http://dbd.game/killswitch
Not feeling good about map and key reworks
i dont feel like maps are good at finding gens, only good on rpd i feel like. Worse than before. The fact totems are purple add-on and you cant have the windows effect at the same time sucks... they STILL dont reveal chests. Key revealing survivor aura feels a bit too paltry. Why would bring a key to unlock a chest so you can replace the item that you brought? Only thing that seems decent to me is the wedding ring add-on which is basically better aura of blood pact.
Comments
-
I just came here to see if the totem addon was bugged. IDK why they thought making base maps not work with totems anymore was a good idea, let alone needing an addon that disables the entire other part of the map. I doubt I'll be using maps anymore.
17 -
No one brings a map over medkit or a flashlight. Not an issue at all.
-26 -
I don't actually know if it's intended or not but i'll assume for now that it is. It sucks, it's not worth bringing that add-on unless you have boons because if theres no hexes. Dramaturgy and Ace in the Hole could also get this add-on which sucks too…
9 -
Pretty sure the devs would disagree, its why they did this update in the first place, it just isn't quite there.
21 -
Maps were the only Item I used but not anymore. Such a downgrade. They no longer work with Detective's Hunch or Open Handed and the Add-On that tracks Totems is now Purple instead of either being basekit in the Map or being the Blue Add-On it was before.
I guess Trapper gameplay is more important even though the odds of that happening were pretty low. 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️
24 -
belongings are purple? ugh. boons got more expensive x.x
12 -
I have to agree. I gave them feedback about it in the ptb but I don‘t think they are gonna tweak them anytime soon again.
I really liked old maps and their functions (revealing gens, totems, hatch, killer belongings…). All they needed to do was make the rainbow map the base one and give it something additional to what it already does. Windows of opportunity as function for the maps is nice, but not at the cost of losing what made them great before.
For keys they distroyed the only reason I wanted to use them, the blood amber addon. It is pointless now. The new things are nice, but honestly why would use it them for just that?
Overall both items suffer from the new charge system which is so much worse than the old system which worked with time. I could use my items a lot more (-/+20times) with their old system, but nope now I have 6 uses which is barely anything. They could have done the recharge over time thing for both items instead of the new system which would have been a thousand times better or add an aura linger for everything except blood amber.
19 -
The map is good for chase builds and being in chase, now instead of needing Windows u can bring a different perk and still essentially have windows
-9 -
Maps are completely dead
Keys still open hatch so not 100% dead, but keys without blood amber are useless
18 -
I miss playing autohaven and rpd daily so much 😢
-4 -
This is not about map offerings.
9 -
I agree. I loved playing with maps and the key. The map i liked the way you were able to use it instead of now how you only have five times. As for keys I played with the weaved ring and milky glass when my keys were getting low. Now they've removed those perks, which will affect my gameplay. I do not understand them removing those add ons unless they're trying to force us players to use different items which defeats the purpose of us playing this game to begin with.I really hope that they'll bring them back or maybe implement a system where I could trade in one of my five thousand medkits for a couple keys. I really only play with three items, depending on who i'm loading in with. Key, map or toolbox. Now they have basically nerfed two of them.
8 -
I appreciate the different perspectives in here! If you don't mind me interjecting to ask two questions (since I'd love to share this feedback with the team):
- What is one change that would increase your enjoyment of the Map item rework?
- What about for the Key item rework?
1 -
Personally I'd love it if maps could track chests! At least maybe the higher tier ones since the only way to track chests is perks now and needing an entire perk slot for that feels bad for such a niche effect.
Maybe higher rarity keys could make the survivor aura reveal also show your aura to your teammates as well? (Like a mini aftercare effect). I think keys are pretty good right now though, broken keys are actually useful compared to previous iterations.
1 -
Give us back the weaved ring add on. I also used the weaved ring and milky glass because keys are so hard to get in the bloodweb so this helped me keep my item whether I died or used it on hatch. Now if I don’t survive the match my key is just gone.
Maybe you can clarify but the patch notes made it seem like if you use the key on hatch then it doesn’t consume the key anymore is this correct? If so then I’m fine with milky glass being gone but weaved ring is an add on that I specifically collected that are now useless.
Also the pink maps used to track totems and all killer items and now it seems like you’ve made all the maps only have windows of opportunity value as base and we now need add ons for everything else. Thats useless to me because if I wanted to see vaults and pallets I’d just run windows. I used maps for the ability to track items not pallets and vaults.
1 -
Maps should've still worked with Open Handed.
9 -
I have two entire posts dedicated solely to the new maps and keys, but the main things are:
Maps:
- They should track gens alongside pallets/windows without having to use the light beam. The beam is cool, but it'd still be cool even if it just revealed your location to other survivors and the object auras. (This should also work for other objects.)
