Reassurance needs an opt out feature
I've seen footage of survivors using it to hold others hostage on the hook, and i think that needs looking at.
Also survivors with idle crows should lose collision to prevent the same thing.
Comments
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Yes, that's very healthy change. I think hooked survivor still can get skillchecks on a second stage. Maybe rare ones, but still.
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Hook suiciders don’t get a valid opinion.
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Neither should griefers holding people hostage
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the killer is free to continue playing so therefore noone is held hostage
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The survivor on hook isn't free to continue playing, they're just left hanging there with no way out if a squad decides to keep popping reassurance on them
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sure, if the killer does nothing, and then it's technically the killer taking the game hostage, not the survivors. but in any situation where someone gets reassure trolled the killer probably eventually starts getting hits and downs on other survivors and the game ends.
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Yes, I think the skill checks should continue as normal when Reassurance is activated, but the timer would still be paused.
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On midwich you can do it from either floor
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I'd be fine with that, if the difficulty of the skillchecks is also paused, so they don't become impossible
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what does that have to do with the killer's behaviour?
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Survivors will just hide on the opposite floor, being stealthy
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i think OP is talking about survivors who use the perk but never actually go for the save even if the killer is nowhere nearby, resulting in a survivor stuck for 90 seconds doing nothing.
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That, and the fact that multiple survivors can do it repeatedly
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okay. help me understand what scenario you're describing here, because in my mind there's only two situations at play here and you don't seem to be thinking about either of them.
a) if the killer is camping the hook and not going after other survivors, then reassurance usage isn't trolling, it's countering and punishing through consistent and valuable perk usage.
b) if the killer is not camping the hook and going after other survivors, and the survivors are spamming reassurance to troll someone, the killer is not camping and is trying to actively pursue the other survivors, therefore leading to hits downs and a game end
what's the angle that i'm missing?
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Survivors can stealth, avoiding the killer entirely, either by the use of perks, or by being sneaky gits, which lets them pop reassurance to grief
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stealth is never perfect and people will eventually get found by a killer that's looking. there's innumerable situations with plague where the survivors refuse to touch an infected gen so they just hide in lockers for 3-5 minutes, but they get found. and that's actually taking the game hostage.
the way i see it survivors are already fully capable of nonparticipation. reassurance's existence doesn't mean nonparticipation will happen just because it's going to be new. either it happens and the novelty wears off fast, or it doesn't happen at all. i think the situation you're describing will be rare since it requires two survivors to synchronise for it, or used to punish people who try to suicide on hook, which is less griefing and more counter-griefing.
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You can't guarantee that the killer is going to progress and end the game quickly. It's a two-way street, survivors need to make themselves targets in some way to give the killer and objective to follow, and then the killer needs to be able to outplay those survivors.
What if the killer is on one side of the map chasing a survivor, but failing to down them. Meanwhile two other survivors are playing immersed, tag teaming the hook with Reassurance. (Two survivors with Reassurance can hold a hook state for up to 60 minutes) Whenever the killer drops their futile chase to come back to the hook, he can't find anyone, because they're hiding, so he patrols and eventually finds the slippery survivor again, and repeat.
Placing all the blame on the killer is absurd when it's the survivors who are triggering the effect. That killer could be trying and failing to down another survivor for 5, 10 minutes, meanwhile the survivor on the hook is trapped there, unable to play or leave the game without DCing.
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huh? i'm not blaming the killer, i'm saying as long as the killer is continuing to play the game then it does not fall under the rule of taking the game hostage. even in the situation you described, the fact they're still chasing means something. pallets run out eventually and bloodlust kicks in.
if you do want this to be termed taking the game hostage then you'd have to figure out how to make it so that the rule isn't basically "playing badly is not allowed". as far as i can see, the only way the killer consents is if the survivor on the hook was trying to kill themself on hook, and frankly, i do not care what happens to those people and could not be paid to. if the other 3 survivors and the killer all hate them so bad to let them stay on hook for a full hour, then... well. how sad. what a shame.
as an aside, re: the suggestion that the reassured survivor keeps getting skill checks, i personally don't want to be subjected to extra skill checks. when i get reassured i want to be able to relax. i think people underestimate just how awful it would be if the killer's camping and your team has to reassure you to buy the time to fix up the gens and you'd be stuck there doing skill checks for, what, 3 minutes? 4 minutes? no thank you.
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The whole game isn't being taken hostage, the survivor on the hook is. Their game is being taken hostage, the other players are still able to play.
This would be like one survivor trapping another survivor in a corner. In that case crows would eventually give them away and the killer would intervene, But that's not the case for a Reassurance hostage situation.
Just because the killer is still playing the game somewhere else on the map, doesn't mean that a survivor being held on the hook for 10 minutes isn't being held hostage. Not until a limiting mechanism is applied.
Crows, Bleedout, EGC etc. are all such limiting mechanisms, and you'll notice that they all have a time frame of 4 minutes or less. Anything more than that can be claimed to be 'holding the game hostage' for a particular player, and it does not fall on the killer to end it if it's the survivors who are instigating it.
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Hackers can join lobbies no issue, even as killer. A group of hackers can force themselves into another survivors game, hook the survivor, and force them to DC or be taken hostage.
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I think make it so you can attempt escape if someone uses Reassurance which like normal if you fail several times you're pushed into struggle. Reassurance pauses skill checks only the first time it's activated on the hooked survivor during struggle. After that first use runs out the skill checks return (make them one size entire time instead of getting smaller) and it's up to the hooked survivor if they want to stay in game or miss 2 skill checks and die like normal. This way the hooked survivor, if willing to stick around, still earns BP and has option to stop at anytime.
I also think if Reassurance is used the hooked survivor should receive % gens completed and distraction points so they aren't punished with 0 BP from spending extended period of time on the hook if they're choosing to stick around and help out their team with camping killer.
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4 ppl want to farm and 5th does not. Right now he will try to do gens or get hooked and maybe get slugged. With reassurance he can stay there until someone decides they want to move to next game.
I think it would be good idea to add choice for hooked survivor to actually reject reassurance (say E when on hook) to resume the timer.
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Nah. Hook suiciders can suffer. Give like a 10s or so window after Reassurance is used where it can’t be used again, but no skillchecks show up during that time so they can’t suicide either. Then, even if they try and keep you there, with the 10s barrier each time, you’ll die eventually.
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I think the angle that you're missing is that there are a few bad eggs existing out there. A killer may have left the hook yes to go pressure other survivors, But let's say those survivors are pretty confident in their abilities to escape without their final member. Let's say they start using Reassurance maybe final 2 gens and just leave that person on the hook to die and just dip where that person is stuck on hook doing absolutely nothing. Though most players would obviously want to go for the unhook it's just those few bad eggs that many people are worried about.
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