killer nerfs and the future of the game

enoughwiththenerfs11

 Currently in the PTB there are some new nerfs for the killers consisting of a nerf to the pick up speed for killers being reverted to a slower speed, a nerf to Barbecue and chilli now allowing survivors to hide in lockers without having there auras being showed.  These changes are not good for the game this will now basically make barbecue and chilli useless because now all survivors can just hide in lockers that are almost everywhere in every map to hard counter the perk on top of the 7 other counters that the perks already has. All this does is makes the perk useless to people in rank one because currently hiding behing generators already makes it hard to get any tracking value out of the perk now with the addition to hiding in lockers there are just far to many ways to hard counter the perk so now you might as well use something else because it will just be to hard to get any value out of it. Now on to the next nerf,  reverting the killers pick up speed to the slower version we all had before clown came out. This change has nothing positive about it the whole reason the speed was increased was to stop survivors from getting easy flashlight saves with next to no effort being put into it reverting the speed will now allow survivors to get very easy flashlight saves once again. Even after the buff to the killers pick up speed survivors were still able to pull off flashlight saves quite easy but not all the time the change allowed the killers to have a chance of not getting a guaranteed blind from a survivor with a flashlight, survivors would have to play closer to the killer to try to pull off the blind vs before you could play from quite the distance away and get away with a free save and there was almost nothing the killers could do other then stare at a wall or run a certain perk and even then staring at a wall only came up in  rare situations depending on where the survivor was downed. Currently there are more then 10 different ways for survivors getting off the killer for example , decisive strike, body blocking, hook sabotaging ,fire  crackers, flashlight blinds, pallet stuns etc, the point is there are lots of ways of getting off the killer so reverting the pick up speed makeing it slower ends up causing the game to be harder then it already is for the killers to do there job. The nerfs in this patch will most likely end up killing Barbeque and Chilli and re implementing guaranteed flashlight saves once again making the game less enjoyable to play killer and just more annoying going against survivors if the developers added in something to  compensate for the nerfs they might have  balanced themselves out but there is currently nothing that's a nerf to the survivors that even comes close to the killer nerfs. The game is already in a bad state of balance mainly towards the killers being far weaker to survivors. If the developers want to balance the game for the lower ranks there should be 2 versions of the game, one that is easier for the survivors to play against the killer basically like how it is currently and a second version more fitted for people that have a better understanding of how to play the game and want more of a challenge and having both killers and survivors be more balanced vs having it be  one sided. I love this game I love both killer and survivor but if more negative changes keep continuing the game won't make it. We as the Community need to speek up and get the devs to listen. We need to stand up and fight for are game and fight for it's survival. This game is a work of art with amazing characters and a story to still be told.

kazzymoyashi

Valid points for sure. Though, I will say that I feel killers are only weak to SWF teams. If a killer goes against a bunch of solo queuing survivors, it is extremely easy with a decent build to get a four kill.

I feel that, with the new perk Mad Grit, your argument against the pick up time reversion is a little nullified. I think, with the introduction of Mad Grit, the pick up speed should be reverted back. That perk prevents body blocking and it ensures the survivor on the shoulder gets a penalty for the teammate deciding to body block. Thus, getting a flashlight save a little bit easier is a fair adjustment.

G4rr3tt

I mean, bbq and chili can be punished by having survivors hiding in lockers? here let me give you an ez tip, run iron maiden, gives you a free exposed effect on whoever who runs into a locker and their location for 4 seconds, they "nerfed" to give a buff, tho i dont see the "nerf" was needed honestly, but it's not much of a change thinking about the new perk that's getting introduced so... say what again?

The_Daydreamer

Remember the same overreaction with 2.0.0 because of the palettchanges? Here we go again.
Srsly that change against Aurareading is not that impactful. No rank 1 survivor cares about BBQ.

Malakir

The_Daydreamer said:

Remember the same overreaction with 2.0.0 because of the palettchanges? Here we go again.
Srsly that change against Aurareading is not that impactful. No rank 1 survivor cares about BBQ.

Doesn't exist only BBQ as aura reading btw

G4rr3tt

The perks survivors care the most are probably noed, ruin and spirit fury honestly, everything else is honestly just, nothing, even nurse call is not much of a deal.

