Myers is almost perfect, still needs a few changes (both buffs and nerfs)
I have been playing with only Myers since the latest buff he got, playing many hours every day, testing different add-ons and builds. Here's a few things that I believe should be changed in his kit (I'm already considering the fact that the camera movement will no longer be restricted in mind, which will be a buff).
Basekit:
-Change the stalking sound to be played when Evil Incarnate is fully charged instead of when it is halfway. It will be less frustrating for the killer for not alarming survivors before the stalking is complete, and also help survivors know when they should put their guards up. It feels bad to play a stealthy killer and having a system that alarms survivors that you are around while being undetectable;
-Stalker mode speed should be 4.4m/s basekit. There was no point with it being 4.2 with the old Myers, there is no point in it now either. It does make sense that it should not be 4.6 since undetectable is somewhat useful in chases with mindgames, but 4.2 is way too harsh and makes it really annoying to chase and stalk survivors and to move around the map while in Stalker Mode. Memorial Flower, in this case, should have a completely different effect not related to Stalker Mode speed;
-Myers lacks a consistent chase counterplay. Right now, the best counterplay to Myers is pre-dropping every pallet until Evil Incarnate ends, which is still bad for the survivors since pallets are limited resources (although it doesn't feel like it at the moment because of the pallet density update). You cannot make it so he loses power after being stunned because it would be way too punishing, Myers is not Plague, he doesn't have a projectile and you still need to deal with pallets. I figure the best solution is to make this counterplay more efficient, and making it so breaking a pallet with Slaughtering Strike consumes 5 seconds from your power (number could be changed later if it's too much or too little);
-Myers has a general game sense counterplay that can be very harsh: Since his chase power is so much better with Slaughtering Strike, you want to activate Evil Incarnate even while chasing injured survivors. This means that the correct play for the survivor side is to just play injured for the rest of the match. This is good for balancing purposes, but there is nothing you can do or use with Myers to convince players to spend time healing, which, after players get more used to this counterplay method against Myers, will be frustrating for Myers players. My suggestion is to give a 20% stalk speed increase on injured survivors, it is not enough to delete this counterplay at all, but at least gives Myers a chance to keep fighting in this case.
Add-ons:
-There should be a charge speed increase add-on, it is weird that there is no option for that;
-Mirror Shard has a really poor design. The 0.25sec increase in the duration is not at all good enough to compensate the 25% decrease in charge speed, especially when Glass Fragment is just better in every sense, the 5% speed increase being way better than a 0.25sec extra duration, and 10% decrease in charge speed being way less of a nerf compared to 25%. My suggestion here, connecting with the previous point, is to make it so this add-on DECREASES duration by 0.25 seconds and increase charge speed something like 10~20% (can't stand on a number since I have no information in how duration increase or decrease interacts with the charge itself, I don't know if a duration decrease makes the same amount of charge time resulting in less duration even when not fully charged);
-Scratched Mirror should make Stalker Mode be 4.6, no one is playing this add-on because we don't have map offerings anymore, so at least make it a bit better;
-Vanity Mirror is way too good, give it a range limit;
-Jewelry Box: 30% is a lot and the range decrease is not even that bad. Maybe tone it down a little bit, 20% maybe woud be fine;
-Reflective Fragment should give an additional buff to Slaughtering Strike, I love the add-on idea but reality is that if survivors do the usual counterplay of pre-dropping every pallet you will not get good value from the add-on and it will only be a nerf to your kit;
-Hair Brush is a weird add-on. Although it seems crazy to break a pallet at 70% extra speed (50 from the add-on, 20 basekit), it is still better to break it with your power, since it is better for zoning and catching up. At the same time, this add-on can reward low skill with free downs and be frustrating for the survivors. Maybe this add-on should have a completely different effect.
-Judith's Tombstone: I agree it shouldn't have the same duration as normal Evil Incarnate so it better rewards good players, but my experience with this add-on is that with 40 seconds you always hook just a bit after your power ends. I think 45 seconds would be fine, not more than that.
That's it, thanks for coming to my TED Talk.
Comments
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He is most definitely NOT among the top tier killers
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As a preface, I am quite upset with the way Myers was reworked... stronger yes... but soulless. However since that ship has sailed, I will attempt to put away my bias, and be as objective as I can be with the suggestions made here.
Change the stalking sound to be played when Evil Incarnate is fully charged instead of when it is halfway.
I don't really see much point to this, since Myers identity has significantly shifted away from his old "find angle and stalk from afar" gameplay. The shorter 32m stalk range combined with there being no benefit to long range stalk beyond the measly 25% faster while stood still (from any range), makes that gameplay pretty moot. The focus for Myers now isn't to stealth stalk, it is to chase stalk, and the mid stalk warning is very much intended to push Myers into that chase stalk gameplay.
Stalker mode speed should be 4.4m/s basekit. There was no point with it being 4.2 with the old Myers, there is no point in it now either.
