Why in the HELL does Hillbilly still have an overheat system?
Like, seriously? What was so broken about him before? All it was was stacking charge addons. That was the real strength. Now playing basekit Billy is a nightmare since your chainsaw overheats by nearly half just from charging it up!
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the same reason why some players called him OP and the same reason his animations had to change on purpose to screw with the muscle memory
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I was on the forum when before they nerfed Billy. I saw no one complaining about him.
The devs nerfed him on their own
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idk about official forums but on steam community if i remember, people were calling him op because of his unlimited mobility and instadown potential. although steam forums is bait forums
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Same reason why Freddy is still suffering.
The reason is:
BHVR.
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My guess is that someone at BHVR had to do something for work so they spent their time making a solution for a problem that didn't exist. And they can't admit they're wrong and they already spent so much time working on it so it would be a waste to not use it. That's called sunk cost fallacy.
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same reason why trickster has recoil??
who knows
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The Devs believe every killer has to have a recharge system. Just be happy he doesn't need to refill his chainsaw at lockers.
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There was legit no good reason, it was the same reason as Wraith getting nerfed, against low ranks the kill rate was huge, so they make a nerf that doesn’t help with new players, but does hamper his performance at higher MMR. Overheat isn’t necessary because Hillbilly has about everything in his kit, but more importantly he’s not the best at anything. Bubba has better instant down, Blight has better mobility, Oni has better curving, and these make the elements in Hillbillie’s kit fair to face because they aren’t that oppressive. And it’s his versatility that gives him his strength. Currently overheat makes it where in higher MMR where survivors movement is tricky, they’re aware of where curving is possible, and play safe to avoid gen snipes, you need to break the chainsaw rev or hold it longer to get a better chance, but overheat punishes you for trying to go for these plays to get downs and such which is legit punishing for trying to do cool things with your power. And there’s the other issues of course the animation changes and the fact that maps no longer really account for him like Eeyrie and Garden with hard to curve loops and weird hit boxes to chip the chainsaw and just in general clutter that make curving and mobility take extra time that costs you. And it’s incredibly tragic how they took one of the best and most balanced killers who like 1% of people complained about and just were like “AcCoRdInG tO tHe StAtIsTiCs”. (I still play Hillbilly a lot just tragic how they made this unnecessary change when it could’ve been a Myers buff or Pig rework and just zapped a lot of Hillbillies enjoyability).
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Lmao. After the introduction of boons, I can totally see them adding that as a second objective. Billy has to find a gas can somewhere on the map. It's revealed when you get within 24m of it. It's good for enough charging up to a full overheat with no cooldown
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If I remember correctly this was added to prevent unlimited chainsaw face camping.
Where Hillbillies would just stand in front of the hook revving their chainsaw indefinitely so survivors weren’t even able to trade off hooks.
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Todays basekit and the old basekit are nearly identical, only thing the old basekit did was not punish you for misusing your power
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Because entitled survivor mains will whine if any change makes the killer gameplay more bearable
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Even still a face camping billy is still a guaranteed trade and if it was bhvrs intention of making overheat for that specific purpose... yeah idk.
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As I recall, you have to put in a serious amount of effort to get the chainsaw to overheat. Either way though, I think it wouldn't make any difference if it were removed.
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rip chainsaw billy
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That's funny, because I remember Billy being one of the killers survivors actually enjoyed facing.
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Devs made Billy C tier because they wanted Bubba sell more. Now we have a killer that high effort/ low reward. Great job @BHVR.
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Pro Billies would be too oppressive against anything but that sweatiest no weak link 4mens. Like Nurses and Blights.
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Don't worry bro, I'm sure BHVR knows what they're doing by keeping Billy nerfed while refusing to touch Nurse and Blight.
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If i remember correctly, there WERE some people complaining back then. But its been a looooooong time, so I might be wrong.
Like he has mobility AND instant downs, there were some people calling for speed limiter to become basekit.
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Because he uses a chainsaw so he MUST have the overheat system.
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Before Nurse/Blight it was Nurse/Billy. Even though he was considered the most balanced killer, he was not liked by survivors.
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Nurse was touch 6 months prior.
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No true, a good survivor can loop billy for ages if he keeps going for chainsaws. It doesn't need a 4 man stack, dunking on billy is not really hard with new map design.
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Weird for you to even think the "touch" they gave nurse was nearly as impactful as the absolute destruction they did to billy.
