http://dbd.game/killswitch
How Eruption could have been nerfed
Keep the regression of 10% total progress. Keep the incapacitated. Make it only affect 1 gen at a time. Let it be countered by long chases.
Kicking a generator activates Eruption for 40/50/60 seconds. Putting a survivor into the dying state causes that gen to explode and lose 10% of its total progress. Survivors repairing the generator are incapacitated for the remainder of Eruption.
If the killer is ending chases in 20 seconds they are getting the same value as old Eruption, but only on one gen. Shorter chases, more value. Longer chases, less value. If the killer cannot get a down in 60 seconds, only the 10% regression applies.
Comments
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Just keep incapacitated to Killer powers.
Status effects that prevent gameplay should be reserved to killer powers, not perks or add-ons.
Like its so obvious incapacitated wasn't a good idea. You can't even do pinhead box while incapacitated for god sake.
Incapacitated with power is ok. On perks or add-ons no.
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In that case, I hope no one finds out that Grim Embrace is a perk that exists in DbD...
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That perk blocks gen. It's not incapacitation. There are still quite a few things you can do while the perk is active. Unlike Eruption incapacitation...
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Incapacitated status is pretty unfun and definitely not healthy on a perk that really badly affected solo survivors.
It makes sense on killers powers such as Victor or Pinheads chains but on a perk? I believe that it definitely doesn't make sense, as the perk shouldn't limit survivors not to do anything at all, they cannot progress the game in anyway. With a killer power they are already interacting with the killer so are progressing the game in some capacity.
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Grim Embrace is entirely different, survivors can still do other things, they can still heal, heal others, flashlight save, search chests, do totems etc. They're not limited to standing around or running around the map not progressing the game.
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"Incapacitated status is pretty unfun and definitely not healthy on a perk that really badly affected solo survivors."
So why not make an erupted generator just make the generator unable to be touched for 30 seconds? This rewards the killer for getting a down and rewards kicking generators.
Instead you ruined the perk. Remember Pop? Nobody uses it because you ruined it.
Against efficient survivors you need to end chases quickly and have some way to regress generators. You took away one of the best killer perks that encourages multiple chases.
With eruption gone the goal of every killer should now be : hard tunnel the first person hooked.
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You mean the perk that activates once per game, that needs you to get 4 hooks on all survivors without all the gens popping, that blocks gens for a whole 60 seconds while survivors reset and reboon?
Yeah, how could we miss that. Oh dear no, please don't run that perk against me.
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rewards kicking gens
This is precisely what we need less of
pop
Pop has been making a huge comeback lately. It's not old Pop, but it's a very underrated perk nonetheless and can let you shave off crazy gen time with PR.
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40 seconds... 😥
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Pop sucks. It's not worth the slot.
If lots of people started using Deja Vu - that wouldn't make it a good perk.
It takes like 2 seconds to kick a genertor and you reduce that generator by 4-7 seconds? That's trash.
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On "rewards kicking gens" ... yes, yes this is what we need more of because a killer NEEDS to kick gens. To not kick it is not an option based on how efficient survivors are right now.
On "Pop the weasel"
People don't run it because... it's low-key viable now... they run it because everything else was nerf to the ground so bad that this the scrap we have left!
I'm going to cry myself to sleep over how clueless these people are now
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Pop really does need some help. Please just no more "current progress." Nerf it to 15% if you have to. Just throw idea of current progress regression in the trash where it belongs.
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No, we don't need to buff reg any more. If survivors are too efficient, you don't nerf it by making the killer able to hold a 3 gen indefinitely; you nerf it by reducing efficiency. Basekit 60s corrupt would be much better than bringing back old pop.
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-"No, we don't need to buff reg any more."
Why would you say that?
The killer has 1/4th of the natural regression of one survivor and there are four survivors. This is a 1:16 ratio.
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Killer doesn't need to match the regression of survivors, and attempting to is what leads to stale gameplay like 3-gen camping. The fun part of this game is the chase, not kicking gens. If there's an issue with survivors doing gens too fast, we address that instead of turning trials into a footsie where survivors bring BNP commos and killers bring 4x slowdown.
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Regression is supposed to extend the killer's time, not prevent gens from happening.
You can argue if the values are balanced or not, but base regression being 1/4 of a survivor progression is that way for a reason.
Regression exist to buy time. The killer objective is to kill the survivor not to prevent gens.
This past 3 gen meta already kinda shows what happens if base regression is too strong, killers loose interest in chases and start defending gens and areas.
I am not saying what we have is perfect, but there is a reason base regression needs to be weak. In the end, for the best health of the game, buffing regression needs to be in a way that incentives active gameplay and chases
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-"Regression is supposed to extend the killer's time, not prevent gens from happening."
And the base value is so low it makes kicking generators be a waste of time without kick perks. We have plenty of videos where you see a 4 man SWF team finish the gens in under 3 minutes. And while this is extreme 4 minutes is still very possible. That's messed up. The killer objective is closer to 8 minutes unless the survivors make some massive mistake. And that is the problem with DBD because the time to finish generators is massively shorter than the time to finish the survivors.
You can't really defend the generators without perks and therefore must run 2-4 perks to defend generators if the survivors are efficient.
