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Stop tunneling the first person out the game
Comments
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Your statements aren't lining up;
If for the most part killers are extremely nice and don't use the "I-Win button"
Then all the complaints about tunneling and camping aren't warranted. Yet people claim it is rampant and all over the place.
Then the impact they have on the numbers wouldn't be significant enough to be worrying.
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If what you state were true survivors wouldn't need the perks that you claim they do, as the odd game out would be easily left behind and moved on. Yet they use them all the time (survivor meta perks has been the same for years) even against killers that don't hit this 'button' and pushes killers that don't into playing that way; which is why I state that nearly every single killer actually hits this so called button at some point in the match if they want to win or they play blight/nurse. Good killers just simply know when to hit the button, hit it to soon and good survivors will simply smash out enough gens to escape, do it to late and well it won't provide enough pressure to matter. This is showcased by the experiment of Otz as well, because I can guarantee you that these 5,000 - 9,000+ players aren't just camping and tunneling the first guy they see and slapping them on a random hook without a thought process.
The so called "I-Win" button you claim it is, isn't actually an I-Win button just as splitting up and doing gens extremely fast isn't a guarantee to win. It is simply sweaty play and the side that plays more sweaty is more likely to win. The sweat lords on the survivor end are perfectly capable of putting up resistance against these tactics. Each side has their 'I-Win' button, the question simply comes down to, who uses them better and what mistakes do we make. At high MMR just mindlessly tunneling/camping the first person you see is by no stretch of the imagination a guaranteed win.
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I said lets do both at the same time. Remove or nerf the I-Win button and buff killers to compensate.
You obviously agree with me, that both should happen.
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Killers won't optionally stop. We NEED a decisive strike buff. A 1 time perk shouldn't be so weak.
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I have yet to see a proposed "fix" for tunneling that doesn't break more than it fixes. The biggest issue is you're trying to impose target control over someone who is a person, not an AI.
So people propose either punishing the killer with a reduction in points, or giving survivors some form of shield to protect them. Unfortunately both lead to the outcome of recently unhooked survivors trying to get hit, blocking the killer when they are trying not to tunnel.
It's the same basic principle behind the hook radius change that was supposed to fix camping, but got abused so badly by survivors it had.tonbe almost immediately reverted.
As long as every player has full agency, tunneling will happen. The best BHVR can do is try to introduce a good enough perk/mechanic/adjustment that makes it feel less necessary to win a match at high levels. That will at least drive down the frequency, though not eliminate tunneling entirely.
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They can't really nerf gen speeds cause that would make tunneling and camping even more worthy. Really only way is to punish it by making ds and bt stronger cause currently they only slow killer a bit. Agains't nurse or blight or even spirit they are nothing thought. Maybe survivors should have some secondary objectives to slow the game down then bit. Gen rushing is problem and tunneling is only way to counter it. Well best stragedy is to tunnel 2 survivors and hook them closely and then just camp.
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I hate to admit it, but tunneling the first person out is often the absolute best strategy. The developers have this game in such a state of imbalanced gameplay the killer is overwhelmed by 4 equal skilled opponents. Playing nice, spreading the damage and trying to avoid the tunneling and camping is just not smart ways to be competitive.
It is why I stopped playing. I'm a killer main, but I don't enjoy camping and tunneling all the time. Matches are too fast, too sweaty and filled with griefers now. Don't blame the strategy, blame the game state.
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Most effective way to quarantee 4K but also best way to make survivors feel miserable. But I would argue even better way is to get 2 hooks close by and then just camp and you get 2 early kill instead only 1 or even tunnel/hook only 2 survivors. Tunneling/hooking only 2 survivors have always given me 4K unless I end up feeling bad and then farm with the last 2.
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iv known soo many people leaving because of toxic tunneling. It's just game ruining and with the wait time it just makes you not want to play anymore.
