scratch marks I think that’s insane for one boon just to have and the healing boon can be worked around but it’s the fact they can be lit constantly it’s crazy also shadow step in floor maps is unbelievably strong
0 -
I mean, one of the complaints is that even doing the bones is a benefit to survivors. Killers have no easy way to detect boons except get close (can't run a perk for that) or memorise exact totem spot when starting with e.g. Thrill, 4s spent on it is a net gain in time for survivors (14s to light boon vs 16s of no pressure, per team, whilst they're snuffing), and if they do... it can just come up again.
It's a way to create infinite time wasting or get a strong AoE perk effect for everyone.
Survivors do bones, that effect is gone for good.
1 -
There actually is a counter to boons to make it so a survivor can't bless a totem no matter how hard they try.
The secret is to use "The Twins," find two totems kind of nearby to each other, then body block one with Viktor and the other with Charlotte.
Now you might ask "what about the other three totems though?"
That's the beauty of it, there's only three left. If all four survivors take a boon perk, only three can use them. This means you've effectively denied one survivor the use of their boon perk for the entire match!
All it cost you was the game, your sanity, and a bit of luck.
0 -
i rest my case even the twins aka can’t stop the boons 🤣
0 -
Just create a killer perk for it and call it a day.
1 -
Hex pentimento can do that if they can make it affect boons
0 -
It would work if killers could do bones like survivors IE permanently remove them.
As is its just a false equivalence.
Or are you talking about the other killer "Do Bones" aka tunnel and camp the survivor who brought boons to death?
1 -
With the amount of stuff it does, affecting Boons would be the definition of overpowered.
0 -
It's simple why boons are so strong. The devs are more interested in the newer survivor players, then they are with killer players.
But I'm going to be honest killers should be able to destroy totems as well or buff hex undying to make it fair for both sides. As the hex used to bounce to different totems after it gets cleansed.
I'm just saying that once the killers get enough of the crap and they're gone then there's no more games. Only reason killers are staying is the dlcs. That literally comes every 3 months.
(Not to mention all the hacking and bug problems they help created.)
0 -
A perk takes 25% of a killer's build to counter 6.25% of the survivors' perks which acts as a 5th perk for 3 other survivors. It is in no way equivalent and would almost certainly provide no benefit outside of affecting boons, and let's be honest here, not even effectively countering them.
This attitude has given us garbage perks like Hangman's Trick because people hate saboutage, Forced Penance because people hate bodyblocking, Mad Grit because people hate bodyblocking, and about 5 different hex perks all designed to protect hex perks because hex perks suck as a mechanic and even then, none of them really do a heap because they're all hexes themselves and suffer the same issues.
Just whacking in a perk that has a negative effect on boons doesn't even come close to solving their issue of being extremely strong, applying to the whole team, wasting the killers time remove them, and then being infinitely restored.
The base mechanic of boons needs a realistic risk to them, whether it be breaking the totem when it's stomped out, only being applied once, or something else completely different. There's no realistic downside to them when they're completely gamechanging as perks.
0 -
Time is the punishment. Since boons have come out and a ton of people run them, I'm guaranteed to have extra time to stop gen progression. The amount of times that I've snuffed out the same totem then hear it relight after I get a hit and about to down someone is pretty great. I get a hook and go snuff it out afterwards so they can waste even more time. The more boons they have, the less gen perks they have. You can't carry DH, BT, 3 boons plus DS.
0 -
So much that's incorrect to unpack in such a short paragraph.
- Time is not the punishment. As any second the survivor uses is only 1/4 as valuable as the killers, if it takes you 14 seconds to set up a boon totem, the killer has to find, get to and snuff the totem in 3.5 seconds before it's a net gain for survivors. Every time you boon a totem, you either win time for your team when the killer snuffs it, or you win a super powerful perk. You essentially cannot lose time by putting up a boon unless you're also dumb enough to get downed directly on top of it.
- "The more boons they have, the less gen perks they have. You can't carry DH, BT, 3 boons plus DS." That is literally the entire design of boons, perks that only one person has to bring for the entire team to have them. EVERY SINGLE SWF these days has one player with boons. That gives you 3 players with DH, BT, DS, their choice of another meta perk, COH and Shadow Step. It doesn't take 3 boon perks to have a major impact. Either of COH or SS alone have a significant impact on the game, and fit in with three other meta perks easily. Even when you aren't in a 4 man SWF, they're popular enough that you can bring a full meta perk build and assume at least some of the randoms will have the boons and you still benefit from them fully.
