NOED is really bad game design
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I stated we can get rid of NOED when we get rid of SWF. How anyone feels is irrelevant to the statement in its context.
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Lmao. Can you read your post again? You assumed it's not fair trade for him and that he will "cry in the corner" if swf gets removed.0
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Almost everybody approaches NOED from the wrong angle. People might give this post a reply like 'insert killer main btw' meme but I wholeheartedly write this as a killer, not as a survivor.
One way or another survivors don't cleanse or can't cleanse dull totems. We can discuss the reasons for that but it doesn't change the fact that in more than half of the games, NOED gets activated and make a huge impact on the match.
Generally killers like trapper, pig, wraith, doc, leatherface, freddy resort to using NOED, and we know that NOED has the potential to turn 0k to 4k.
It just kills the chance for these killers to be buffed. Whether you admit it or not, at the end of the day, Devs will look at the stats they have, not what some people write on the forums.
For example, I see posts asking for leatherface buffs and I agree, he is not a good killer. Without using addons, his power is horrendous. Stating that, he will never get a buff because of the way people play him. Camp the first guy and get the second guy with NOED. Done. It is over. Leatherface has 2 kills which is considered to be balanced. Even though this killer is really bad, you can ask Devs whether they will buff him or not. They won't.
It seems like NOED helps killers and harms survivors but in reality, NOED harms killers more than it harms survivors.
As a survivor, I don't have any problem with it. I am a notorious detective's hunch user and I prevent NOED in almost every single match.
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Yeah but surely wouldn't the devs see why they are doing so well using one perk. Surely they will pick up that things like noed a d camping etc are only used because there is no other way that specific killer can win fairly without thr use of noed etc.Delfador said:Almost everybody approaches NOED from the wrong angle. People might give this post a reply like 'insert killer main btw' meme but I wholeheartedly write this as a killer, not as a survivor.
One way or another survivors don't cleanse or can't cleanse dull totems. We can discuss the reasons for that but it doesn't change the fact that in more than half of the games, NOED gets activated and make a huge impact on the match.
Generally killers like trapper, pig, wraith, doc, leatherface, freddy resort to using NOED, and we know that NOED has the potential to turn 0k to 4k.
It just kills the chance for these killers to be buffed. Whether you admit it or not, at the end of the day, Devs will look at the stats they have, not what some people write on the forums.
For example, I see posts asking for leatherface buffs and I agree, he is not a good killer. Without using addons, his power is horrendous. Stating that, he will never get a buff because of the way people play him. Camp the first guy and get the second guy with NOED. Done. It is over. Leatherface has 2 kills which is considered to be balanced. Even though this killer is really bad, you can ask Devs whether they will buff him or not. They won't.
It seems like NOED helps killers and harms survivors but in reality, NOED harms killers more than it harms survivors.
As a survivor, I don't have any problem with it. I am a notorious detective's hunch user and I prevent NOED in almost every single match.
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Noed doesn't counter Swf as we established (actually the opposite), so your argument makes no sense, all Noed does is hurt solos...Tucking_Friggered said:Tell ya what, you can remove NOED if you remove SWF. Fair trade? No? Then go cry in a corner and git gud. Not a soul hear wants to listen to you whinge. It's not like we get to watch you stamp your feet and scream all we have are words to read.
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@douggie123 said:
Yeah but surely wouldn't the devs see why they are doing so well using one perk. Surely they will pick up that things like noed a d camping etc are only used because there is no other way that specific killer can win fairly without thr use of noed etc.
It is 100% true but one way or another, killers do get 2 kills.
Adjusting gen time, redesigning maps, getting rid of bad setups, secondary objectives or.....
NOED
Well the easy choice is obvious. It is not like that the devs didn't try to solve other killer related problems with perks.
Gen rush? Pop goes the weasel
Bad setups? Bamboozle
Pallet looping? Spirit furyWe have NOED and it, well, 'solves' a bad game design. People gen rush you? Punish them by equipping NOED, easy counter.
I have said it before, as a killer I don't want 4k 3 min matches, I accept 2k if the match lasts something like 10 min.
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Noed is so op it allows me to get only single kill after gates are powered. Sometimes i ask myself do i really need noed to down single survivor after gates re powered?
Noed just like Ruin is rng it carries bad killers it allows them to get 4 kills sometimes IF and i m going to say it again IF by damn luck gates happened to spawn close to each other and ruin wasnt popped up in first seconds of a game.
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Getting a free kill is "only"? Isn't decisive the same? It can mean free escape or not.1
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Some good replies in here
@JanTheMan Exactly. Killers cry abour SWF but hoe often do SWF not manage to co-ordinate a full 5 totem cleansing? Noed is incredibly weak to 3/4 man swf so his argument makes no sense.