- They should be able to track Chests, (maybe even basekit) and Exit Gates through add-ons.
- There is no reason for more experienced players to use them. This could be solved by adding some add-ons in the vein of the Pocket Mirror mechanic.
- Sharpened Flint should be uncommon.
- The iri is contradicting the purpose of Maps, as they reveal static objects. This would not be an issue if the Empathy effect was not removed from the event Map.
Keys:
- Pretty good, I like the new chest build opportunities they give.
- The iri is a bit too weak imo. The downsides outweigh it.
Overall, they can be great, but some adjustments would be good.
7 -
Honestly I'd like to see the map addon for tracking killer belongings come back. While it's not the greatest effect ever I did enjoy the interesting interactions where you could track things like trapper's bear traps, hooks and more importantly chests too. As for the keys I don't really have much to say about them, I think they're just okay.
2 -
Make the range of the beam of light for generator aura reading the same as the range of the map instead of a fixed 32m.
Blood amber add-on for keys should be buffed i feel like as others have suggested, downsides are too hefty.
Thank you for asking5 -
I’d love it if maps/keys could track chest! I love my treasure too much 🤣 especially with streetwise!
0 -
Glad you asked XD.
For both items I would like if they would recharge over time or have a cooldown like fog vials. This would also solve the blood amber addon that is currently pointless to run since it helps the killer much more than it helps you or return the old time based system and make all auras linger for a few seconds except blood amber. Currently these items are way too limited and they are not strong enough to compete with other items.
For maps in specific, I want the old rainbow map with everything they showed back (gens, killer belongings, hooks, totems, gates….) and I don’t like that totems aren‘t part of base maps and instead an addon.
For keys in specific my only real issue is that blood amber has not enough uses and that it shows your own aura. Even without the drawback of reducing charges blood amber woukd still have less uses than before, because before the changes you could use them up to 20 times. Also keys should cause you to lose collision like they did in the past, not sure if this got fixed or not.
For both items and items in general, I think item variants should be different and not just worse better versions of one another. Let me give you one example: For maps there could be one map for showing windows/ pallets and another one that works exactly like the old iri rainbow map. This should be done to all items in my opinion like it is with Alexes, commodious and engineers toolbox, balance aside, all these toolboxes are unique and have a niche (commodious many charges good for repair and sabos, Alexes very good for sabos and engineers for fast repair progress).
Addons that should have stayed:
- Maps: „Crystal bead“ The purple one that shows your teammates the auras of stuff as well.
- Keys: „Weaved ring“ The one that did let you keep your key upon dying.
Key addon idea I would like to see:
- One addon that hides auras, scratch marks, pools of blood and grunts of pain for a few seconds after charging it.
6 -
I only used maps for totems and killer traps, I have no reason to use these items now, I would really like them to show these things and possibly chests as part of the map and not as an addons. I would take totems over the traps to be honest.
Keys, should have a couple more charges, to use for aura reading of killerI feel only the broken key should open a chest i would never use a key that could be my only escape to open a chest
5 -
The chest-related addition to keys is good but ultimately pointless due to how weak chest-centric builds are. Also, the severe nerfs to charges and to Blood Amber make the item the weakest it's ever been. I see less reasons than ever to run keys.
7 -
I'm honestly a big fan of the key rework. They are far more useful throughout the trial and feel like they fit a proper niche.
However, Maps on the other hand feel like they've had their identity stripped from them. They don't track nearly as much anymore, and the range is very lackluster.
I personally think the beam mechanic needs looking at the most, a big range increase would be very nice to see (maybe to 64m?), as well as being able to reveal things like Chests or Exit Gates by default.
Perhaps it could reveal the progress of the generators through aura intensity as well, or show the actual aura of the beam of light to all Survivors (which would be handy to call for a heal or help on a generator etc).
To condense it into one concise point (since I know you asked for one change, and I kind of rattled off a few), the beam needs to have a bigger range and reveal more props. The window/pallet reveal is pretty nice but maps lost too much of their identity in return.
1 -
I know personally When I'm using the Key to give bonus items to my teammates, I end up:
- Dropping the key, so that I can pick up the item I unlocked from the chest
- Dropping the item from the chest nearby, so that my teammate can freely rummage
- Picking back up my key, so that I can go to the next chest
Its very clunky.
If there was a way to have teammates be able to rummage through the chest, and have the previous item just drop adjacent to the chest, it would make things way easier.