4 -
Great points.
Something else I'll add to the "Time is not the punishment [of boons]" statement is this:
Healing yourself with Self-Care takes 32 seconds for yourself to heal. Healing a teammate takes both you and the injured person 16 seconds each to heal (32 seconds total).
Healing yourself with a boon takes 16 seconds for yourself to heal. Healing a teammate in a boon takes both you and the injured person 8 seconds each to heal (16 seconds total).
Every heal you get off in a single boon saves your team, collectively, up to 16 seconds of effort. This varies based on travel time, but as long as you run less than 88m (16 * 4 + 24) then you're always running a profit in time.
This can lead to insane numbers of saved survivor time, gaining as much 80 seconds of saved time (an entire generator worth of time) for performing 5 heals within a single boon. This is very possible against attrition killers and even just in general.
1 -
My win rate of double pips says otherwise. Seriously, Boons are the best. Now if all the survivors run Prove Thyself, DH, Streetwise and Built To Last with a Commodious Toolbox, BNP then Socket Swivels.. then you might be screwed because I've come across that twice so far and gens flew faster than even I could do much about with just Pop. That's the true gen rush. The more time you spend relighting #########, the longer I have to down and hook then resnuff to make you waste more time to go back and relight. The whole team could have boons. It won't stop me but you pack a bunch of commodious toolboxes with Built To Last and stack them with other gen perks and you're looking at a bad day.
0 -
Yup i definitely think there needs to be done something about shadow step.
Try playing scratch mirror Myers while there are multiple shadow steps are in play.
It completely nullify his powers which he desperately needs with that add on, he's already slow as he's stuck in T1 and shadow step also takes away his power 🤷🏼♂️
And then you have the spirit who who relies on scratchmarks with her powers, and now that is taken away leaving her basically powerless 🤷🏼♂️
Makes sense?
Not to me, but unfortunately the devs are terrible to properly test stuff and think about any consequentions.
0 -
Ok well now we're arguing my presentation of objective mathematical fact about how they actually work with the time dynamic vs your subjective "but I don't feel that way." And the clear presentation of how they work in a full meta squad, vs "there's only one way to win and that's commodious toolboxes."
I'm gonna go have an argument with a brick wall, because it seems more productive.
1 -
I don't think killers need something to counter them, boon totems straight up need to be nerfed. Even if the devs made a perk to counter boons, it'd still be an overall nerf for killers, there are many low tier killers that already need at least 2 gen regression perks, so now I would have to run another perk to counter a broken mechanic? No thanks. I like to be able to actually use my builds, not being left with 1-2 free perks slots only
3 -
Just nerf them. We don't need another must run perk. Killers don't have the slots for another.
1 -
Snuff em then snuff em again. And again and again.
0 -
Your math does not make much sense. Booning a totem is no imidiate effect for you. Only when it allows you to heal fully or to lose the killer the time was well spent. When you use 14 seconds to activate your circle of healing, and then heal yourself to 95% before ging down again, you effectively wasted time, you achived nothing. If the killer snuffs your totem as well it's even worse.
I had a game yesterday where I could snuff the boon of a player just seconds after it being activated, three times. A giant waste of time. The Mikaela would have been wait better off when just doing gens injured.
Boons are a gamble, just like hexes. It can work out and you have a powerful tool, or it can totally fail bc the killer snuffs it so fast that you do not get any benefit from it. Implying that it's always worth to boon a totem is just not true.
0 -
Why so hostile?
The commentor stated his experience with playing against boons. They feel they are doing better against teams with boons than against other. I can second that: my killer games with boons tend to last longer and are more enjoyable than the games without. Rarely a game gets really stressful bc of the fast heals, but most of the time the boons slow gens down and do not seem to have such a great impact.
When I play boons myself, it's similar. Maybe in half the games it works nice, in the other half not so much. Sure I'm solo Q, and boons in SWF might be much more of a problem. But let's be real, EVERYTHING gets more problematic with SWF in play.
As "objective" as your math may be, it might just be flawed.
