Are we gonna ignore this meta build problem forever?
I have to deal with stuff like this almost every single match.
This was a swf team of 4 people. And this is just one example.
I get that solo-q players cannot really coordinate their perks but swf's? That's just a joke right there. Why would I even try playing a Tier C killer if this is what I get.
I loved to play dredge but with team around like this why even bother.
I think we should either come up with a game system that does not allow swf's to have the same characters and builds 4 times (2 max) or divide the player base by adding 'casual, tournament and hardcore (no perks no add-ons no items)' game modes to the game.
These people are sweating a lake out here while others just want to have fun.
At this point I understand why I have not seen any Tier B or Tier C killer lately.
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Different game modes like that means more queues, meaning more wait time and less probability of getting into games, depending which mode you're playing in. Also gives the opportunity for players to purposefully join the wrong queue just to mess up games.
I get it, when I've played Killer against SWFs like this, it sucks. But either you keep playing and keep pushing, or you give up, maybe AFK or farm. Make the best of the situation, understand that its how the game works and sometimes this stuff happens, understand that you happened against a group that isn't really play-againstable with your current Killer/build, and just 'gg go next'.
As Survivor, if I bring a flashlight or medkit and run into, say, someone with Lightborn, or a Plague/someone with an anti-heal build, it sucks. But you just keep playing; you don't go into the endgame chat and yell at the Killer for bringing in those perks/character. It's pure chance, most of the time. You just 'gg, go next' and hope the next game is better. 😔
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Tbh i don't see a problem in these perks. They all use exhaustion perks, best perks in the game and you just have 3, which you can more or less rely on if you play them for chases: SB, Lithe and Balanced where Balanced is defiently the most situational one. 3 use an anti-tunnel perk so just don't tunnel early game. 3 of them use windows which is only wasting a perk slot if you are in a coordinated SWF - you could call every droppeld pallet instead and use something else. All of them use adrenaline which is an endgame perk so they need to reach the endgame at all to get use of that - high risk, high reward.
The game gets constantly changed into killers favor (reducing cooldown, hit distance, "reworking" maps by making them smaller and adding tons of clutter with no safe loops) so i am wondering that i don't see any gen perks like deja vu or somehing around hyperfocus. Survivors simply don't have a chance besides playing sweaty in the early game and most of the survivor perks are just terrible. So if you want to see more perk diversity, survivor side needs more perks with an actual use.
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You got a 4K.
Post edited by Lixadonna on21 -
While lightborn might become more regulary the pickrate of plague and skull merchant is pretty low. Yet I do face this almost every match. Especially on evenings when I want to play bit after work it seems there are lots of swf teams around who all bring a build like this + red addon medkits.
So if I just throw the game once I realise it's this kind of match again, that would make up 80 % of the matches. I take the longer queue wait time in this case tbh
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Especially windows is a problem. It drags out every chase to an unfair amount of time because how is seeing every resource in your reach not overpowered?
Laser himself said it in an interview just a few days ago. Swf makes the game extremly survivor sided up to the point you have to play the most burtal and most advanced way you can think of. I don't really enjoy playing that sweaty.
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I brought midwich offering as dredge and it was my only win that day. I snipped it from that match because it was my last game of the evening and decided to adress the problem.
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I think we should either come up with a game system that does not allow swf's to have the same characters and builds 4 times (2 max) or divide the player base by adding 'casual, tournament and hardcore (no perks no add-ons no items)' game modes to the game.
believe it or not, the game is balanced around you being able to run 4 of the same build. "competitive scene" tries to nerf survivor by limiting the perks. The obvious problem is that killer that are unplayable are unplayable because they're too weak and no amount of perk restriction is going change the killer's lack of viability. In short, BVHR is bad at balancing killers into optimal power-level. With that being said, your image is 4k meaning your not having trouble with the killer your playing.
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- Windows is a problem? You could run Zanshin Tactics. You could also run: Bamboozle, Hex: CC, Dissolution, Hex: Blood Favor, etc..
- Exhaustion perks are a problem? You could run Mindbreaker, Septic Touch, Blood Echo, etc.. Even some addons, depending on the Killer you're playing.
- Items a problem? Franklins. (Or again, certain addons for certain Killers.)
My point was not "oh, you're just being childish, complaining like this." My point was "I get it, it sucks to play when the other side has a well put-together plan and/or build. But it's just the nature of the game, and it's up to you to decide how you react, and try not to let it get to you."
I'm sorry these seem to be the majority of your rounds. Really, I've been there, and that does suck. I'm hoping they'll shake up the meta, for both sides, sometime soon, just so we can see something new.
Speaking of, my last potential recommendation is "try something new." Try perks or a Killer you've maybe never tried, and take it easy; understand that because you're trying something new, the games may not work out as you hope. You may not get many kills. But the point is to have fun. So... I hope it helps. And if it doesn't, sorry again.
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So you complain about meta perks, but all survs of your example got killed. Killer hypocrisy at its best. Just take a look at how killers play, then ask yourself again.
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While a lack of variety can be somewhat annoying and boring, I don't think these builds you're showing are particularly problematic.
You've got two perks that you as a killer don't need to care about; Windows barely does anything for teams on comms, it's just a nice thing to have without really being all that impactful, and OTR is extremely hard to weaponise so the only real impact it'll have is fairly consistent lack of aura reading. That last part isn't nothing, but it's also not really something you have to be mindful of or react to beyond using basekit tracking.
Then you've got the two Exhaustion perks you're facing, and while I personally find Sprint Burst annoying, I don't think it needs any changes. Lithe is fine, too, and there's also the fact that there are enough Exhaustion perks for you to be facing one on every survivor even with restrictions.