Similarly I don't see much point to this either, Myers can switch as he pleases, and Pursuer mode is largely pointless already, given you want to stalk and get T3 so you can start burning pallets and charging Survivors down. It's one saving grace is Pursuer mode does let you traverse the map faster at 4.6, with the trade off of a 16m TR, which is certainly managable... this does give a functional reason to use Pursuer mode more. Being 4.4m/s with pure Undetectable, with the ability to swing instantly for a hit would make Pursuer mode pretty much completely pointless, and Myers one of the stronger stealth killers in the game.
Though admittedly it would give Survivors a much stronger reason to heal (which is a point you also do raise), since any LOS blocking maps would be very much death... though I would argue Nurses Calling is already a great perk for new Myers, and would be obnoxiously good with a 4.4 Stalker mode. The point of Myers new identity is, Stalker mode is for stalking to get Slaughtering Strike, Pursuer mode is for m1 hits. Myers isn't really meant to be a stealthy m1 killer any more.
Slaughtering Strike consumes 5 seconds from your power (number could be changed later if it's too much or too little);
Not a bad idea tbh, a Blight-esk pallet break was what I wanted him to have, just without the Slaughtering Strike, but I won't start the debate on the Slaughtering Strike. Having this seems a fair trade off....though it does raise the question why Blight himself doesn't have a penalty like this and Mikey does.
Add-ons
There should be a charge speed increase add-on, it is weird that there is no option for that;
His stalk speed is stupid fast now tbh, I don't really see any reason to add this. To answer your later point of how stalk works, stalk require 5 points of stalk to charge. Standing still is 1 stalk per second (5s), moving is 0.75 stalk per second (6.66s). Any charge speed add-ons would affect both of these, and actually make the already pretty small difference between them even smaller.
Mirror Shard has a really poor design. //..// My suggestion here, connecting with the previous point, is to make it so this add-on DECREASES duration by 0.25 seconds and increase charge speed something like 10~20%
Will have to trust you here, you are probably right. Normally I would do the math, but as I say, I very much dislike the slaughtering strike and this rework, so I struggle to mount the motivation to bother.
Scratched Mirror should make Stalker Mode be 4.6, no one is playing this add-on because we don't have map offerings anymore, so at least make it a bit better;
I will agree to 4.4 m/s. You're right the loss of map offerings kill this add on, but the free mind games this brings should have a trade off.
Vanity Mirror is way too good, give it a range limit;
How so? It's just an aura reveal, and you can‘t instant down anymore... nor sure what makes this overpowered enough to warrant a nerf when you need to restalk up to use the info it gives you. If it's cause Survivors stay injured... doesn't this satisfy your "should heal" requirement?
Jewelry Box: 30% is a lot and the range decrease is not even that bad. Maybe tone it down a little bit, 20% maybe woud be fine;
Probably right given the above chase stalking point
Reflective Fragment should give an additional buff to Slaughtering Strike, I love the add-on idea but reality is that if survivors do the usual counterplay of pre-dropping every pallet you will not get good value from the add-on and it will only be a nerf to your kit;
Hahaha, you become like a better version of Pig with this add on... Good luck with that, I have no ideas 😅
Hair Brush is a weird add-on. Although it seems crazy to break a pallet at 70% extra speed (50 from the add-on, 20 basekit), it is still better to break it with your power, since it is better for zoning and catching up
Isn't this intended for helping the Fragrant Tuft and Scratched Mirror add-ons, since they don't have the Slaughtering Strike? That's my understanding of why the add-on has this effect.
Judith's Tombstone: I agree it shouldn't have the same duration as normal Evil Incarnate so it better rewards good players, but my experience with this add-on is that with 40 seconds you always hook just a bit after your power ends. I think 45 seconds would be fine, not more than that.
Fair. Nothing to add.
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For the charge speed I was referring to the Slaughtering Strike. Honestly like your points here in general, I agree that Slaughtering Strike changes Myers a bit too much from his original idea but it is what we have now and, still, the new Myers is fun for a lot of players that wouldn't even touch the killer before. It is a good thing you do putting away your taste for the purpose of finding balance, and I wish more people would do that when giving suggestions in this forum.
I don't find the Pursuer mode useless, I was thinking just like you in the beginning but after getting a bit more experienced I find myself changing constantly between Stalk and Pursuer modes. My point to make the 4.4 Stalker Mode basekit is that it is extremely hard to stalk survivors while around a loop to the point where it becomes frustrating, there is no real argument for why he should still be 4.2 in terms of balance.
The stalking sound change would really be pointless if you only stalked while chasing, but if you want to get to your power quickly, the correct play is still to stalk from afar while standing still. I often try to stalk survivors that I have no intent in chasing from as far as possible to then leave and go for someone else, this method is a lot more efficient than trying to stalk during chase, the annoying thing being that sometimes you don't have that choice and you need to stalk in chase, and that's when that 4.2 really becomes a problem. Myers is still supposed to be a stealth killer and it would be better if that aspect was better, and that's why the stalking sound point would be valid.