Like "Oh no, my favorite killer! She went from being the best killer in the game to being the best killer in the game but now she waits like 3 seconds before blinking twice and that's without addons because if she uses double recharge it's basically pre-nerf Nurse all over again!"
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Old basekit Nurse was far better than current Nurse with both recharge addons. It takes a lot of reving for current Billy's chainsaw to overheat. I know it was bad when it was first introduced, but they nerfed the heat gain by a lot shortly after.
For Nurse, during the PTB the recharge system was bugged and started recharging after swinging instead of fatigue. Giving the impression it wasn't that bad. Even so, the Devs nerfed her recharge addons before the live release and ofcourse the bug was fixed.
So, yeah I'm making the comparison.
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This.
Addon-less Billy was the most balanced killer BHVR had put in the game. Playing against Billy was fun and BHVR totally ignored the community feedback about the overheating chainsaw.
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The Nurse nerf was absolutely as impactful, even more impactful, as Billy nerf. I don't know what you talking about.
Nurse went from a 70% high MMR winrate to a 50% high MMR winrate pre-MMR changes. Don't overestimate the impact of being able to spam blink right after charges come, and this combined with range addons. Current Nurse is strong, but if you've played against a pre-nerf nurse you would know that she's not nearly as strong as she used to be.
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Because its pure logic. Bubba should have the same.
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First off, very disingenuous of you to pretend the reason Nurse is getting so much hate recently is because of her basekit. Yes, indeed, her basekit was nerfed a while back, and with it came a 9k BP solution to every Nurse main's problems which is the double recharge combo. Double range or Range/Recharge are also still in the game. No nurse player, and I repeat, NO nurse player I've seen the past six months playing nearly 100 hours every 2 weeks didn't have one of these combos. Not one. And that would be memorable so I'd remember it if I'd seen one. And that's just talking about the addons she can use, now when she uses perks that are already busted on regular killers she can only be stopped if the person playing her is completely new to her.
My point with that Nurse talk is: Billy got everything (and i'm talking addons as well) he had ripped away from him because he was 'too oppressive'. Then why are killers that would always do better than him in both a high skilled and low skilled scenario not getting the same treatment? Nurse was NEVER worse than hillbilly and still isn't. Same applies to Blight. Both of these killers have addons that make them more efficient than even crack billy was. It doesn't make any sense.
Ah yes, the statistics. Oh, you're talking about which one of the MMR tests that didn't work again? What part of the old MMR experiments can be used as reliable data? Surely, again, you know nobody is complaining about basekit nurses because you just don't run into those, right? Nobody plays nurse without addons and even when people do, the next one is just gonna have all the busted stuff all over again. We need to stop pretending things are happening in this perfect vacuum where perks and addons aren't used by strong killers.
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Everybody who have played against pre-nerf nurse knows how strong she was. I need absolutely nothing to prove you that and everybody who has experienced that knows I am right, because I am not saying that she is not strong now, but instead that she was way stronger before.
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You never played against me then because I play addonless. Also that 9k solution is if RNG favors you and only if you want to get close to what old basekit Nurse was like. Not to mention you are unable to run any other addon. You complain about her distance addon forgetting how it was prior to her nerf. You think a little speedup is oppressive? You have no idea what her addons were like back then.
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Oh! You play addonless! That's so rich, but it still doesn't quite fix the problem her addons create because of the majority of people who do use them. Just a little note: Nerfing something busted into something slightly less busted isn't really a fix. You're talking to someone who handed out beta keys to play KYF with my buddies. Trust me, I've seen Nurse at her strongest, but what good does nerfing her into her weakest do if her weakest is still miles above what the next killer can do? I'm not saying she should be nerfed into the ground, I'm saying she should get a respectable "Addon Rework/Revisit" as Billy did. Since you play addonless, that should be no issue to you.
Refer to what I wrote above.
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*Pushes you to a far wall coving your mouth*
Don't give the Devs any dumb ideas geez...we don't need another Nerf to a killer that's considered a "balance" fix
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I find it pathetic an OG player is still having issues against Nurse. Goes to show people won't be happy until she is played as often as Spirit.
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Sunk Cost Fallacy
They don't want to throw it out because they spent time and money working on it even though it is terrible.
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They worked really hard on it /s
I always find it funny how they used excuses like "Oh, well, we don't want him to be able to easily camp like he can" And then in the same patch they made LF the god at it. I miss going against Billy's that actually tried to use their power at loops and curve. Talk about a dying breed. Well, I suppose they killed those players but mostly, they just made 90% of the people who play Billy not play him because his busted addons were nerfed + Tinkerer changed previous.