@Delfador Great post. That's exactly what I've been saying. The stats indicate that right now - despite how much killer maind on here complain - the game is actually in the killers favour. Stats don't lie. As you say camp and noed is a strategy that can easily grant 2 kills which gives the appearance of balance even though it isn't really there.
Also what happens when a 4 man swf takes out Noed? I guess its why we get so many salty posts about swf.
Right now it feels like NOED plays heavily into the balance of the game, especially for the lowrer tier killers and less experienced players.0 -
Killers like leatherface kills first survivor on third hook and then noed camp second survivor = loss. Killer gets 2 kills ( 6 hooks ) is good on survivor sided map.The_Crusader said:Some good replies in here
@JanTheMan Exactly. Killers cry abour SWF but hoe often do SWF not manage to co-ordinate a full 5 totem cleansing? Noed is incredibly weak to 3/4 man swf so his argument makes no sense.
@Delfador Great post. That's exactly what I've been saying. The stats indicate that right now - despite how much killer maind on here complain - the game is actually in the killers favour. Stats don't lie. As you say camp and noed is a strategy that can easily grant 2 kills which gives the appearance of balance even though it isn't really there.
Also what happens when a 4 man swf takes out Noed? I guess its why we get so many salty posts about swf.
Right now it feels like NOED plays heavily into the balance of the game, especially for the lowrer tier killers and less experienced players.0 -
Saying something has a counter doesn't mean that the issue at hand isn't bad game design.
And anyway, people should be arguing for harder-to-find totem spots and not ones where it's just Monkey see, monkey cleanse.
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It's human nature.The_Crusader said:
But the people on here don't want that. They want solos weak and they want to lobby dodge SWF.HavelmomDaS1 said:
It's an idea to close the gap between solo and swf. And as far as I remember one of the devs said that the intention of this idea was exactly that. So as closer the gaps as easier the balancing will beVietfox said:
How about you just run Kindred instead? Guys stop asking to devs to hold your hand.@TragicSolitude said:@The_Crusader said:
@TragicSolitudeSame here. Do 4, can't see the last, assume that surely the other 3 survivors have managed to do 1 totem between them....but nope.
I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall here. Let me explain...
NOED is harsh on solo survivors but it means nothing to 3/4 man SWF.
Want an indication of when a dull totem is cleansed? - killers won't have it.
Want some form of Kindred as a baseline ability? - killers won't have it
Yet they insist SWF is unfair and they want it removed, yet won't allow anything to make solo survivor more enjoyable.
How about you agree to give little quality of life upgrades for solo survivors so that swf crews can hop on solo and feel they aren't at a disadvantage and might play more solo games?
Killer mains just want everything swung in their favour.
Some form of Kindred as a baseline ability would be so nice. It's stupid that I can see survivors' auras while I'm hooked, which does me little to no good, but they can't see each others' auras, something that would benefit me (and them) way more than me watching them do gens or crouch around. Showing survivors' auras to each other should be baseline and Kindred should be altered so that each tier just shows the killer's aura within a certain distance of the hook. Right now, Kindred tier 1 is completely useless, anyway, and it makes no sense that it even exists.
Sorry if that's off topic.
But yes, Small Game at least should tell the survivor running it how many hex/dull totems are left on the map. The perk is useful for finding totems and avoiding traps, but it's useless for countering NOED.
Builds work like that, they force you to choose, not to run everything you want.1 -
If noed is bad design, what about DSTRIKE ?
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@The_Crusader said:
I know it. You know it. The devs know it. How about we all just admit it?Playing in the green ranks and it's literally carrying every single killer there. Guess this is the easy way to balance the game. Killers are struggling? oh well just give them a perk to make up for it.
Now before people cry "ClEaNsE tHe ToTUmZ", how about the devs actually make that viable for single player by giving some notification of when dull totems are destroyed? or after doing 4 am I meant to run around the map searching every nook and cranny just to be sure?
God I hate this game sometimes. NOED and DS, 2 perks that change the entire outcome of the match. Great game design right there.
Don't waste your breath brother, I already made a rant on this. Literally everyone just accepts its existence at this point (sadly.)
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@switch said:
If noed is bad design, what about DSTRIKE ?Personally, I think NOED is a band-aid fix to flawed game design whereas Decisive Strike is actually bad game design. NOED should be made unnecessary by fixing other elements of the game, then it can be altered/removed. On the other hand, DS could be removed tomorrow and I think the game would be better for it.
However, a thread pointing out the problems with one perk shouldn't always have to devolve into a contest between which perk is worst. Multiple perks on both sides can need fixing.
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@TragicSolitude said:
@switch said:
If noed is bad design, what about DSTRIKE ?Personally, I think NOED is a band-aid fix to flawed game design whereas Decisive Strike is actually bad game design. NOED should be made unnecessary by fixing other elements of the game, then it can be altered/removed. On the other hand, DS could be removed tomorrow and I think the game would be better for it.
