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The Artist is Unfair and Unfun, But Not OP
Comments
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Doesn't artist do exactly what anti-loop killers are supposed to do? Where's the forum post about doctor being too oppressive and needing to be reworked because I can't drop the pallet or vault the window? Behavior should just remove the option to play killer and have only bot killers that don't do any damage. Then survivors could just loop and get chased until they get bored and leave.
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Because you can play a loop against a Doctor. It'll take them a bit to catch you.
You really can't play a loop against the Artist. If she puts down a bird, you have to run away.
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Not always, you can bait her into shooting the bird by acting like you're going to run into the line of fire.
Also if she doesn't have line of sight then she is forced to guess when to shoot the crow.
If you have a flashlight she's even more fun to go against.
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What else would you expect? This game requires 5 people, if 4 people are not having fun facing a certain situation that situation needs to be changed. Survivors' players are 80% of the players in a trial, if 80% of your player base is not having fun when playing the videogame, there is an intrinsic problem with the mechanic.
The artist, in most loops, offers no skillful counterplay. In most cases you are forced to leave the loop, get hit and get as much distance as possible. This is boring, and I frankly don't understand why this is even a thing. Most of the recent killers have destroyed killer-survivors interaction, the Artist is probably the worst offender of the lot. She needs to changed whether you like it or not she is not healthy for the game
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Can we stop the Artist hate train? Fun is subjective and should NEVER be used for objective balance
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What that leads to is the 4 people defining losing as unfun. Which is basically what happened here: someone uses their power as intended, it's hard to outplay in that situation (or force into yet another [BAD WORD] mindnumbing scooby doo runaround), commence claiming that it's "not fun" and needs to be triple-nerfed.
If people want to win all the time that badly, get BHVR to make better bots to loop and have them instead of actual Killer players. This axiomatic "if I'm losing playing this the same way it's not fun" [BAD WORD] is ridiculous.
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Old Legion was a good example of being uncounterable but weak.
If he wanted YOU, he would get you. There were no counters during chases. It took them long to get you because either he hits you 4 times or he moonwals until you bled out.
His 1v4 was weak, gens flied. But he was good at tunneling 1 person.
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The fact that you claim long shots are free hits I highly doubt it. All your suggestions are flat nerfs, aimed to gut her abilities and make her more clunky.
She can place down a trap at a loop, but good survivors abuse that fact and go to the next, they simply kite you around and go back and forth between loops. Which means a chase takes long aka gens are popping. It is purely useful against people that are not that good or specific areas where you can keep them there.
Most good survivors won't be hit by a simple trap, they also can try and bait the shot, dh through it, even if quick enough touch the bird and all that.
She is quite strong, but has counterplay and she needs to adapt to the survivors and use her skill. Her trap style has a clear counter, move away and so if an artist is going to have any decent timed chase? They need to use more than just that.
You find her to easy, because what she is strong? She provides information about what she is doing to survivors and they can respond. There is counterplay and adaptability for it, which I for one find incredibly fun.
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By that reasoning, killers are not allowed to have fun, ever. That is truly survivor-sided.
Also, I have to wonder how the ‘distance game’ is any different from the ‘mindgame’ when it comes to interaction. Looping the same tiles, as said by others, gets mindnumbingly tedious if the survivor knows what they’re doing. The same set of paths, the same “i know you know”.
If anything, the distance game requires even more interaction from the survivor, as they need to estimate how they’re going to get out of the loop before even entering it. You still dictate where the chase goes, but you need to be unpredictable, not unlike say nurse. How that makes her “unhealthy” is beyond me.
Artist is reduced to an M1 killer when out in the open against a survivor paying attention, which is precisely what you want to achieve. She is strong in loops, but standard outside of them.
strong =/= OP.
Or ‘unhealthy’, which is apparently the new buzzword.
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I don't think she is unfair and I find her quite fun to face.
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If it's a short loop yes it is pretty hard if not impossible to mind game her, but same with most any killer on a short loop. If it's a medium to long loop you can bait her firing the bird. Run towards it and then back step
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before nerfing her, can we nerf the nurse? thanks.
