Windows of Opportunity - OP?

Options
2»

Comments

  • Kaitsja
    Kaitsja Member Posts: 1,718
    Options

    Which is a problem with the maps.

    Even with the variability, you can still reliably assume where a majority of the pallets are. This is especially true at the start of the match where the killer has no pressure and survivors are making their way to generators. Every player has knowledge of where things are as the match progresses. Killers can identify strong loops as they patrol generators.

    I don't believe Windows is making survivors who are low skill have the same chase time as veteran survivors. I've never seen a low skill survivor hold a chase for more than 15 seconds. Windows shows you the auras, but it's up to the individual player to plan ahead.

    I'd argue that the killer isn't nearly as skilled as they think they are if a low skill player is looping them for the same amount of time a veteran would. Low skill players tend to only think about their immediate solution, rather than planning ahead. A veteran player is thinking about their next loop before they even hit their first loop. They're already planning ahead.

    Windows has only become popular because of everything else that was nerfed. Let's be real here, most of the perks in this game are either extremely niche and situational to the point of being useless outside of that niche, or they're blatantly overpowered and need nerfs. There are very few perks that fall into a grey area of being not great, but not terrible either.

    Windows is easily countered, and it won't even cost the killer a perk slot. They could even sacrifice a perk slot to run The Third Seal and it not be cleansed until all the gens are done because it has such little effect on survivors.

    Skill expression is important, but at the end of the day, Dead by Daylight is a casual game where skill doesn't always determine the winner. Sometimes it's luck, and sometimes it's broken perks/items.

  • Anti051
    Anti051 Member Posts: 578
    edited June 2023
    Options

    You think it's small to have a perfect prescience of where everything is at all times?

  • Sharby
    Sharby Member Posts: 498
    Options

    Just wait until Made For This releases and people will forget any other perk exists.

  • Pink_Ronin
    Pink_Ronin Member Posts: 118
    Options

    Goes to show there's a lot of a bad killers with loud voices who will always find something to complain about.

  • Rulebreaker
    Rulebreaker Member Posts: 1,633
    Options

    We know that this might distract from the topic, but those saying nerf Windows, what about Zanshin Tactics? Does it not effectively do the same thing as windows?

  • Sava18
    Sava18 Member Posts: 2,437
    Options

    I'm not here to say nerf windows but zanshin is far less useful for killer than WoO is for survivors. A survivor can't see every pallet that gets dropped by their teamates but a killer can remember every pallet that's been dropped.

  • Kaitsja
    Kaitsja Member Posts: 1,718
    Options

    They effectively do the same thing, but Zanshin is far less valuable to killers than Windows is to survivors.

  • IamFran
    IamFran Member Posts: 1,605
    edited June 2023
    Options

    I think it needs a nerf despite I'm being a WoO user when playing as survivor. However in my opinion the nerf shouln't be bringing back the cooldown, the nerf should be reducing the max range to 16 meters, the problematic thing of that perk is knowing exactly where to go after you use the pallet or window in the tile you are playing at any given moment, if the max range is 16 you pretty much only see where are the windows or pallet of the tile in which you are which isn't that problematic, it only help to people who haven't memorized the structures yet.

  • Yippiekiyah
    Yippiekiyah Member Posts: 461
    Options

    When there's 100+ survivor perks in the game and 1 in 3 are running this perk that is a massive issue in itself regardless of whether you think it is too strong or not.

  • Hawk81584
    Hawk81584 Member Posts: 405
    Options

    That’s a horrible argument, every match I go into killers are running sloppy butcher should we nerf it to

  • Nazzzak
    Nazzzak Member Posts: 4,977
    Options

    It's telling that the popular survivor perks are mostly older ones, even several years old, and still some players want them nerfed. Survivors can't have anything halfway decent without certain people up in arms about it.

    New survivor gen perk? No, it'll lead to gen rushing. New exhaustion perk? No, gives too much chase value. New endurance perk? No, free health state. Aura perk? OP and selfish. /s

    Honestly, next survivor BHVR just shouldn't bother giving any perks.

  • Veroles
    Veroles Member Posts: 868
    Options

    I do not really understand why people really think WoO is OP. A perk is not overpowered because it has a high pick rate. That only shows that the perk is liked very much and helpful. WoO is definitely not OP nor it has to do with skill to use it.

    This perk is in a lot of games more a harm bringer than a good useful utility because a lot people use it less effective and predrop pallets a lot, what is in a beginning of a match maybe an advantage but when you do couple of aggro changes it takes literally almost no time to clear tons of pallets, and as experienced killer that's a welcome gift.

    It's pretty amusing how often i am able to predict that someone runs this perk because in most cases you can see it how the survivor acts. (At least for me)

    WoO in experienced hands where people do know exactly how to loop, this perk is more or less a wasted slot. It can give sometimes an advantage, but as good player you have in mind where pallets are dropped, you have a guess where killer had chases in most cases and which area is most likely unsafe.

    Of course, there are situations where WoO would avoid getting downed as good player, but nevertheless the value what a good looper can have with it is not that high than most would think.

    When i play survivor i do not use it because of different reasons:

    • It would make me lazy and I would feel like I was on autopilot using all the palettes like a robot.
    • It literally gives me a headache because everything is too bright.
    • It gives me no real advantage anyway, because i am experienced and it's simply a wasted slot in most cases.
  • Nazzzak
    Nazzzak Member Posts: 4,977
    Options

    All your comment does is highlight the sorry state of survivor perk options. People will pick perks that they feel will give them the best chance of survival (just like killers pick perks that they feel will give them the best chance of a 4k) and it's saying something if 1 in 3 find themselves falling back on one perk in particular. Chase/looping is probably most survivors weak spot and I guarantee WoO doesn't immediately take them from barely lasting 10 seconds to suddenly running multiple gens. It buys them seconds at best while they slowly learn and improve.