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Match were you play agains't coordinated and good sfw you should always tunnel if you want kills. Tunneling, camping and slugging has given me lot of time 3-4K agains't them. Playing fairly by the survivor rulebook agains't them gives 0-1K maybe 2K at best. Well maybe once in century 3-4K.
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That's lot of tunneling. I personally don't tunnel if it's soloQ squad or average sfw. I only tunnel good swf or gen rushers. Well are the tunnelers mostly nurses? They tunnel me always for some reason.
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I'm afraid of teabagging. Plain and simple. Having to endure that in my 2k hours of this, I'm done. I'm not letting myself be degraded like this. I'm a killer and I shall do what I'm supposed to.
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It happens to me too. But when I play Killer, sometimes all you can find are one or two survivors. Sometimes I'll tunnel for the entire match just for the 1k simply because that one Survivor keeps shadowing me and then later, egging me to chase them. I mean... Bubba can take care of groups really well.
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The one the developers have been talking about, basekit Borrowed Time, would work. The perk is already in the game and has a proven track record.
I hope they actually make a watered down version of Borrowed Time, base kit.
- Doesn't work at EGC
- Only works on 2nd hook
- On works if that player hasn't done anything, other than healing, between 1st hook and 2nd hook.
That makes Borrowed Time still relevant but also gives survivors some type of tunneling-off-hook-till-dead defense.
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No, it would cause the unhooked to swarm the killer and try to let the unhooker get away, purposefully trying to get hit.
How do I know? It already happens now, just less frequently as BT isn't on every single survivor for free, so they take other perks.
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Make gen speed 25% faster if killer tunnels then I agree but I still think it should be something else like finding part for the gen. I just got tunneled and im mad so im now going to play insidious bubba.
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Not with the watered down version of Borrowed Time. It isn't usable during EGC, so there's no more worry about that.
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Its actually not egc where it bothers me the most. Then there is at least a reason, beyond just trolling.
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So, it's not because it affects the killer winning or losing the game, it's because it's aggravating. I think we can a tiny bit of aggravation once in a while to get tunneling-off-hook-till-dead and face-camping out of the game.
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Except that won't fix it. If the strategy is effective now, it would be even more effective after killer buffs. The only fix for this is incentives that encourage the killer to stop camping and tunneling because those strategies are not as effective anymore. Other strategies would need to yield more kills / chases / bloodpoints and "victories".
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Possibly lengthen the hook states to make it waste more of the killers time staying there trying to tunnel. They also already said they're gonna implement some form of BT base kit. This would make it much less efficient for them to stay there/tunnel since if they are trying to tunnel them out the survivors will have more time to leave them on the hook and pump gens. If the game is better balanced the killers will feel more confident leaving the hook and going for other chases anyway.
Along side this they'd have to shrink maps, weaken tiles, and nerf some of the over tuned second chance perks in tandem.
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As long as the boons mechanic stays the way it is, tunneling will only increase I'm afraid.
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Much the same as tunneling. Survivors don't care that they lost an elimination based game, they find that their experience in the game was aggravating, so they demand a change.
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I'd love some kind of BT basekit. Not because of the killers, but I'm sick and tired of being farmed by teammates.
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If you dont want to be the first person tunneled out of the game. Either
- A: Fix the game
- B: Don't be the first person found
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They literally tunneled in these matches ######### are you trying to prove?
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Unfortunately tunneling seems to have become more popular ever since they introduced COH and as long as boons stay the way they are it’s probably not going to go down. I hate getting tunneled as much as the next guy, but it’s not going to stop until the game is more fair. (And even then, some killers would continue hard tunneling anyways because they don’t care not to, which is why we need some kind of baseline anti-camping/tunneling change.)
But I feel you. Getting tunneled early in the match sucks. If I get tunneled at 1 or 2 gens when the killer is about to lose then I’m way more understanding (and this is generally the policy I follow as a killer, no intentional tunneling before 1-2 gens left unless you give me a reason to), but getting immediately tunneled off hook in the first few minutes of the match just feels bad.