8 -
After a few more days of experience :
- Maps are bad, and for the most part a downgrade. They can't do many things and don't do anything it does better than perks (except for totem reading, however losing the woo effect is too much of a downside)
- Keys are an upgrade in my opinion except for blood amber which is pretty weak. The survivor aura is quite useful in solo queue and the range on skeleton key makes it worthwhile over bond. The chest interaction is fun and breathes some life into chest related perks. The ability to unlock the hatch feels great.9 -
For Maps: there is nothing in the add-on description for the Sharpened Flint that indicate that it will remove the map's base feature of seeing pallets and windows. Even if this is intentional, it feels like a bug. I would super appreciate it if you passed on to the team that they should rework the text description of this add-on, as its very misleading. Also, can people see totems in the light if you run this?
Maps were super powerful before, and it was disappointing that they were underutilized by survivors. The new, current map feels like it gives you only half of what you would want it to at all times, reducing the synergy between perks pretty heavily. Right now, it's a good alternative to Windows of Opportunity (unless you are running Sharpened Flint), but it feels much too niche to be useful in builds dedicated to generators, totems, etc.
I think adding generators back to its base function would give it some more flexibility and functionality. I kind of like the idea another user posted that you could change the functionality of different maps in the way that toolboxes have different strenghts and weaknesses, but I feel like in the end people would still be trying to buff what it can track via addons regardless of which one they choose. But maybe not!
Honestly, I found it kind of fun to run around the map and "track" items for later. I miss that kinda.
I like the mini-Wiretap functionality of the Crimson Stamp, but first impressions is that it might require a slight buff in how long the light appears.
I haven't played long enough to test this out, but previously maps spawned in the bloodweb way less frequently than other items of the same rarity. Is this still the case? I always felt so hesitant to run them because of how few of them I had. Maybe that affects use-rate?
I haven't played with Keys yet but I feel like the mini-Object of Obsession that the Blood Amber could be enough of a nerf to not decrease its charges so heavily.
0 -
Keys should have ace in the hole for unlocking chests (the items should have add-ons). One of the lower tier add-ons should make the broken key able to unlock chests, but not the hatch.
For maps, the windows effect should just always be active while carrying the map. The charges and timer should only apply to placing the marker that reveals the gens to you and your team.
These changes would make these items more worth bringing instead of toolboxes, med kits and flashlights
2 -
Maps: show aura of generators, chests and totems in a range.
Increase range with add-ons
add-on to show the aura to teammates. Maybe basekit to iri maps
Keys: show aura of survivors in a range when using
Show aura of the killer in a range with an add-on
Add-ons to increase range
Ah, and give them charges like medkits, toolboxes and flashlights have3 -
Revert them, nerf medkits and toolboxes or they'll see no use
-2 -
"All they needed to do was make the rainbow map the base one"
This. I get that the goal with these changes is to get maps used more, but the reason why I only brought maps sparingly when I played survivor was because the only good map (Rainbow map) was so darn hard to find because of it's scarcity in the bloodweb. If they wanted more people to use maps, they didnt even have to do all these changes lol just make Rainbow Map rare or uncommon and voila. People would use it.
3 -
Overall I like the reworks and have been enjoying them, but I think they could be improved some.
Maps:
- I wish the light beam could reveal chest auras as well.
- For the Sharpened Flint addon, assuming that its current behavior/downside of removing the window/pallet auras is intended (and if so please update the addon description because it's not very clear on that at all), I feel like this is not the best penalty to give it. While I understand why an addon that reveals totems in a large range should have a downside, I feel like a simple range penalty would be more appropriate rather than removing the base auras of the map. The current version is basically only worth bringing for boon totems, otherwise you are gambling on whether there will be a hex build or not and otherwise you can't really use the map for its normal function which feels bad. On the other hand, it would be the strongest map addon by far if it had no downside and would make hexes less appealing, so I don't really want that either.
- The penalties on Crimson Stamp are a bit too severe, the -10 seconds I understand but the -2 charges is a bit steep, this could be lowered to -1 charge or maybe remove the charge penalty altogether.
Keys:
- Survivor aura range could be a little higher on all key variants (ie. maybe +8 meters on each one).
- Unlocking a chest with the key should show the chest's aura to other survivors across the entire map, the 42 meter range limit is unnecessary.
- Shrill Whistle is not very good and should get buffed. There aren't many scenarios where 35% reduced channel time actually makes a difference or makes the item much more useful.
- Blood Amber is a tad bit over-nerfed imo. Considering it reveals your aura to the killer now (which means the killer can figure out you're using it now), the other downsides are a little too much. I'd drop it to -4 seconds (instead of -6 seconds) and only reduce charges by 1 instead of 2.
For both items (and for the fog vials as well), I also wish there were maybe a few more addons (maybe 2-3 more for each item). While I understand the desire to reduce the number of addons considering some addons were repetitive before (or were just not very good), only having 5 addons is fairly limiting and results in addon choice feeling repetitive for these items.