Vanity's Mirror is way too good because it is the most free information you can get. Most aura add-ons and perks have either a range limit or a weird condition for balancing purposes, Vanity's will trigger every game and always be extremely useful, and honestly you can play it with it being the only information aspect of your build and get great value. This is why I think it is a bit overtuned.
And for the pallet break punishment... Yeah I have no idea why Blight shouldn't receive some lol
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Suppose there is argument to switch to hide your red light at the right moments before you switch back, especially since Survivors not healing is common place.
Its hard yo say if he should be 4.4 or not, because other stealth killers have to sacrifice mobility for stealth... though I suppose Ghost Face and Skull Merchant while stood up is 4.6, so 4.4 is probably fine. Buff Pig pl0x.
For Vanity Mirror... I suppose the turnover of Evil Within is pretty quick in general. I wonder if giving him a permanent 24m Whispers effect with this add-on might be good instead... you know, to hit that omnipotent "always knows someone is nearby" part of the character... but to be catty a moment, that supports his lore, and evidently we can't have that (sorry I have slide a snipe in somewhere xD).
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I think Myers is decent top B now. His counterplay feels very close to Bubba atm. I defienetly don't think he needs buffs or nerfs. The only thing I found a bit stupid when playing him was iri tombstone, leaving me in Inc. mode entire match when paired with friends and furtive with not much option for the other side. Who loved old Myers can burn one add on to play his older version mostly. So there is no reason to be disatisfied about his update.
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Interesting changes. Here are mine:
- Return his stalk range back to 40 meters.
- Now the warning sounds play when his stalk meter is at 80% and when his Tier 3 starts (was at 50%, 100% and when Tier 3 starts)
- Evil Within now requires 6 Stalk points to activate (was 5).
- The reduction to the stun durations is no longer kept in Tier 3 unless you use Tuft of Hair.
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Perfectly bland, yes. His addon set went from the gold standard to another sleep-inducing one.
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I'm not a Myers main, or even a killer main—though I do play killer—and it's great that you're enjoying playing him, really. But from the perspective of a survivor? I…hate almost everything about new Myers. Not because he's "too OP" or anything like that, but just because the changes kind of stripped away all of his identity as a character and killer, and took away all the suspense or fear of a Myers match.
I just find him really profoundly boring to face now, whether I die or not. Before the rework, he was my favourite killer to play against, even though my escape rate against him was pretty terrible. Now? I mean…I like playing against him more than Legion or Plague I suppose, but that's pretty 'the bar is on the floor' standards.
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Nah, the main thing that made him fun was emulating the films, and in his Sept 2023 mini rework, his stalk mechanic from range was the biggest part of that, and that doesn't function the way it did before. Myers was special, because he felt like Myers, now he doesn't feel like Myers both to play as, and play against.
For horror fans, the best part of Myers was this "does he, doesn't he?" question mark that always hung over him. You were always on alert for Myers stalking cause it could cause you a real problem if you didn't see him stalking.
Even when you didn't know the killer at the start of the trial, if you didn't hear a TR for see anyone enter chase for like 30s or you heard the piano keys, you started looking around frantically to make sure Myers wasn't stalking you and working on a Tombstone. Even when Myers wasn't in the trial, he still brought up the tension and the horror atmosphere.
The fragrent tuft add-on doesn't provide any of this. He is still missing his stalk range, he doesn't have his Mori threat, his Scratched Mirror sucks, and he doesn't have his Vanity Mirror either. All the interesting ways his add-ons modded the game and brought the horror theme more to life are gone... now he is just tall and silent Chucky. With the Fragrent Tuft add-on, generic killer number 6.
None of the things that made Michael Myers are here anymore. If people like new Myers, great, but please don't try to tell old fans of Myers they still have their killer... cause they don't.
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Myers is way better than bubba right now. Like theres no comparison. His only counter is predropping. He gets his power too easily too fast. Then you're stuck with a 1 hit down dashing killing machine.
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Michael is in a very good spot after the recent buffs, and is not OP by any stretch of the imagination. He's a solid B tier killer now.
The only changes I would like to see are make stalker mode 4.4, give him back his 40m stalk range, and make it so the further away survivors are the faster he gains stalk.
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They need to increase how long it takes for him to get to tier 3. Its too oppressive. I'm fine with the stalk range increase but being exposed pretty much the entire match against an overbuffed dash killer is no fun.
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All of this is exactly how I feel about it. You put it into words perfectly. There's nothing…Michael Myers about him anymore.
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bro is onto nothing
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I play both sides. I find Myers very fun to play against, just a matter of perspective.
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And that's great, I'm glad you enjoy playing against him and as him.
But I find him incredibly generic and boring post-rework. Opinions gonna differ, y'know?
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