It’s a vicious cycle. A killer may try to play fair and get stomped by some sweaty SWF with 2 BNPs and full meta and get clicked at in the exit gate, so then they hard tunnel the poor solo survivors they get queued up with next match who had nothing to do with it. Then those survivors shift to more sweaty loadouts because they’re rightfully tired of dying within 3 minutes of the match starting. Then killers react by bringing 4 slowdowns and tunnel more to attempt to keep up. It’s bad, and isn’t going to be easy to fix. Tunneling and camping need to be less effective strategies, but weaker killers also need to have the tools to win without them.
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Literally just left a game because I was tunneled till death. This game has been going downhill ever since they added SBMM making people prefer an easy win over having fun....Developers almost as bad at Blizzards...
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First the moris to Claire and Jill, now bubba is a cutie?😭
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Good change, like nerfing slingers unfun side and compensating players later, it worked for him so great.
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I love being camped by bubba because I can feel his warmth that way.
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A general rule of thumb in casual games in the past was that when we reach 1 gen, one person has to be dead.
5-4 gens (Early Game) Lets spread out these Hooks, Have some fun Chases.
3-2 gens (Midgame): Lets make someone dead on hook converts into aight fun is over, time to kill.
1: (Lategame) Lets see the wreckage left of these gens and see if i can drag this phase out long enough to convert one more kill.
Endgame: Basically chaos and everything can happen there, survivors feel cocky and think they have already won when they reach it and sometimes going for extremly dumb plays which can result in a 4k which shouldnt have been possible.
With the gen rush these days, (all gens can be done even with no toolboxes under pressure within 4 mins) its easy to see why people tunnel. Survivors skip the early game phase as fast as possible which is very easy doable and the result is reaching the mid game phase which means for the killer he has to convert now to a mid game gameplay -> get someone dead on hook and kill them. If the killer got only one hook in that time its easy to know what will happen and whats the best and only play for them in that moment.
I would also argue the Killer is completly handicapped in the Early Game, gen defence isnt possible vs 4 healthy spread out survivors and the only option is to go for that chase which usually takes 1-2mins anyway. A killer with Low Mobility and no Instadown will nearly always loose the early game desperately.
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I disagree with your assessment, which is make the game so killer sided, that killer can win regardless of tactics used. I offer a counter proposal, make tunneling a tactically bad decision and make it base kit.
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I genuinely wouldn't mind not playing for kills if the majority of survivors weren't being dicks about it. I get 2-6 hooks? I'm bad. I kill everyone through tunneling and camping? I'm playing toxic. If the devs just balanced around good players this wouldn't be a problem.
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Buy a killer session on Fivver, he will play like you want.
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Wish granted, it now activates twice but now also deactivates when entering lockers or taking protection hits
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Technically it's 25% chance, and it most likely increased because you showed yourself very poorly in a chase
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Protection hits as a deactivation condition doesn’t really work since they can happen unintentionally.
If you get unhooked by an injured survivor and get farmed (or get hit with BT) then you just took a protection hit and lost DS to no fault of your own.
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Blame MMR kills/escapes = Skill and more MMR #DeleteMMR
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Is that true? Or is it because the tunnel someone out of the match "strategy" is extremally effective. I understand tunnelling to a certain degree, however a lot of killers will use this strategy at 5 generators. The reason is because it most effective the earlier you start. Now I'm sure you going to say "but killers know the game is unbalanced and that is why they are faced." If that is truly the case, then why are you playing? If the game is so far beyond your control that you have to use this "strategy" before the match has truly started then why do you play killer?
The reason, is because killers don't camp because the game forces them, but rather because of its highly effective nature. If the game was perfectly balanced killers would camp just as much. The truth is DBD is fairly balanced. The only time its not, is when 4 meta survivors vs a meta killer, which is the only clear indication that the game is somewhat in the advantage of survivors. In practice however, due to the massive amount of addons, perks ect, with players being able to run different gimicks that may not be as strong but still fun, the game is fairly balanced.
