You hide MMR because you have something to hide
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There are only two viable ones. Huntress still gets obliterated by any coordinated team as seen on coconut's streams. He was going mad when mmr came out.
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'Viable' =/= 'never loses'.
'Viable' also =/= 'brokenly overpowered'.
Viable means you can contest even the toughest games. DbD is both snowbally and extremely dependent on map and RNG.
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Nope. Viable means it is on the survivors to make me make a mistake instead of the killer waiting for them to make a mistake.
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Nobody. Not even the best player in the world makes no mistakes at all.
I don't think any game more complex than Chess has ever had a match in which absolutely zero mistakes were made. Especially one as mechanically complex as DbD.
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If you know your current mmr is high you can avoid playing weaker killers till you feel its at a level where your not gonna get stomped for playing a weaker killer or running a meme survivors build. Even then people can at least go in with the expectation they are gonna have a harder time. You obviously wont know a survivors or killers mmr till post game. So no dodging will not be made worse people will know beforehand that when they queue up to bring the appropriate build. If anything it will encourage higher mmr killers and survivors to play more meta which wouldn't be a problem if this company would do some big balance tweaks instead of lounging around letting the meta stagnate.
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Sure, but your MMR on the weaker killers isn't going to change if you aren't playing the weaker killers, so there isn't going to be a point where it's at a level you're more comfortable with?
Also, kinda wild to say the devs are "lounging around letting the meta stagnate" on the day they give the dev update on the big meta changes, lol.
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Come on were not goldfish here. We spent 2 years waiting for that ds rework. A lot of updates have been gruelingly slow. The mc lean patch was the last really big patch and even then they half assed it with widespread changes that needed so much more tweaks Cough slinger cough spirit. I will give props to the ghostface, legion update there was a lot of genuinely smart improvements added to there kits. But its worth reinforcing just how important it is to get these perk shake ups moving. We have stared at ds dead hard bt/coh for so long its very frustrating its taking this long.
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Mistakes happen at the highest levels of chess play too, including serious ones ("blunders") it's an easy way for cheaters to get caught out playing online, only computers don't make mistakes.
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It's- bro, the Developer Update for the perk shakeup is out right now, you can go read it. PTB in a week, update a few weeks after that. It's on track, it's happening right now.
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Overwatch's quickplay absolutely takes into account your skill. Almost all games that have quickplay functions will absolutely put you in some bracket because even in QP they don't want to pair a 5 hour person with a 2000 hour person. Most people play quickplay to get a feel of the game BEFORE going into ranked, if they didn't have a way to make sure it was mostly new (or close to "new" skill) players playing, most new people would leave because they'd be getting curbstomped every game.
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Well I guess I'm eating my words there are actual baseline changes. Great perk changes some feel a little overboard the self care one seems a little rough. Monstrous shrine is a little dangerous with hag basement builds imo. But I got the biggest grin looking at a lot of these changes. Expecting a wake up wake up quote to wake me from this massive shake up.
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Ok I'm shocked this is genuinely incredible base game changes. A base game bt effect what in the hell I swear I don't work for behavior they actually did it. Self care nerf is an overreach imo but so many perks look really good. Overcharge looks nuts, monstrous shrine hag might be a problem. But a dead hard nerf that cuts the i frames and rectifying (hopefully) distance issue is bp from heaven. No WAKE UP pls pls just this once let it be real.
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Agreed! These are some really good changes, I can't wait to test them on the PTB.
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The thing about strong killers is that Blight and Nurse control the chase. You escape when they make a mistake. Every other killer requires you as the survivor to first make a mistake that allows them to get a hit.
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This post is flawed because a simple but stupid reason:
The challenges and daily rituals (as well as the Emblem system, too) force Survivors to play stupidly and do stupid things that otherwise they wouldn´t do.
"be in a chase with the killer 180s"
"rescue a team mate 3 times"
"destroy 5 hooks"
"rescue a guy when the killer is nearby then loop the killer 5 times while holding a pallet in your hands and dance with your flashlight"
And so on.
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That something turned out to be the MMR.
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Eh...
Nurse controls the chase, but a single mistake is incredibly punishing (hence her bottom basement gross kill rates), and survivors can also outplay her by moving cleverly. The core issue is that she completely negates map resources.
Blight comes down to his addons, mostly. Without his crazy stuff, he's manageable.
Both need reigning in, but that should be a targeted nerf to their problem addons. We don't need another Freddy/Billy style gutting that hits them everywhere they are fun.
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Blight and Nurse are the only viable killers right now at high MMR. You really can't touch those killers without making the game fair for all the other killers. How do we do that?
1) Reduce Map sizes so every map is 9000m² or less
2) Impose a penalty on SWF or buff killers going against a swf (pick one) :
a) Limit SWF so that no character/item/perk can be repeated
b) Give the killer 4 perks they choose ahead of time that only activate "in case of SWF". Give solo survivors that are in a SWF a similar thing but limit the solo survivor to only get extra information perks like Bond, Kindred, Object of Obcession, etc (since that is what SWF gives).
c) Impose an efficiency penalty of 5% per linked player that persists the entire game regardless of alive status that stacks with all other penalties.
3) Give almost every killer in the roster buffs. The bottom 16 killers are abolutely horrible and nearly unplayable at high MMR.
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Saying something over and over again does not make it true. We've already gone through the viable killers. Keep in mind that high MMR tends towards a more rigid meta with players gravitating to the best options - but those aren't the only viable options.
But okay, let's go through your suggestions.
- Depends on the map. Mother's Dwelling? Sure. Shelter Woods? You'd need to buff the map and add some resources along the edges.