EDIT: I think my man you havent played killer before 2.1.0, if you think killer is weak rn.. lmao should of played before 2.1.0... as a survivor main i say killer was way weak before, id say rn it's balanced, quite more towards killer, BUT... BUT... as a solo que survivor, solo que survivors dont stand much of a chance against a good killer, actually almost no chance, while swf is still overpowered, and let's be honest, the next patch is just a massive buff for claudette mains.. they will just become 1 with the grass, a dream come true for all those immersed survivors, i might be potato with flashlight saves but, i used to get some before the clown patch, now i mainly use flashlight just for self peel when being chased. But trying to flashlight save right now? yeah... ill pass, im not gonna give myself away to try a save that will 99.9999% fail cus the timing is hard, so yeah, no thanks lol

Malakir

G4rr3tt said:

The perks survivors care the most are probably noed, ruin and spirit fury honestly, everything else is honestly just, nothing, even nurse call is not much of a deal.

Okay so its totally off topic plus 2 of those perks are DENIED without even interacting with the killers

What's your point again?

The_Daydreamer

@Malakir said:
Doesn't exist only BBQ as aura reading btw

Thats true but what are using most killer? Right, BBQ or Nurses. You gonna feel no change. And dont forget that you can counter BBQ with standing behind a gen.

Malakir

The_Daydreamer said:

@Malakir said:
Doesn't exist only BBQ as aura reading btw

Thats true but what are using most killer? Right, BBQ or Nurses. You gonna feel no change. And dont forget that you can counter BBQ with standing behind a gen.

Exactly, that's the point. Why add more counties when 3 out of 6 are without perks?

Its just feeling like an overkill that's it. Why have after the patch 6+ counters to one killer perk and no survivor perk is counterable like that? Thats the point. I already played assuming the killer have bbq even when he doesn't, I don't feel the need to have even more of it tbh

I would've preferred another perk like the autosabo unhook perk (I'm bad at names) instead of another counter for aura reading that are already counterable without perks

It feels cheap and dumb, why would do I run dance with me when I can pick distribution that's better? I won't get in a chase in the first place with it and don't even bother to play accordingly to counter aura readings. Heal 5mt of the killer and keep doing genes carelessly

That's my point, I prefer have something more unique than a straight unneeded counter

Keene_Kills

The Killer shouldn't have to waste a perk slot for either situation: The original pick-up was slow enough to warrant fixing, just to revert again needlessly... if you're going to blind a pick-up make sure you're using a strong enough flashlight, otherwise get situated ahead and use it during the travel... I was blinded during quick pick-ups plenty by strong flashlights, so there was never a problem here; nor should a different perk (Iron Maiden) have to be used make up for what BBQ & Chili already innately had, especially since Iron Maiden is truly only useful when activated nearby the killer, in fact at just 15 secs. of Exposed status I can honestly see it being used more as a distraction against Huntress (let's be honest here, nobody else is going to run this perk). If we're going to talk perks, both Iron Maiden and BBQ & Chili are neutered by Distortion... so using that line of thought, why not just leave BBQ & Chili alone, leave the auras as-is, and let the survivors waste a perk slot on Distortion, instead? This go around, the new survivor perks have much more potential across the board, whereas the new killer perks are extremely situational. They want to end meta killer builds? Make new perks decent, work on old unused perks, and don't just nerf tried-and-true perks to force folks to take up known crappy ones.

Trying to get folks to stop using BBQ & Chili as part of the meta is just going to lead to more tunneling and camping. One of the major reasons I still use it, even after everybody realized they could more often than not hide behind a gen to nullify it's aura reading, was the BP boost. Although folks like to try to say that's BS on here, it's true... the BP boost is worth it. I sought out to hook a different survivor ASAP, not only to build pressure but also so I could build the tiers on it fast and earn more. Stop using it and there's one more reason to not worry about spreading the love across multiple survivors... why should anyone? Worry about not pipping due to the half-arsed rank fix last go 'round? Also, since it's so frustrating playing killer now as-is with so many SWFs anyway (and the incoming matchmaking change going to stop folks from being able to tell who may likely be SWF, no fix to endscreen perk reading mid-trial, and no open labeling for SWF in the lobby anytime soon), the only real reason to continue playing killer side is for the slightly higher BP earned (usually) compared to playing survivor. And the challenge. But there's a line that was crossed in this PTB between "challenge" and "ground-nerfed hot mess."