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If that were the main concern they would have just made it work like Bubbas overheat, which was introduced at the same time.
No, they fully intended to nerf his map mobility and missed attack recovery.
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Why the devs butcher him and not Nurse still baffles me.
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Cause it was a wanted to change to those "i just rev my chainsaw all the time at all loops, cause nothing stops me from having a braindead time"-players. You just cant braindead play him anymore, thats what this change did. nothing more.
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Billy suffers from Aurelion Sol syndrome. Something else is broken/op? Nerf Billy
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The fact is against good survivors, you should use Billy like ''braindead'' in your terms. You should use your chainsaw for mobility, mindgames, downing survivors etc. I dont even mentioning that against good survivors you should use your chainsaw oftenly in chases due his weaknesses. Break a pallet, do a curve but survivor played well and dodged your curve, break the chase and go somewhere with chainsaw. Now you have at least 50%-60% heat you are overused your power now you should not use for like a 10 seconds! Incredible change lmao
Post edited by Silasy on3 -
Because we can't have killers that are balanced and fun to play as and against.
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Is the overheat system even an issue though? I don't think I've ever seen a hillbilly overheat
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Overheat isn't as big of a deal as people make out but there are a few tweaks that would be useful.
- Remove the heat gain during the dash but keep it for the revving.
- Increase the base cooling rate slightly
- Rework pig gloves into an addon that dumps all heat on a successful down. Similar to ring but it's a bit more balanced on billy since there's stronger counterplay to him than bump logic.
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Oh I agree. What they did to Billy makes absolutely zero sense. It made zero sense at the time and even less sense now considering how bonkers double range Nurse is and how busted Blight add ons in general are.
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No they wouldn’t, why would they make it like Bubba’s? Someone that can’t travel across the map with his chainsaw?
If you made it like Bubba’s you’d end up with Hillbilly getting a cooldown every time he has to hold while revving at a loop. How would the game distinguish between revving for a play vs for face camping?
I don’t think you understand the differences between this two characters if you think Billy can simply “let go” and curve around objects like Bubba can.
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I think you're reading quite a lot into my comment that I never said.
You said that the only reason overheat was added for Hillbilly was to make 99%ed chainsaw hook camps impossible, to which I simply added that that was not the intention behind it, they very clearly intended to nerf both his map traversal and chase recovery with it as well.
HAD they done what you said they did, THEN Hillbillys overheat would work similar to Bubbas, where you gain heat while charging your chainsaw but then quickly lose it uppon either dropping out of it or fully committing to a chainsawsprint.
Also,
If you made it like Bubba’s you’d end up with Hillbilly getting a cooldown every time he has to hold while revving at a loop. How would the game distinguish between revving for a play vs for face camping?
That is quite literally currently in the game. Exactly the way you described it too. You WILL go on cooldown when holding your power around a loop too much, just like Bubba - and to answer your question, the game can not distinguish between a facecamping Billy and a Billy aiming his chainsawsprint around loops at all. It never could and I doubt it ever will.
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PC players were complaining plenty about him before this forum went live. This is a console-heavy forum though so it doesn't surprise me that sentiments are very different. You had streamers like Zubat talking ######### about instasaw and Hexy complaining that he has too much pressure. Fun times.
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For someone who thinks I am "reading into their comment" too much, you are one to talk. Quote me where I specifically said the only reason they added the overheat mechanic to Hillbilly was due to his facecamping ability. I'll wait.
That is quite literally currently in the game. Exactly the way you described it too. You WILL go on cooldown when holding your power around a loop too much, just like Bubba - and to answer your question, the game can not distinguish between a facecamping Billy and a Billy aiming his chainsawsprint around loops at all. It never could and I doubt it ever will.
Hillbilly goes on cooldown WHEN his overheat mechanic reaches 0. So assuming he never reached 0, he can immediately start revving AGAIN. Something that Bubba cannot do, as he has to wait to re-gain his tokens first.
So when you suggest that Billy should work like Bubba's tantrum he gets when holding his chainsaw while revving, per here:
my argument to that is that Billy HAS to hold it in specific scenarios when mind-gaming survivors at specific loops.
Example:
Imagine Billy going into a tantrum-like cooldown in the middle of a loop. That would not only be very bad for him but wouldn't make any sense.
This while other loops require even longer revving. So no, he should not work like Bubba's at all because they work differently.
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