3 -
Charges! Both of these items went from being able to be activated numerous times per trial to only a select few uses. Yes you now get a set duration after each use which lasts a while, but usually you don't need that whole duration to get the information you needed. As a result, both of these items get less total value of a trial than compared to before, thus making them less useful.
Maps:
I've tried using maps in a chase build but it is just not worth it over other items atm. This is especially noticeable when using the add-on Crimson Stamp to reveal the killers aura. I even used the add-on to increase the aura read time but it is just so underwhelming. Either the range is too limited or the aura reveal feels to limited. The cool-down hurts the add-on as it would be nice to be able to charge it up again once the killer aura reading runs out. In general either the charges are too limited to feel like I get good value, and the maps are not strong enough to justify over toolboxes or medkits in most cases.
It would be nice if maybe one of the maps functioned like the old maps (but doesn't allow add-ons for obvious reasons) so people who enjoyed them still can. Especially for the Bloodsense Maps where leaving Pools of Blood behind you allowed for fun mindgames. The old tracking ability of maps was also nice and it is a shame to see it go.
Keys:
For keys, the main issue is the number of charges due to reasons stated above.
I do like the ability to open chests. Lara's perk Specialist and the new buffed Appraisal combined, actually make chest builds somewhat viable which is great. The new key change helps waste less time which is nice.
However, outside of that specific use and hatch opening, Keys are worse and less useful than before. Now they have built in survivor aura reading but that was very easily achieve by add-ons before, and now the ability to read survivor auras is heavily restricted compared to before due to how the charges work now, instead of 30-ish readings on a good Key, now you are limited to only 6, or 8 if you bring add-ons. This is even worse for Blood Amber add-on.
Blood Amber
The main strength of Keys in the past aside from opening hatch was the Blood Amber add-on. However as mentioned above this has been nerfed and is no nearly as useful compared to before due to the following 2 issues.
- Survivors get less aura reading time from Blood Amber now. (4 uses with the best key is really low considering the killer can also see you!)
- Ideally remove the add-on debuff of reducing charges, or increase Key charges overall.
- The killer can now see you back when using the add-on.
- Given how few charges it has currently, this feels unnecessary. Ideally either make it one way aura reading or increase the aura reading duration.
To make this add-on more balance I would fix either 1 of these 2 or both. Resolving at least 1 of these I believe would make Blood Amber more useful again, and thus Keys more useful.
0 - Survivors get less aura reading time from Blood Amber now. (4 uses with the best key is really low considering the killer can also see you!)
-
Odd, I don't get the auras of the windows and pallets with the totems. I get either or.
I woukd prefer seeing both, otherwise I'm wasting an addon.
1 -
Hello @ThatRyanB and thank you for stepping in!
In my opinion both map and keys don't have enough charges to begin with. It's just not worth using them.
Iri addons don't need to decrease charges of an item, they are more expensive in the bloodweb.Maps:
- purple addon should be different. Showing totems should be basekit for the maps - like it was before.
- More charges, definitely. Why would I bring map instead of windows of opportunity, if I need to use built to last with it?
I can just use WOO and run medkit, for example. It's just more worth it.
- Longer aura reading on useKeys:
- More charges!
- No downside to playing IRI addon.
- Longer aura reading on useSide question: Will medkit, flashlight and toolbox addons be changed in the future?
Let's talk about flashlights for example: we have 3 different batteries, 3 lenses, 5 duration addons (event addon should be separated tho). Thats a lot. We could combine them with better effects, for example.There are also medkits! 3 speed addons, suture and needle doing the same but with different numbers, 2 skillcheck addons which people don't even use and 4 charges addons!
This would declutter our bloodwebs even more
4 -
I agree that in the result the maps were nerfed. You needed purple add ons to reveal props to your teammates, beam stood forever, you tracked thiings such as including gens, totems, traps etc. etc. Now you just have item with effect of the perk that doesn't worth using over the perk and all the tracking is gone. I believe there is even less reason to run maps than before.
Keys on the other hand can do something for the flow of the game rather than just "blood amber". So yeah, wallhacking with BA is gone, but keys at least help your teams to loot some stuff, which can be pretty helpfull. Defienetly decent buff.
1 -
I wish there was an official BHVR statement, regarding if it was intended for people to get 20-40 uses out of the old maps or keys.
Because I was definitely getting 20-40 uses of blood amber with the old keys. And people are definitely wanting that back in the game. But I’ve never seen an official statement if the charge system is happening because item tapping is unintended.
4 -
I might be in the minority but I say the change was for the better and was good for the game overall.
-1
