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Remove or Nerf Judiths Tombstone
It has no counterplay if Myers is able to hold down right click. Its horse ######### that I can play the whole game winning chases and taking no hits, and one lucky mouse click is enough to ruin the game.
Comments
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Judith's Tombstone gives a 9% speed penalty to Myers while in Tier 3, and adds a crazy amount of stalk points to reach it. Try getting into a locker if he pops Tier 3 on you and it's taken him ages to reach it.
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Just... don't feed him and use LOS blockers
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So the counter to instant death is letting him get a free hook? Still a bullshit add on.
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People certainly give Judith's more slack, because it's objectively worse than Piece, but both Piece and Judith's are not healthy for the game the way they currently work allowing Myers to instant kill a healthy survivor with no other condition than being in T3.
Both addons need changes alongside tweaks to Myers basekit, but I doubt we'll see anything on that soon because it doesn't look like a priority for BHVR.
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By the time it procs like 4 gens will be done and you can just locker. The myers also has to use 2 iri addons and throw his points. I am very surprised your talking about this addon when tombstone piece is so much stronger and consistent and only takes 1 addon slot and no perk slots (judiths basically has to be run with play with your food).
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There are so many more problematic addons in the game on killers that are much more problematic than myers will EVER be. Come back when MDR, Alc Ring, C33, C21, Adrenaline Vial, Blighted Crow, Iridescent Tag, Dried Cherry Blossom and Nurse range addons get fixed.
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Nurse range addons should have been fixed already with the last chapter.
This is also a bad argument, because the existent of other addons that should be nerf doesn't mean we should ignore this one.
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Actually it isn't a bad argument. You're looking at nerfing an addon reliant killer when S tier killers have the best addons in the game, period. Nurse range addons are still broken btw, they shouldn't exist at all.
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It is a bad argument. We shouldn't ignore unhealthy stuff in the game just because it's attached to a weaker killer. Myers needs basekit adjustments and an addon overhaul. He should get those things regardless if Blight's addons have been touched. DBD is constantly being updated so it doesn't really matter if 1 thing gets adjusted before the other.
Moris got changed before keys did. Both were unhealthy and they both got changed
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It's fact that every addon I listed is a higher priority addon than tombstone (not including tombstone piece, but leaving Michael's addons alone till the more problem addons are fixed on stronger killers is a higher priority than making a bad killer worse).
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For the time being, we should ignore tombstone because it will take more time to bring myers to a fair spot than it will to adjust broken blight and spirit addons (nurse addons on the other hand will take awhile because they need a total rework).
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He's gonna get a free hook anyway if he's within Tombstone Range when popping tier 3.
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Honestly you'd expect them to be thankful it was ONLY a hook state he's taking and not their life
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The devs shouldn't ignore Myers needing work over the existence of other things in the game.
The devs can certainly work on adjustment Myers need along side adjustments to other things in the game that need changes. The entire dev team of DBD doesn't all have to work on the same thing. Myers work might not get done before other things, but it shouldn't be ignored.
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Mayers is unfair in a way, that chances of you escaping are determined by the weakest teammate in your team (well it's unfair only if it is not you). The addons DO have counterplay. Usually meyers with tombstone+infinite T3 is able to pop said T3 at last 1-2 gens. If we are lucky, nobody gets caught. If we are less lucky, one person will go to hook and it will be probably too easy for him to camp him out to death (3 out). If we really screwed up, we loose (4K).
But that is miles better and more enjoyable then getting any random range-addon starstruct+agitation nurse. Mayers should be changed because it feels unfair. But it's such a low priority compared to all the other problems in game.
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myer's lore is to instant kill. so its faithful to lore of his character. weakened these add-on would really hurt myer's as whole.
I just think that the shape and his whole tier 1/tier/tier 3 feels like he is suppose to be ever-changing but he doesn't feel like the shape in the sense that tier 1 is detriment, tier 2 is barely better then normal killers and tier 3 is downside where other killers like billy have base-kit instant down without needing to waste time to acquire it. He does not feel dynamic as killer in the sense of being transforming killer.