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Killers should be allowed to create lose / lose situations, the game is a 4v1, if there was too many win / lose situations instead the killer would be weak
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I get fun playing against her, so it not a valid reason either
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you can literary see where she is aiming with the crows
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This entire thread is exactly all the ######### that got Billy and Freddy and more recently deathslinger gutted
Can we please stop asking for nerfs bhvr doesn't know how to handle them and goes 2 hard every time
Not only that but ask any comp player and they will tell you they don't think any killers deserve nerfs
If anything quite a few killers need buffs
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This is like… the worst counter argument ever. I can win against a Clown like all the time, but it’s extremely unfun because Clown is a boring killer. You don’t have to be losing to not have fun. This is what makes playing games in which you are extremely overpowered unfun after a while as well.
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I said they feel like free hits, not that they are. Also these are just suggestions, not a proposed rework, like I’ve mentioned 5 times already lol.
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I agree that killers should be able to create lose/loses however I feel like it comes too easy to the Artist. There are quite a few loops where she can just place two crows on either end of it and get a hit when the survivor has nowhere to run. A good example of this is a lot of spots on The Game, I’ve found.
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It's kind of your job to have fun. No one should need to cater to you or lose their fun so you have more fun. If the game is unfun for you, don't play instead of using "unfun" as an excuse to get nerfs.
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You claimed to have played her, yet fail to realize they are not free hits! Feeling has literally nothing to do with the reality! Being hit at range by a huntress is exactly the same, just without a 9 second warning to dodge it! The survivors objectively have way more input to avoid ranged shot than against say a huntress, there is nothing free about it and if it still feels that way for the survivor... then they should maybe notice they have crows on them? She projects the fact she is going to try and snipe you after her first shot?!
You made suggestions and I commented on them. They are all aimed at gutting the killers power into oblivion without actual merit. There is no make it feel better, yet let's try to keep her fun to play. You opened a discussion and laid forth these nerfs up for discussion, no need to get angry that people actually respond to what you said rather than your out in the open make a different killer isn't a rework suggestion.
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This isn’t even my argument LMAO. The problem is with the design and I’m not suggesting the solution be nerfs or taking away the fun of one side. I’m asking for tweaks so that both sides can have fun.
I feel like you skimmed over what I said instead of actually reading and understanding lol. Also kinda annoying that you’re claiming I’m angry as a sort of underhanded insult lol.
Let me spell it out for you in a way that’s easy to understand:
This is a discussion on how I FEEL about The Artist, NOT a rework suggestion. Otherwise, I’d put it in the feedback section (not sure why the mods moved it here, I put it in GD).
The purpose of the suggested tweaks were what I feel would make her feel a bit less frustrating to play against. That doesn’t mean that those are exclusively what needs to happen, nor do they all need to happen. It’s simply a list of ideas. Not to mention, at least one of those suggestions (hook camping strat) is a pretty negligible change for a halfway decent killer, this should also apply to say… Hag as well.
Again, I’m not mad at the feedback on the post, I understand, but the difference between your comments and some others is that you come off as annoying and dismissive, while some of the others at least are open to actual discussion. Maybe try giving better feedback or actually having faith in the poster, I dunno. Unless you’re actually suggesting that I post some sort of “proof” that I’ve played killers before talking about changes to be made, I think I’ve earned enough merit with my post history.
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"Here are some of my suggestions to scale back on some of these frustrating mechanics to make her a bit more healthy, while retaining as much of her strength as possible."
I "skimmed" the message, while I responded to the main points that would impact the game in more detail than most. Yet none of them contain a resemblance of retaining any strength aspect and the notions of what is frustrating and why that is the case is purely subjective and not based on an objective view of both sides. Literally everything suggested are flat out nerfs.
The fact is simple just gutting the killers power, making it more clunky and unreliable is not trying to make it more fun for both sides. Any decent player with a resemblance of fair play would be objective enough to consider both sides. You however don't want to view it from both sides, yet call me dismissive because I point it out.
Calling out players skill is by the way low for someone that clearly should work on their own, free hits from range with a 9 second window to respond... any decent survivors will be able to acknowledge that it isn't free.
You placed it in general discussion, yet the mods determined based on its contents it should be in Feedback and you can dismiss my opinion all you want. The tone is all in your mind, you placing it on me doesn't make it dismissive or annoying that is your own interpretation. You are simply not objectively aware of the artists perspective in any of your suggestions and yet claim she isn't OP... yet nerf her into the ground on what premise, a subjective view not even objectively correct; you admitted that is is purely a feeling? This is not your monologue area, make a blog or YouTube video if you don't want feedback.
Post edited by Kalinikta on0 -
Artist is fun to play against imo
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Birds cross whole map. She need power set a range!! That's all
The cool thing about this game is the chase and they're killing it!!!
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