There's enough nerfage across the board on the killer side in this PTB that, if it goes untouched and live, I have to think it will make a fair amount of folks just stop playing killer and take up survivor as main. We hear that from both sides during each patch, during each new release or "fix," but this one is heavy-handed, to say the least. I've already started leveling more survivors in anticipation, although I can definitely see the lobbies getting longer in the near future for even that side after the smoke has cleared.

Wolf74

@G4rr3tt said:
I mean, bbq and chili can be punished by having survivors hiding in lockers? here let me give you an ez tip, run iron maiden, gives you a free exposed effect on whoever who runs into a locker and their location for 4 seconds, they "nerfed" to give a buff, tho i dont see the "nerf" was needed honestly, but it's not much of a change thinking about the new perk that's getting introduced so... say what again?

Are you serious with that "what again"?
Are you aware that we have only 4 perk slots?
And there are already to many "must haves" for killer.
Killer always need perks to "counter" certain stuff, while survivor get their counter without the need of perks.
This is simply bad, unbalanced gamedesign.

The_Crusader

But bullying killers makes for good youtube montages.

Which drives sales of the game towards a new toxic fanbase.

It's easy to see why Behaviour is doing this.

PolarBear

@G4rr3tt said:
I mean, bbq and chili can be punished by having survivors hiding in lockers? here let me give you an ez tip, run iron maiden, gives you a free exposed effect on whoever who runs into a locker and their location for 4 seconds, they "nerfed" to give a buff, tho i dont see the "nerf" was needed honestly, but it's not much of a change thinking about the new perk that's getting introduced so... say what again?

So killers need to spend a perk slot to counter something whereas the survivor doesn't? Yeah. Sounds fair.

powerbats

@The_Crusader said:
But bullying killers makes for good youtube montages.

Which drives sales of the game towards a new toxic fanbase.

It's easy to see why Behaviour is doing this.

Yes because everyone plays just to bully killers, do you obviously believe that nonse? I mean I know it's great to stroke the vocal minority of killers ego's but just stop. It's as bad as when the vocal minority of survivors say the BHVR is catering to killers.

The_Crusader

powerbats said:

@The_Crusader said:
But bullying killers makes for good youtube montages.

Which drives sales of the game towards a new toxic fanbase.

It's easy to see why Behaviour is doing this.

Yes because everyone plays just to bully killers, do you obviously believe that nonse? I mean I know it's great to stroke the vocal minority of killers ego's but just stop. It's as bad as when the vocal minority of survivors say the BHVR is catering to killers.

There are far more that do it than there should be.

And of course certain survivor items and perks let them get away with it. Oh they got caught? No big deal just instaheal, oh they got caught again? No big deal just d-strike out of it. Oh they got caught a third time? Oh just disconnect and find a new killer to try and annoy.

God forbid playing the game properly.

Other games don't have this as much because other games make it harder to pull off.

Im fed up of having the obsession click their stupid flashlight at me, tbag me, and then when im finally in a positjon to have enough free time to waste it on them due to decisive, they only end up disconnecting anyway if they go down.

Master

@G4rr3tt said:
I mean, bbq and chili can be punished by having survivors hiding in lockers? here let me give you an ez tip, run iron maiden, gives you a free exposed effect on whoever who runs into a locker and their location for 4 seconds, they "nerfed" to give a buff, tho i dont see the "nerf" was needed honestly, but it's not much of a change thinking about the new perk that's getting introduced so... say what again?

I love guys like you.
When someone complains about a built-in mechanic being to strong, you just say "simply run perk X".
When we talk about DS, simply run "unnerving enduring, makes DS useless".
When we talk about pallets/loops, simply run enduring spirity fury and bamboozle.
Gens geting finished below 3 minutes? Simply run op ruin

You do realize that killers only have 4 perk slots to fight against the 16 perk slots of the survivors AND the built in design "features"

Wolf74

@Master I try to get that point across for almost 2 years now. No chance. Survivor are completely blind to their own flawed logics.