Myer's feels like he is suppose to be like Iron man where he is suppose to just go through everything and be like super-killer m1 that does everything quickly. Its just that he does not feel oppressive in tier 3 because he has no anti-loop towards pallets in the game. He get stunned like every normal killer and pallets impede his ability to down in tier 3. I think they envisioned him to be more of a build-up killer that progressively gets stronger the longer the game goes on by making him have faster action speed on everything similar to freddy's fire-up perk. Its just that positive additive bonus have diminishing returns in DBD and fire-up just is has little impact so stacking action speed bonus do not make much of a difference for his tier 3 to be threatening.
I do not think they're going change him or any add-on's because he is gimmick killer. you make his tier 3 relevant by optimizing his niche mori play-style that has synergy with his pwyf perk. there is nothing more to him. Keys & mori offering were global to the game. Nurse could use mori's and survivor could use keys that could impact the match result heavily which is why they got changed. Mori's for Myers are his unique gimmick and I do not see them changing his gimmick unless they change Myer's design but people like his add-on design so it is unlikely to change.
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Tombstone piece you are safe at least.
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The tombstone addons are holding myers back from being a better killer. At no point am I saying the devs have to remove Myers having the ability to instant kill survivors. But the fact he can do it against healthy survivors who haven't been hooked is no longer fine with the direction the devs have been taking the game.
We've seen Moris get nerfed for giving killers the power to quickly tip the scales of the game in their favor. Hatch/keys got changed to not allow multiple survivors the ability to escape without finishing the objective. There's no way the tombstone addons will stay the way they are.
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I think they'll stay how they are because they want myers to stay to his lore on being able to instant kill survivors. that is running theme behind mori-based killers is that their fantasy in dbd gameplay is compromised for the sake of being more lore accurate.
my main dislike behind mori's for myers and pig specifically is how -unpreventable- they are. I just feel like these killers do not feel like they have build-up to earning a mori. The premise that you have to line of sight myers for the entire game feels unrealistic to dbd gameplay for survivor. Its same for pig. you just follow the normal gameplay loop of a killer and mori naturally occurs automatically from rng jigsaw boxes. I feel like these two mori's take away from survivor gameplay instead of add to the gameplay because the expected way to counter these killers is to flawless the game by not going down. that's why these killers have weak chases because they devalue the hook-state system so your expected to flawless the game against them.
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Pig RBT's have been completely ruined to the point that by themselves they don't kill and it's not even worth using addon for that anymore, ruining the live or die lore. And look, the nerf in her entire base kit was because of a broken addon that allowed her to simply camp in a box and hope that's the right box in the game.
As for myers, I hope they (devs) rework Judith's tomstone, but not to the point of ruining the character's lore and base kit.
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its because pig RBT are not meant to be reliable mori's. They're first about slowdown, then about mori's. the mori is highly map dependent and somewhat rng-based. I think pre-work RPD was her most consistent map to mori someone because most players got lost in the map pathing for old RPD to get to jigsaw boxes and then there is just big maps that increase walking distance between each box so your more likely to get mori'd. I am not sure what odds are to get a mori, but I think you can get a mori every 1/4 or 1/5 games. something like that.
As i said, I think the dev consider mori mechanics as fair way to gain kills and they balance around them(by making the killer terrible at every other category besides mori).
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This is not my experience. I can't control how well my team mates break line of sight. I dislike most things that remove the core balance foundation of downs and hooks.
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RBTs were hybrids, they maintained both lethality and slowdown capabilities and precisely because you can either take it off in firist attempt or die trying on 4 (especially on large maps), RBTs were never a problem/issue, because they depended on RNG, so as in the character's LORE, and it was her most precious asset and justified the character doesn't have any chase power.
The only problem was always the video tape addon that allowed her to keep the lethality without even touching the game (AFK), and that deserved the nerf, since she didn't need to do anything for that (survivors start game with RBT).
Anyway, devs ruined her entire base kit and turned the RBT's into pure slowdown, no longer worth investing in lethality addons, when the right thing to do would just nerf only the problematic addon and listen a portion of the community that also asked for the RBT's not to be removed on firist try, creating a pure slowdown addon to mimicking the mechanics of "five box and 12 global attempts", decreasing the RNG and lethality. Now is pure slowdown + no lethality + no chase power.
Post edited by randonly on0 -
Fine... have teammates that have eyes, as far as I know, it takes 3.5 survivors to feed him with Judith's, so like...if you guys fed him that much, you weren't gonna win anyways
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It's only 3. Each survivor has 10.1 worth of stalk.