Finally Adrenaline, the only perk I think is actually something worth talking about because stacking that four times can be pretty demoralising. Whether or not Adrenaline needs a nerf, though, let's take a step back and ask how many perks these survivors actually have for the majority of the game: One. They have their Exhaustion perk, and then three perks that are either safety nets against certain tactics or just not doing anything for them. At most, they have OTR's aura blocking, which only counts depending on what you're running. Windows has barely any effect beyond easing mental load, Adrenaline does nothing until the endgame, OTR does either absolutely nothing or very very little if you don't tunnel depending on if you brought aura reading.
Certainly, these aren't builds that annihilate lower tier killers and render the games unplayable. They're just kinda... generically pretty good perks smushed together with little synergy.
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Players who have zero originality and just run whatever they saw at the top of "dbdtierlist.com" are boring, sure. But when I look at these perks, I'm amazed at how generally unproblematic our current survivor meta is. Nothing on the level of old Dead Hard, Circle of Healing, or Made for This at play.
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I guess you have not read all the comments. So to you and @Devil_hit11 I will repeat it. I brought the map offering midwich while playing the dredge. Yes I don't have a problem with the killer (well lets say I do but thats regarding him being so dependant on perks add ons and locker rng) but midwich is the single best map for dredge. It was my only win that evening as I wanted to have some fun for my last game, so I brought the offering. Midwhich dredge is a true nightmare. Yet the post is not about dredge. It is about having to deal with builds that are very forgiving for mistakes. Not every killer is able to make up for a mistake in chase but with meta builds you sure have a lot more room and your skill as survivor does not really matter anymore. You just hold w to the next resource and drop it, repeat.
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The perks simply need to be nerfed. Especially WoO. Basically draws a giant red arrow from one of those YouTube clickbait saying "RUN HERE"
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Why would WoO need to be nerfed? Actually good players already know where windows and pallets spawn. And SWF, the most powerful survivors, can just call out which pallets they've already thrown, so they don't need WoO. The only thing it does is prevent solo players from running to dead zones, and help newer players who haven't developed map knowledge.
You're also forgetting that WoO can be countered by killer's best information perk at the moment, Ultimate Weapon.
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The game isn't really constantly changing pro one side or the other. The devs swing wildly between one then the other. They did change mft (months later), but they added anticamping. The clutter you're complaining about is more survivor sided than killer. They are working on antislugging and a nerf to stbfl.
The issue the skill valley. Low mmr survivors get stomped, and never get the chance to get to mid mmr. This catapults killers into high mmr fast. High mmr survivors, in turn, stomp killers very hard. Both teams feel they need to be as toxic and as meta as possible for a chance
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Not every swf remembers dropped pallets or plays competitive in first place. No competitive dbd player runs a build like that.
Even so you see pt100 survivors running these builds or WoO. So yeah they should do it without it but they don't because they are afraid they will mess it up.
These builds are annoying because bad survivors can behave like good survivors without the training. And mindgames are hardly possible as they just drop every resource and run to the next yellow box. A squad like the one above would be way lower in mmr becaues they constantly would mess it up. yet they feel like theyre good just because they dropped pallets and hold w.
And thats why a lot of people think its too strong. Showing you every resource and therefor every safe spot is something you should earn by knowledge and not be given without condition unlimited by a single perk.
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This is probably why dbd felt so bad lately. Every survivor I face is toxic and so is every killer.
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Complaining about fine perks, that aren‘t really strong, only because there are no real perks to complain about. Nerfing those perks will make people loosing hope in behaviors balancing ideas. Survivors already have mostly useless perks.
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Thats a pretty wild shot considering survivors having access to every trick in the book. Swf makes dbd extremly survivor sided. I don't say bhvr is bad at balancing but some things are ridicilous.
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Not really, I play a lot with friends and I would go that far to say I loose more with them.
Compare stats, survivor/ killer win streaks and everything else, it becomes obvious that the killer has everything in their hand.
Personally I don‘t think it’s the right way to balance everything around top tier players. It makes the game miserable for everyone else.
Don‘t get me wrong, it can be really frustrating as killer, but the problem is not, that it is survivor sided. More so some killers (not the player, the character) are just really bad bad, they should absolutely get buffs, instead of removing cool perks from the survivors and nerf them into uselessness. Right now survivors don‘t have more than those perks that you showed.
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Well I can't say I have the same experience. But me and my friends rarely play in a competitive way. We don't play clock system or stuff like that but still you gain more information then a solo-q player. It kind of depends what point of view you take. I think some issues need to be adressed in the game system, some killers reworked but ultimately a perk which has just by its existence the potential to drag out every chase by an extreme amount of time without a downside unlimited. Thats the kind of stuff that needs to be nerfed. Like they had to nerf pain resonance becaues it was totally op, especially in combination with dead man's switch.
I think there is much to do in balancing and bhvr for some reason never seems to think things to the end when designing killers or perks
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There won't be a meta shake up till later this year.
you watch.
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There’s no way to get rid of SWFS, if that were to happen I don’t think anyone would play the game anymore.
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I think we should either come up with a game system that does not allow swf's to have the same characters and builds 4 times (2 max) or divide the player base by adding 'casual, tournament and hardcore (no perks no add-ons no items)' game modes to the game.
punishing people for playing with their friends sucks and split gamemodes wouldnt actually fix any of these problems. casual mode would be full of people tryharding for clips, tournament would have constant ruleset disagreements and hardcore would be a fun gimmick that'd die almost immediately because people like their perks.
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Nobody said we should get rid of it.
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Its not about punishing swf for playing with friends. It's about getting to a common ground on balancing and rulesets. I hate tunnel killer as much as meta build swf squads or bully squads. So if you gain a huge avantage because youre on discrod swf coordinating your team then you also should face some conditions to keep it fair.
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