- You don't want to punish people for playing with their friends. I'd rather tweak things so that SWFs have a temporarily inflated MMR and more rigid matchmaking. a) No. Not every SWF is a murder squad. Hopefully with the perk changes, the meta will be a bit more varied. b) I'm not sure what you mean. c) No. You'd just push people back into lobby shopping.
- Eh...here are the killers that need buffs and adjustments. Doctor, Wraith, Clown - small buffs, maybe targeting addons. Onryo, Myers, Trapper, Pig - buffs to basekit. Freddy, Artist, PH, Nemmy - addon pass to make addons more interesting, but not a huge buff.
Keep in mind that killers are getting a huge sweeping buff in the overhaul patch.
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Shelter woods is HUGE. It's so big you can run for 30 seconds, then loop a pallet - drop the pallet and then run again for 30 seconds -without being hit if you get a stun. All of the pallets are extremely safe and there is no room to mindgame any of them. Run to a far corner if there is nothing left. That means a "traditional killer" has to hit you once, follow for 20 seconds and then hit you again. If you rain in a straight line you can go to a far corner. then there's a 10-15 second timer to pick up and hook. And then they have a 30-40 second walk timer to go back to anything relevant on the far time. Let's add up that time : 20+20+15+ 30. That's enough time to finish a generator and walk - not run away. This is beyond stupid.
Not every SWF is a murder squad -but you need to realize the devs posted that SWF is a 15% escape advantage. Something needs to change. The reason we have long queue times for survivor is because very few people put up with playing killer.
Here are 12 killers that are weak if you play them with no addons :Doctor, Trapper, Clown, Pig, Hag, Michael Myers, Wraith, Spirit, Oni, Pinhead, Ringu, Trickster. Compare playing those killers with no addons to playing Blight or Nurse. There's no comparison because the S killers are "ok" with no addons and completely brutal with addons. You will have an eternity of unfun if you play MM with no addons. You need one of two addons or he is complete garbage. But you can dominate - depending on map with the right addons. Hag might be "ok" with no addons but again becomes extremely punishing when you use her strongest/meanest addons. Nurse with no addons played perfectly can hit on every second blink. Here's the newsflash - Nurse might be a little overtuned but ALL killers should be in control during a chase - not survivors.
Some of the killers break the mold here in that they have zero good addons to help them - like Billy. Anything good that was a nice part of his kit is just gone. Why on earth did he lose the Begrimed chain? He had it before LF. Other killers like Huntress require you to be CoconutRTS or Umbra to "not suck" without addons.
This sweeping buff you are talking about is exceedingly minor. It would be a HUGE buff if survivors and killers got the same size collision box. That would make everyone learn how to loop again. That would be a step to making the game fair across all levels of play. No more would you see high MMR players looping for 30-60 seconds longer than middle rank MMR players.
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Okay, a few things.
Raw map size doesn't mean all that much. Shelter woods is big, but virtually devoid of resources on the edges (cannot think of a recent time I lost there).
Not every SWF is a murder squad yes. 15%...if I recall, this was 'in the most extreme cases', likely referring to tourney comps at the highest MMRs.
Those killers...firstly, killers aren't balanced around not using addons, which is why a lot of killer buffs are targeted towards addons, not kits. Secondly - Trapper, Clown, Pig, Doctor (maybe, although all he needs is validation on his shocks imho), Wraith, Onryo and Myers need buffs. Oni and Spirit are fine as is. Cenobite...is tricky, because of how overwhelming his kit can be for solo players. Trickster is fine, imho - he's like Nurse in that he needs a bit of skill with, but does pretty well at intermediate and higher MMRs from what I've seen. Oni and Hag are fine.
Especially considering the significant, across the boards buffs killers are getting soon. Yes, it's huge - the pallet break changes, the kicking changes, the regression changes and especially the hit/recovery changes are a massive deal.
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i dont mind not showing tbh. But i would like to know how it works exactly.
because its supposed to help get more even, fair games…but the way it is rn is very inconsistent. On one lobby ill get the sweatiest swf and work my butt off to get a 2k and the very next ill get survs who dont know how to reveal my GF and get snowballed immediately.
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They said SWF gave an average of 15% more escapes. This is very different from the rhetoric we got for the first 5 years : SWF gives no advantage.
Spirit was fine and then she got gutted. You could listen for her footsteps and pallet stun her or know which side of a vault to be on - but that's too much trouble to ask survivors to do.
Oni probably needs to lose the tech where he swings around corners. Hag needs a few changes : first she can never place a trap close enough to a hook that the unhooked person can trigger it. Second you should be able to scratch out her traps without an item - this would prevent the catch 22 where she runs Franklins and her traps have zero counterplay.
Map size doesn't matter when you play Blight or Nurse. You can zoom to the next target. I literally explained to you how someone running in a straight line can waste over a minute for M1 speed killers. I guess the solution is to just play those killers?
When they show us the win rates of maps there is a strong correlation between large maps & high escape rates. Most people agreed that Hawkins was a fair map because it was small, had a variable layout and had pallets you could mind game.
Farm maps are huge and have a high escape rate - except for the small one (abattoir). Badham is huge and has unfair loops; it should be no surprise it has a high escape rate too. Crow map is just stupid. The only time I ever win this map vs good players is to camp a survivor early in my corrupt area and never leave.
The only thing that would make large maps fair is to slash the number of pallets and vaults so that the only thing you can do is run in a straight line. Most maps have something like 14-18 pallets (ignore The Game). Imagine if the crow map had 8 pallets - that might make it fair. You have just enough pallets if you use them wisely.
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Yeah,the mmr doesn't work that's what they hide.
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