0 -
Technically speaking, there are counterplay perks to boons on the Killer side- Thrill and Undying both give you an edge against players who are dead set on making full use of their boon perks, and if you're lucky with spawns and who you down in what order, Plaything can help force survivors to either break a totem or spend more time blessing it while oblivious, as well as locking that totem out for anyone else. Then again, some people seem to think a "counter" can only exist if it puts a hard stop to what it's countering, so in that regard, there aren't any.
Aside from that - I think it's important to make the differentiation between "boon totems" as a mechanic in general, and the specific effects of Circle of Healing, which is the only boon perk that actually is too strong and needs to be adjusted. The other two are fine- I'm not even convinced Exponential is any good at all, it's definitely not broken.
There are some things that can be done to help boon totems play out the way they're meant to even with that in mind, though- there are some weird finnicky totem spawns that end up far more of a timesink for the killer to go snuff them, for instance, and multi-level maps make boon totems a nightmare. That'd be the direction to start looking, in my opinion.
0 -
Just wait till there are 4 boon perks in the game. 4 boons with 4 effects each. But honestly, I think boon totems are not as OP as said or maybe the survivors that I play with just bless in the wrong places or don't know how to use them (me included not knowing how to utilize it properly).
I think the nerf to the boons here should be that there can only be 1 effect on 1 boon. If a player takes more than 1 boon perk, a random one is chosen or the first in the line is chosen.
OR
boon perks gain tokens and you consume 1 everytime you bless a totem. I think 2-3 tokens should be nice.
that's my suggested change to make it more fair.
0 -
Boon effects are not actually that OP (CoH could do with a slight nerf maybe, only because of multiple healing speed buffs stacking)
Where Boons are oppressive is in the amount of time it wastes for the killer to keeping finding and snuffing out Boons repeatedly. In the right hands with a coordinated team that is far more powerful than the actual perks effects, and you end up forced to just let them keep the boon. What hexes do you get forced to leave up for the killer?
It's a massive snowball effect that makes the strongest survivors exponentially stronger.
This could be mitigated by having snuffed boons destroy the totem, and removing the killer notification when a totem is blessed. Each totem is one-time use, but you'd get more use out of it. Would be much fairer for both sides. And lets face it most regular survivors only get to bless a totem once before the killer applies enough pressure to prevent reblessing. It wouldn't be a nerf to most mid-level or solo survivors, only the top SWF.
1 -
I just want shadow step and circle of healing nerfed the fact they can be relit infinity and what they do for a team is insane. The killer should be able to break the totem I think it’s fair 🤷🏻♂️
0 -
Time is the main factor for DBD. Why do killers use Pop, Ruin and Thana? Slowdown for TIME. The more time survivor's do other things, the more time you have to finish your job. That is a universal fact. If time isn't the most important fact then play games without any type of slowdown or regression perks. See how tha affects your win rate. Now add survivor gen perks to decrease gen time and continue to notice a pattern. TIME is the winner in DBD. You spend too much time off of gens while pallets are being used to relight totems and you WILL lose after awhile if your main focus is those booms and running there to heal then running back is still a time wasted.
If you do a boon near a gen that you are working on, a killer will smack you then snuff it out on the way to chase you afterwards. You put a boon across the map and then you waste time to go to it to heal then run back. I don't see how you don't understand that. You use boons, you don't have all the "OP" perks that people like to throw out. Never comment on the time it takes to run there and back or how survivor's who put boons next to gens will be snuffed and have to find another totem unless they want to risk the killer seeing them. Since you keep saying only 1 person has a boon, then no boons exist while the person is being chased, nor after the person is unhooked because they still have to get healed normally or bless a totem after they find one AGAIN then get healed before running back to a gen. Boons screw survivor's. Time is always wasted. If the whole team as boons, only 2 meta perks then. Still a win for the killer.
0 -
I'd totally be up for a Killer perk that increases the time it takes to bless a totem.
0 -
May I introduce you to Thrill of the Hunt?
0 -
O wow thats a clever thing to think of your part shows the poor experience you may have at killer. Unless you play only survivor, the thing is that the main objectives the killer already has to do not have enough time to spare patroling totems, but of course the game is killer sided my dude.
0 -
see What my problem with thrill of the hunt it’s hard to add it in your slot as killer cause you need the perks like corrupt and pop etc 🤷🏻♂️🤔
0