Blueberry

@Master said:

@G4rr3tt said:
I mean, bbq and chili can be punished by having survivors hiding in lockers? here let me give you an ez tip, run iron maiden, gives you a free exposed effect on whoever who runs into a locker and their location for 4 seconds, they "nerfed" to give a buff, tho i dont see the "nerf" was needed honestly, but it's not much of a change thinking about the new perk that's getting introduced so... say what again?

I love guys like you.
When someone complains about a built-in mechanic being to strong, you just say "simply run perk X".
When we talk about DS, simply run "unnerving enduring, makes DS useless".
When we talk about pallets/loops, simply run enduring spirity fury and bamboozle.
Gens geting finished below 3 minutes? Simply run op ruin

You do realize that killers only have 4 perk slots to fight against the 16 perk slots of the survivors AND the built in design "features"

^^^^ This. Seriously. +1

we only have 4 perk slots yet we're given super situational perks to counter more problems that are useless perks the rest the time. Meanwhile survivors don't even needs perks to counter a lot of things and even then the perks are just good in general and not highly situational like most killer ones. It's already 16 perks against 4 and even the 4 we do have are almost all taken by "required" perks just to be functional.

akbays35

I'd be ok with the changes if they remove all battery add-ons for flashlights, seems fair.

G4rr3tt

@Wolf74 said:

@G4rr3tt said:
I mean, bbq and chili can be punished by having survivors hiding in lockers? here let me give you an ez tip, run iron maiden, gives you a free exposed effect on whoever who runs into a locker and their location for 4 seconds, they "nerfed" to give a buff, tho i dont see the "nerf" was needed honestly, but it's not much of a change thinking about the new perk that's getting introduced so... say what again?

Are you serious with that "what again"?
Are you aware that we have only 4 perk slots?
And there are already to many "must haves" for killer.
Killer always need perks to "counter" certain stuff, while survivor get their counter without the need of perks.
This is simply bad, unbalanced gamedesign.

Yeah so does survivor.. I legit have to run 2 perks i definetly dont want to run, thanks to tunneling and camping, if i knew for sure that killer will not tunnel and camp, i wouldnt use them, and personally would use something else, and by that i mean ds and adrenaline, or even balance landing, or self care, honestly all 4 perks i use is a solo peel build, in case im getting chased i can give myself a free escape if i get downed before getting camped and tunneled, if the killer tunnels me the whole game, i can pop adrenaline at the last gen if we get to that point, balance landing to be able to run better and not get staggered for ages when dropping from a high place, and self care when ofc ur team instead of healing you, r*pes you, i personally would like to run other stuff, yet when i do it, all i get are killers face camping and tunneling, if those 2 issues were fixed pretty normal and healthy survivor mains wouldnt rely on such "broken" perks, i honestly wanted to run plumber instict for a while, and offerings for chest cus i want more items and things, but hey right as i take ds off my perk build, boooooooooooooooooooooooom facecamp into tunneling boi, not every survivor runs that cus we want to bm or be toxic, i hate being toxic, but if im gonna get tunneled and camped im gonna defend myself with that the game gives me...

Dreamnomad

PARAGRAPHS!!! Use them! I refuse to read walls of text like that.

Wolf74

So you loop the killer with BL, heal if you escape and DS him… and you still wonder why you get hardcamped?

powerbats

@Wolf74 said:
So you loop the killer with BL, heal if you escape and DS him… and you still wonder why you get hardcamped?

So when you don't loop them for ages, don't use ds or flashlights and you still get hard camped what's your excuse then?

Wolf74

Maybe the survivor in the killer match before have been toxic scumbags that really p*ssed him off.
Happens all the time. Go thank the rest of the toxic community for that.

powerbats

@Wolf74 said:
Maybe the survivor in the killer match before have been toxic scumbags that really p*ssed him off.
Happens all the time. Go thank the rest of the toxic community for that.

So when the killers toxic that's an excuse to be toxic in the next match? You can't blame the actions of the few on the rest of the community.

It's like the old adage you don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, you don't throw away the entire barrel of apples due to 1 bad apple etc.

There's also the childhood lesson we were all taught which is "two wrongs don't make a right" and "just because someone else did something wrong doesn't mean you can."