    I think it's why all the complaints around Made For This bothered me. The high use of WoO shows that players feel they need some assistance when it comes to chase, so more chase perks options are a good thing and will help see less use of WoO.

  • humanbeing1704
    humanbeing1704 Member Posts: 8,803
    edited June 2023
    Options

    Not an op perk but it exposes that maps are complete garbage when it comes to overpowered chain loops still

  • VirtuaTyKing
    VirtuaTyKing Member Posts: 452
    edited June 2023
    Options

    I use it myself a lot of the time. I gotta say though it's making the best option for killer to create dead zones to counter it.

    This playstyle gets pretty boring as it ends up being a long draw out match.

    Along with having to run 4 gen perks because they are so weak. Also gets boring.

    A fair solution would be... no idea.

  • Dreamnomad
    Dreamnomad Member Posts: 3,704
    Options

    Perk is fine. Even if there was 100% usage rate it would still be fine. It doesn't actually do anything when you get down to it. Really good survivors could chain loops together just fine before this perk existed. If anything, it just bridges the skill gap between survivors a bit.

  • Katzengott
    Katzengott Member Posts: 1,205
    Options

    I got addicted to WoO since they started with the map reworks, even WoO had a cooldown.

    Now many maps are VERY dark and have so much clutter when you play on ultra settings without filters.

    Also you can use WoO like a radar when you don't have eyesight on the killer / chase. That extra information when you see live when and where a pallet is dropped (or breakable wall is getting broken) can be really strong sometimes aswell.

  • Yippiekiyah
    Yippiekiyah Member Posts: 461
    Options

    Sloppy Butcher has a 14% pick rate according to nightlight, so you should see it around in in every 7 games, windows you will see every game as killer.

  • Yippiekiyah
    Yippiekiyah Member Posts: 461
    Options

    Yet survivors have many S tier perks, how many do killers have?

  • tkwmm
    tkwmm Member Posts: 103
    Options

    Not really, the perk only allow survivor to understand the maps better, and know how to utilize the pallets / window that already existed. Keep in mind that, Decent survivor doesn't need that perk because they understand the maps and the loop well.

    The reason it is highly use is because most of the survivor doesn't play the game 24/7, and not able to memorize every detail / loop of the maps.

    Also, the perk itself doesn't provide 2nd chance, doesn't allow survivor to make distance from killer (exhausted perk).

    From a killer side, I rather survivor bring WoO, it mean that survivor wasted a slot for much stronger perk that I have to worry about (gen rush perk, 2nd chance perk, exhausted perk etc).

  • Aurelle
    Aurelle Member Posts: 3,611
    Options

    Windows Of Opportunity is fine. Maps are not.

    Perks don't need nerfs or changes just because they have a high usage rate.

  • Rulebreaker
    Rulebreaker Member Posts: 1,633
    Options

    Yet at the same time Zanshin can tell when theres alot of resourses for survivors to use, meaning drop them after burning some resources (or keep going cause theres little). What we've been hearing is that Windows is "OP" cause of things like this:

    Its just getting...sad? Theres ways to counter it, ways to play around it, hell theres an EQUAL for killers if they use their heads, yet we see nerf this and that.

  • Rovend
    Rovend Member Posts: 1,047
    Options

    if you consider that like 70% of all survivor perks are either useless, extremely situational, nerfed versions of existing perks or have a wall of restrictions attached to it you'll see that your argument does not hold a lot of value.

  • KenwanObinobi
    KenwanObinobi Member Posts: 185
    Options

    Yes it is busted, especially because it allows every player to optimize looping knowing exactly where the pallets are from the start to the end of the trial.

    But that is not the only busted perk, the number of perks being garabge and totally shifting the balance of the trial might be around 20 to 30 perks (15 for each side).

    Rose add-ons are also busted for both sides.

    Map offerings are a major problem.

    Andi could go on and on. I guess i could write at least 10 pages on what is wrong with this game and what needs to be adressed. The fact is that the devs are completely trapped into the game design they have built over the years, adding the perk A to counter the OP perk B but then the perk A is OP so we need to create the perk C to counter it...

    Well it is a never ending story cause the game has become too complex, not in a smart way.

  • Raconteurminator
    Raconteurminator Member Posts: 618
    Options

    I don’t think Windows of Opportunity is overpowered, but I’d definitely say it’s mechanically broken. Environmental awareness is a very large part of playing Survivor and quite probably the most important thing you can learn. You can be the best looper going, but if you don’t have a healthy grasp of where you are in relation to your outs at all times, you’re gonna have a bad time.

    Windows of Opportunity circumvents a lot of the need for environmental awareness by replacing it with a GPS. It’s a fine argument to say it can help players learn a map better, but once they have, the perk doesn’t suddenly become useless; it still does away with a lot of the decision making required to do well.

    If a change were to be made to it, I’d want to see something time-based. Less than 200hrs playtime, get the full effect, for example. 50hrs after that, reduce the radius by X amount. Don’t nerf the perk into the ground, but let it serve its purpose as training wheels and have it gradually reduce to the point where it can still be useful situationally but not so useful you can turn your brain off.