It takes 5 stalk to go from T1 to T2, 5 stalk to go from T2 to T3, 10 stalk due to Tuft, 10 stalk due to Judith's for a total of 30 stalk points.
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That's still alot of leeway before Micky can get his tier 3
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I agree that is an addon very luck based and very unfair and unfun. I think the only reason they didn't fixed it it's because Myers is a weak killer that need a buff and maybe thay are waiting the right moment to buff the killer but nerf the addon.
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Jump in lockers. Do a totem. Sit on a Gen. Quickvault something.
There you go: counterplays for any Tombstone.
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Which don't equal to 30s stalk in experience but more like 40-50 depending on the distance.
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I mean you would go down anyway, wouldn't you? Even without the addon Myers still has you exposed while in tier 3. Also if the Myers can get you while moving with 106% speed I have a hard time believing they really couldn't get you before. I think the Tombstone really isn't that much of a deal since it has a huge downside. The Tombstone Piece on the other hand is problematic since it's downsides are much more manageable and the still allows you to mori a survivor instantly.
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Because there is always people who think it is unfair that someone got stalked and they have to pay for it. But this is how Myers works: one weak link is all he needs.
Then there are people who still don't know that feeding Myers is a BAD idea. They probably only know that he's a "weak, loopable M1 killer" and they never really expect him to be a threat. When I started to play this game 4 years ago, my first killer main was Myers and I quickly understood that. Survivors don't look around, they camp pallets and they tbag. All feeds Myers.
People don't understand anymore how to position themselves on gens to fight a Myers before they even know if they face one or not, because he's so rare nowadays. I had to learn to always expect a Myers back in the day. No information perk could detect him in Tier 1. Not even Spine Chill. So you just positioned yourself at a Gen as you'd play vs a Myers. In a way that he a) couldn't grab you b) you would see him approaching before he could stalk and c) have an escape route with LOS blockers. You were on high alert until you knew it wasn't him.
I have 5.3k hrs now. And I never had any problems facing any Tombstone Myers. I never thought that it was unfair or similar. Fighting Myers is a team effort and when you don't accept that, the team will perish.
Simple.
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It's not so much about being "unfair to pay the price of someone else", but rather that a good Myers will stalk regardless of how good the opponents are. Emptying 3 survivors completely isn't that hard, it is a bit map dependant though.
You also have no way of knowing for sure (unless you're a very experienced SFW and are able to share how many seconds he stalked), and once he takes the first kill, the game is over.
The main problem isn't exactly about it being too strong or not (I mean, a very good nurse will still score better than a tombstone myers). The problem is that it guarantees a void game from the survivors, no matter how they play, they won't make any bloodpoints and will probably derank, even if they escape. It's not fun.
Honestly, the best counter isn't to get into lockers. The best counter is to just accept it, let yourself get killed, go on the next game and hope that he was just doing the achievement and now he got it, he will stop using this build, because honestly, this built is absolutely 0 fun to play, will also result in a void game for the killer (low BP and -1), overall, if it wasn't for the achievement, nobody would play that.
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Myers will also derank if he doesn't hook someone and maybe won't even get the BP for the addons back.
I really don't understand what's it with survivors nowadays who are not able to starve him. How difficult is that?
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Kind of the same logic as trickster. You can be good or bad, at some point, Myers will never do anything on lery, and survivors won't be able to do much against him in open maps.
And yes, I said it myself, Myers playing those will derank and gain little bloodpoints.
But there is an achievement litterally forcing you to play those...
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What if they could only kill injured survivors? That way, you just heal against it and it'll force a down.
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I know. I did that 4 years ago when hatch, infinite, insta heal and old DS were a thing. I still do it but I don't care. I have enough matches where gens get done before I get the first kill.
Survivors are just not that alert vs Myers anymore. It's almost like old Freddy. If you knew how, you could capitalize on Survivors thinking they were invulnerable.
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Myers add ons are fine he has to work for them and survivors can easily counter them by going to locker. Nurse, blight and sprit who are 100 times stronger than myers has most broken add ons in game so if anything should be done those three add ons should be nerfed.
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Tombstone add ons and fragment are carrying Myers. He sucks without them.
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Tombstone piece is a much bigger threat and is more consistent, if your solo q team mates r feeding him stalk you would probably just lose to a myers who plays normally anyway.
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"for the time being" = not now, later. Just in case that doesn't register to you :)
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