- "But I can play weak tier killer just fine in mid MMR with meme perks"
Yes that's just it.... you can play whatever at mid tiers and it works because people are not efficient.
-"Killer doesn't need to match the regression of survivors"
Killers need a meaningful way to slow down generators as part of their base kit besides : remove one player from the game. But that doesn't exist so killers just remove the first player to get hooked. What you've decided is that tunneling is fine because killers should not get meaningful generator defense perks.
Survivors got free base kit BT. Why didn't killers get free corrupt or deadlock? The answer is because survivor's wouldn't like it. The reality is that most people don't care if the killer objective gets tunneled. They only care if a survivor is marked for removal.
Objectives that cannot be defended lead to unfun feelings. This is especially the case when you are a survivor and your life becomes the killer's objective with their third hook. Most people forget that it isn't fun when you play killer and you have no chance to defend the generators. An organized team will "pre-run" whenever you focus on them and everyone else just sits on the generator with no real pressure directed towards them.
Survivors have at least 7 perks that can speed up generators. There are no meaningful perks to speed up a survivor's death. Imagine if killers had numerous perks to make you die faster. Imagine for example that the time to kill on a hook was reduced by 50-80% of what it is now. Would that be fun? The answer is no. Should that be a consideration for the game? No. What's the point in mentioning it? Maybe we shouldn't have any perks that speed up generators unless the killer can stack massive slowdown that cancels out multiple running "speed up" builds. Then the problem would be that the game would be unbearable if gens took forever and you had no "speed up" perks to cancel the slowdown.
You may or not be aware but most of the maps we have are nowhere near close to being fair. Most of them are too large, have too many safe loops or have way too many "time wasting" map features.
Now if you play Blight or Nurse all the maps are "fine". But that leaves nearly the entire killer roster with a problem. Do we just say only Blight and Nurse can play 50% of the maps? That works and is a simple fix. But most people won't like that - if you use a farm offering and you're not playing Blight or Nurse the only viable option is abattoir. A red forest offering is just outright refunded and the game picks some other map that is ~9000m².
A more simple solution is to just say give every killer 120% speed if they lack a movement power (including teleports) or projectile attack. Trapper, Pig, and Doctor would be a lot more viable with +5% base speed. Yes they would ruin a lot of the "safe" loops and that's exactly the point.
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Dude, if you don't want to listen to valid reasons and complaints of why things don't work how you want there is nothing i can do.
Killer regression cannot ever compete with survivor progression, the devs aren't dumb. And just because you think something you think is a good idea, you probably don't know what consequences they can cause. I don't know and seeing different perspectives helps me see how things that i think are good ideas can be really bad. So maybe listen a bit.
Also, besides all the problems i said buffing base regression brings. If they do it, they will nerf regression perks to compensate. Killers will not stop bringing 4 slowdowns if you buff base regression
Post edited by BlueHorkew on2 -
Did you even read my post? I agree with you that gen times are a problem. The solution isn't to match it with something equally problematic on the killer's side. Regression (even with perks) should never be as strong as it currently is. If survivors are doing gens too quick, we address that instead of making killers able to match that speed.
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While I agree that basekit Corrupt would probably be the best solution, wouldn't buffing Pop and then maybe nerfing Call of Brine and Overcharge, at least their synergy, not be good to lessen 3 genning? Because with Pop you actually need to down and hook a survivor, and then you get to regress a gen.
i feel like PGTW is one of the healthiest slowdown perks in the game. Certainly more healthy than the Call of Brine and Overcharge combo.
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Current pop is fine imo. Provides just enough regression to slow down a high progress gen, without being stupid oppressive when your teammates are feeding hooks. If anything, bump it up to 25% of current progress.
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-"Current pop is fine imo."
That's fine use it. Most people don't because it was reduced in effectiveness on average by about 13 seconds of regression less than it gave before.
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Comp players still use it. If you think you know better than comp players, by all means.
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I think its good you all acknowledge about the loss of control idea being bad for perks. Can we look at the current Tunnelling meta next? I feel the 6.1.0 changes enabled it more than anything else (reduced hit cds enable stbfl, Decisive Strikes nerfs) I think they are good for chases, but the hook gameplay atm is really problematic.
it's just frustrating to see one point acknowledged but a larger issue with the core gameplay ignored.
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Comp scene is completely different. They also sometimes used NOED before it became a only on regular attacks perk.
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Are you also implying NOED is a bad perk?
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So... moral of story is:
Survivors hates:
1. Getting tunneled
2. Getting face camped
3. Zoning that denies them good tiles
4. A killer with high mobility
5. A killer that can lockdown three gen
6. A killer with projectiles.
7. A killer that brings meta perks (sweaty)
Etc.
My point with all this?
How about we COMPLETELY ignore the survivors mains for a good while, they had enough free wins.
Buff killers in every conceivable ways please, I want to have funn too.
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NOED is a terrible perk. it was used well in comp before it worked on all attacks. It was a great perk in 2016.
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Yeah I can't take you seriously, I'm sorry.
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Most people playing "normally" never use NOED. It was good in 2016 and if you don't know why - go have a look.
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