Spirit is way too weak without addons, and pretty strong with them. This needs to change.
With how unbelievably grindy this game is, if you haven't been playing since release, and playing constantly, killers who require good addons to be viable at the Red Ranks are extremely frustrating, since a lot of these killers are pretty fun.
The issue then becomes that with addons, some killers because almost stupidly too strong, which is really not fun as a survivor either. Billy, Doctor, Huntress, and yes Spirit, can start off anywhere from "meh" to borderline OP, and then addons radically shift the balance way too far into the killer's favor. Hillbilly is just straight up great without addons, as is Nurse, but then you give him instant chainsaw with great turning, or Nurse with 3 to 5 blinks, and the game is just straight up bullshit.
Doctor is actually really weak without addons, but give him super large shock range with crazy affects of Maddness II and III, and suddenly he's a 4k machine.
Spirit, being one of the newer killers, is just loads of fun. The problem is that her power is awful at the red ranks, because everyone seems to know when you're coming for them. There are a ton of counters, like Iron Will, Lightweight, and Dance With Me that make tracking in spirit mode almost impossible (LW and Dance with Me not being meta, so not seen too often), but sound bugs and scratch mark bugs that probably won't be fixed until the end of this year, knowing BHVR's fix record, has made Spirit considerably less fun.
Also, take into consideration that her power takes way too long to charge, she's slow, and her power requires a lot of mind gaming to use right, and you have a killer who is essentially Huntress without hatchets most of the time, and really can't provide any map pressure against survivors who know to just urban ninja into hiding when they hear her use her power.
Of course you can start using Rare Addons that will start pushing her into seriously obnoxious territory, and you basically end up with a killer who can now compete with survivors who are just going to slam out gens in ridiculous time.
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Hahaha docter op sure.
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@ThirdSealOPplzNerf said:
Hahaha docter op sure.Did you even read what I wrote?
Doctor is weak without addons. He becomes insanely strong with very rare addons, and the right perk build to accompany it. The fact he needs addons to not get ######### on by survivors is a huge problem with how a lot of the killers have been balanced.
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She'd do much better overall with a shorter cooldown. I feel that's the main issue with her power overall, requiring you to have 100% charge in order for it to be used.
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Add-ons should be a bonus, not a requirement. Every killer should be able to do well with or without modifying their power. Apparently the developers didn't get the message or don't really see the flaw with the current state of most add-on dependent killers.
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I disagree about Doc too: even with best addons, he's hardly a "4K machine".
But more to the point: although I feel the Spirit is strong even without addons (I play her a lot), what you describe is one of the biggest problems with the game: almost all killers depend heavily on addons and offerings. There's a world of difference between using any killer with pink/purple addons and using the same killer with weaker or no addons. A lot of times the outcome of a match does not depend on how well either side plays as much as what kind of addons are in place. I guess we can come to terms with it and say some games are very challenging (not necessarily a bad thing) and sometimes we have an easier time. But I wish in general all addons were weaker and base killer abilities and powers were stronger.
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Did you see Legion?0
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@George_Soros said:
But I wish in general all addons were weaker and base killer abilities and powers were stronger.Won't happen with the developers' mindset of believing that all killers shouldn't be valid at higher ranks. They rather band-aid in power through add-ons and perks, rather than improving the killers outright.
Post edited by se05239 on1 -
@se05239 said:
@George_Soros said:
But I wish in general all addons were weaker and base killer abilities and powers were stronger.Won't happen with the developers' mindset of believing that all killers should be valid at higher ranks. They rather band-aid in power through add-ons and perks, rather than improving the killers outright.
I think you phrased it wrong: they explicitly said they DO NOT think all killers should be viable at high ranks (I think that's what you meant just not what you said).
There is a rationale behind it, and it is a business rationale. People like the illusion of success, right? For the devs, to keep as many players (customers!) as happy as possible, they have to make them feel good about themselves. If it was a completely balanced, skill based game (say, like chess), it would leave at least half of us dissatisfied and frustrated. Hence, the solution is the creation of one time use, strong addons which give players with modest abilities a fighting chance, so they can have their win at least once in a while.While I don't particularly like this concept (people should toughen up, learn to enjoy a challenge and don't let losses discourage them), the reality is that most of us emotionally need this.
By the way, the ranking system is designed the way it is with the same goal in mind: basically, you don't have to be extremely good at the game to get to rank 1. (I say this as one of these boosted rank 1-s
)Plus, also from a business perspective, the dire need for strong addons is very useful if the devs want to have a lot of regular and active players. The grind is a strong incentive. In fact, many MMOG developers know exactly that grind for BP, XP or whatever is potentially more addictive than most other game features.
So, not to say I completely approve this approach, but it's unlikely that they'll ever try to work around that. Business considerations trump most other aspects.
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@George_Soros said:
@se05239 said:
@George_Soros said:
But I wish in general all addons were weaker and base killer abilities and powers were stronger.Won't happen with the developers' mindset of believing that all killers should be valid at higher ranks. They rather band-aid in power through add-ons and perks, rather than improving the killers outright.
I think you phrased it wrong: they explicitly said they DO NOT think all killers should be viable at high ranks (I think that's what you meant just not what you said).
Woops! Fixed. Critical letters getting lost in the heat of the moment..
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Simple most of the killers is not syrong becose he is in base strong but only with the best addons.And that is sad you need the best addons to fell power role as killer in most of case killers.Adfons are not just addons they are your primal wepon vs sef or survs on higher ranks when you use week killer what is the mostof all killers.0
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@Demoth said:
@ThirdSealOPplzNerf said:
Hahaha docter op sure.Did you even read what I wrote?
Doctor is weak without addons. He becomes insanely strong with very rare addons, and the right perk build to accompany it. The fact he needs addons to not get ######### on by survivors is a huge problem with how a lot of the killers have been balanced.
Both doc and spirit are not even close to nurse, even with best addons. Thus they are not too strong
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I honestly don't see a problem. Addons are a core mechanics to killer gameplay, if they weren't required matches against the same killer would all feel the same. Imo it's more worthy to ask for less grind.
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Your right!! I agree with you, spirit with good addons is so overpowered but without them she's weak
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@White_Owl said:
I honestly don't see a problem. Addons are a core mechanics to killer gameplay, if they weren't required matches against the same killer would all feel the same. Imo it's more worthy to ask for less grind.Well, less grind is essentially what is needed, because I haven't been playing since launch. This means that I get a killer to 50, and then I want to level up other killers and get stuck in this loop of grinding with a killer with BP boosters, but burning through all my addons to level up another killer. This has left me with a lot of level 50 (and several P3 level 50 killers) who have no addons, so I basically can't play them unless I either want to halt my progress or leveling other killers and survivors so I can get them addons, or just play them and get my ######### slapped by Rank 1 toolbox gen jockies.
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