People pick their loadouts before a match has started, and neither side has any real idea what the other side is running, so those who were planning to "Sweat" were going to regardless of 4 man swf or 4 solo q.
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Except when this is happening even in low mmr. When boons aren't in play, there's still 5 gens on the board, and the survivors aren't being toxic, there is quite literally no need to tunnel.
(Unrelated to your reply) I know that tunneling is "being efficient" but is it really being efficient if you lose 3 gens because of it? Is it really being efficient if you end the game with 1k and only 5 hooks at best?
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.... You should be losing at least 1-2 generators at the start... that's balanced. Do you not understand how killer works?
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I think they should stay true to the original purposes of the roles. Survivors should escape and killers should kill. I think a killer not going for kills and having a harmonic coexistent with the survivors would make this game even more pathetic in gameplay and appearance then it is already.
The main problem is still the way to short and one dimensional objectives for the survivors in comparison to what the killer has to archieve if he plays what is generally percieved as good. Once this is fixed you can perfectly fine punish camping and tunneling into the ground through lesser rewards and counters of survivors.
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STOP TUNNELING THE FIRST PERSON OUT THE GAME
Why would I help you, an opposing team player? I mean playing vs is 3 easier than vs 4 players. If you got caught it is on you.
I would like to have a chance to actually play the game, thank you.
There is an offering to spawn far far away from the killer, try it out.
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The thing is that you loose those 1-3 gens no matter what after you first chase. Now survivors have done completly chilled and brainless 30-50% of their objectives right at the start and you have done 8%. You are already straight away now under big pressure and in a loosing situation, dare you to make a single mistake from now on if this is a group which is playing efficiently for their win or share the glimpse of a moment for a fun interaction.
The general time it takes to complete all gens without brand new parts or toolboxes but gen defence perks is from my experience between 4-10mins depending on the strength, sweatiness of the team and how favorable the map is.
Tell me now how many hookstages you want to go for in 4 minutes when you play a low mobility killer. When to travel from one side of the map to the other takes already 20s and the average chase time lies between 30s-1m30s (non sluggin/camping/tunneling vs pre leaving gens + hold w + pre dropping pallets) and hooking people takes 10s as well.
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It may be effective but it's not fun at all.
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Your not accounting for one thing (pressure). The first 1-2 generators that go at the start occur due to the killer having no pressure at he beginning. Those first 2 generators will always go way faster then the others. Once you as the killer put the survivors in a position where they are constantly trading hooks states, wasting time healing this will slow down the other generators. When you use those times are you accounting for the fact that the generator speeds, should slow down once you get your downs/ injures ect. Or are you saying that generator speeds do not go down at all?
Also this is where I think people really struggle to understand how DBD works, you will not be versing peak, survivors and killers every match, it is a mixed bag. Yes 4 top survivors vs one top killer is in the advantage of survivors. but in reality, the skill of each survivor is far less consistent. However if you are going into matches with a comp mindset it only makes sense you should verse comp survivors or killers.
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Killers would like to not have the 1st 2 gens pop in the 1st 80 seconds of the game, but that's not happening as long as the devs don't care. So get used to the most sound strategy due to the meta. You can't have "fun" or "casual" games anymore the higher your MMR (in a 'party' game no less) goes.
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Which streamers are these? The ones who have 7K hours in the game and make a living off of it? IDK who plays handicapped like that other than those kinds of people, because high MMR killers aren't that masochistic. Buff survs more? Like just give them Boon: Resurrection already, seeing as that's the next logical step.
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What I understand the least about posts like this is the double standard. Killers need to play "fair" but I never see anyone telling survivors not to gen rush, or use COH, or DH, or not run to the strongest tile on the map every single time the killer chases you. Please explain to me why the killer should care about the survivor's fun but the survivors can do whatever they want. "Buuuuuubuuubut it's the objective!" Yeah well so is KILLING YOU AND YOUR TEAM.
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To be fair, tunneling the second person would be a bit pointless, you have to admit.
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