However, a thread pointing out the problems with one perk shouldn't always have to devolve into a contest between which perk is worst. Multiple perks on both sides can need fixing.
Honestly, i'd take 4 Decisive strikes over 4 Dead Hards. At least with DS I can use enduring and just get them down again most of the time, with Dead hard if they know how to use it they'll mostly get another free loop or get away to another loop (If they can use it correctly)
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@TragicSolitude said:
@switch said:
If noed is bad design, what about DSTRIKE ?Personally, I think NOED is a band-aid fix to flawed game design whereas Decisive Strike is actually bad game design. NOED should be made unnecessary by fixing other elements of the game, then it can be altered/removed. On the other hand, DS could be removed tomorrow and I think the game would be better for it.
However, a thread pointing out the problems with one perk shouldn't always have to devolve into a contest between which perk is worst. Multiple perks on both sides can need fixing.
NOED is: devs being lazy and dont want to put time into making a good endgame scenario for both sides.
DS is: pure bad game design.
The op just said: noed is bad game design while he has no idea what bad design is.0 -
I’m a rank one killer for over a year. Never lobby dodged. And I prefer to play SwF lol. I know the peer. Pressure when playing SwF. Overly altruistic. Fellas right into my play style.The_Crusader said:Killers - defend garbage like NOED, camping and tunneling which encourages people to play SWF
Also killers - Cry about SWF and lobby dodge.
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Show pics that you are a rank one killer. Otherwise your opinion is total trash.0
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Only players who have ever been rank one are capable of giving valid opinions on this game1
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@michaelmyers87 said:
The_Crusader said:Killers - defend garbage like NOED, camping and tunneling which encourages people to play SWF
Also killers - Cry about SWF and lobby dodge.
I’m a rank one killer for over a year. Never lobby dodged. And I prefer to play SwF lol. I know the peer. Pressure when playing SwF. Overly altruistic. Fellas right into my play style.
Also most people I know who go against NOED are killer mains themselves lmao (Including me.)
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@michaelmyers87 said:
Only players who have ever been rank one are capable of giving valid opinions on this gameI hope that's satire.
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Why do people do this? Assume that if someone is complaining about one thing they must be a killer/survivor main and defend everything broken on the other side?switch said:If noed is bad design, what about DSTRIKE ?
I've literally complained about DS on these forums more than anything else in the entire game.
My 3 most hated things in Dead By Daylight...
1) Decisive Strike
2) NOED
3) Claudette Morel
I think it's a good game but I do think DS and NOED hold it back. Both really feel like they rob the winning team of a hard earned victory. Both perks are far too powerful.2 -
I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)0 -
@switch said:
@TragicSolitude said:
@switch said:
If noed is bad design, what about DSTRIKE ?Personally, I think NOED is a band-aid fix to flawed game design whereas Decisive Strike is actually bad game design. NOED should be made unnecessary by fixing other elements of the game, then it can be altered/removed. On the other hand, DS could be removed tomorrow and I think the game would be better for it.
However, a thread pointing out the problems with one perk shouldn't always have to devolve into a contest between which perk is worst. Multiple perks on both sides can need fixing.
NOED is: devs being lazy and dont want to put time into making a good endgame scenario for both sides.
DS is: pure bad game design.
The op just said: noed is bad game design while he has no idea what bad design is.To be fair, there are a lot of elements in DbD that are a result of bad game design. And NOED may be an attempt at helping with the bad game design, but that doesn't mean it's not a poorly designed perk. Yes, it needs to be strong since it's an end-game perk, but due to the problems in game design that give SWF such a huge advantage over solo survivors, NOED is much more likely to be a problem for solo survivors. And that's kind of backwards, given that NOED is meant to be a punishment for rushing gens, which is more of an SWF thing than a solo survivor thing. Just like how Ruin is meant to slow down gen rushing, but the good survivors who can gen rush can also power through Ruin.
DbD needs to be fixed so that perks can be used for fun or to help with player weaknesses rather than needing to be used to help with weaknesses in the game itself.
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I just feel like 5 totems is too much. Because if I do 5 totems then my team starts struggling.Boss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
I'm not even going to blame them, it's basically a 3 man team if I'm off cleansing totems. Then you get salt post game or you get then trying to sell you out to the killer because they assume you've been doing nothing.
It feels a little much for one perk. No other perk requires this much effort to counter.0 -
@The_Crusader said:
Boss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
I just feel like 5 totems is too much. Because if I do 5 totems then my team starts struggling.
I'm not even going to blame them, it's basically a 3 man team if I'm off cleansing totems. Then you get salt post game or you get then trying to sell you out to the killer because they assume you've been doing nothing.
It feels a little much for one perk. No other perk requires this much effort to counter.
What if it can only deal a certain amount of Exposed hits?
Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 1
The next Healthy Survivor you hit will go down instantly.
Once a Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 2
The next 2 Healthy Survivors you hit will go down instantly.
Once 2 Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 3
The next 2 Healthy Survivors you hit will go down instantly and the Dull Totem it will spawn on is uncleansable.
Once 2 Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.0 -
Its bad, just like decisive. Both still in the game. Both not going to get removed unfortunately.
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Would be ok, not sure if they need the 4% though. At endgame when bsrely any pallets are left the 4% just gives them such an easy chase.Boss said:@The_Crusader said:
Boss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
I just feel like 5 totems is too much. Because if I do 5 totems then my team starts struggling.
I'm not even going to blame them, it's basically a 3 man team if I'm off cleansing totems. Then you get salt post game or you get then trying to sell you out to the killer because they assume you've been doing nothing.
It feels a little much for one perk. No other perk requires this much effort to counter.
What if it can only deal a certain amount of Exposed hits?
Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 1
The next Healthy Survivor you hit will go down instantly.
Once a Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 2
The next Healthy Survivor you hit will go down instantly and your movement speed is increased by 4%.
Once a Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 3
The next 2 Healthy Survivors you hit will go down instantly and your movement speed is increased by 4%.
Once 2 Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.Idk, this was made up in 40 seconds.
It would be scary to face, yet you can't burst through all Survivors.
Killers complain that 3-4 man SWF is too hard yet these are the people who can most easily co-ordinate a full 5 totem cleanse. There needs to be a way to make it fairer for solo and swf.
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@The_Crusader said:
Boss said:@The_Crusader said:
Boss said:
I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.) Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.) I just feel like 5 totems is too much. Because if I do 5 totems then my team starts struggling. I'm not even going to blame them, it's basically a 3 man team if I'm off cleansing totems. Then you get salt post game or you get then trying to sell you out to the killer because they assume you've been doing nothing.
It feels a little much for one perk. No other perk requires this much effort to counter.
What if it can only deal a certain amount of Exposed hits?
Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 1
The next Healthy Survivor you hit will go down instantly.
Once a Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.
Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 2
The next Healthy Survivor you hit will go down instantly and your movement speed is increased by 4%.
Once a Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.
Hex: No One Escapes Death Level 3
The next 2 Healthy Survivors you hit will go down instantly and your movement speed is increased by 4%.
Once 2 Healthy Survivor goes down instantly from this Perk, the Hex Totem turns into a Dull Totem and the Perk disables.
Idk, this was made up in 40 seconds.
It would be scary to face, yet you can't burst through all Survivors.
Would be ok, not sure if they need the 4% though. At endgame when bsrely any pallets are left the 4% just gives them such an easy chase.
Killers complain that 3-4 man SWF is too hard yet these are the people who can most easily co-ordinate a full 5 totem cleanse. There needs to be a way to make it fairer for solo and swf.
Okay, remove the 4%.
There, tried something new in my previous suggestion.
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Lmao sure you like to go down at the end because of NOED, no matter how good you played and how undeserved it was for the killerBoss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
Everyone who played a single competitive pvp game before which was pretty good balanced will see the flaws of designing noed1 -
@HavelmomDaS1 said:
Boss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
Lmao sure you like to go down at the end because of NOED, no matter how good you played and how undeserved it was for the killer
Everyone who played a single competitive pvp game before which was pretty good balanced will see the flaws of designing noedHuh? Go down?
Be actually good and that won't even happen.0 -
@The_Crusader said:
I know it. You know it. The devs know it. How about we all just admit it?Playing in the green ranks and it's literally carrying every single killer there. Guess this is the easy way to balance the game. Killers are struggling? oh well just give them a perk to make up for it.
Now before people cry "ClEaNsE tHe ToTUmZ", how about the devs actually make that viable for single player by giving some notification of when dull totems are destroyed? or after doing 4 am I meant to run around the map searching every nook and cranny just to be sure?
God I hate this game sometimes. NOED and DS, 2 perks that change the entire outcome of the match. Great game design right there.
Remove self care, then I accept if you remove NOED
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Why on earth would you need unless all gens were fixed?Jigmac said:looks at Decisive strike , Self-care
Sooo something that can be countered and only avaiable when all gens are fixed is bad design?
Given how much NOED alone can swing the results of a game yes it is bad game design. It's like the blue shell from Mario Kart on steroids.
Again with the defensive positions. DS is absolutely awful too. Nobody is defending that.1 -
I like using noed as a final trick up my sleeve. Also to give myself one last push to deny the survivor escape. Not at all a bad game design.
You can't label anything you dislike facing as bad game design.
That logic got bloodlust 2 and 3 removed even though if you couldn't lose the killer you were still capable of slowing them down.
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Oh I see, "that" argument.. Come on, grow up. Shall we all respond this way to every bad designed thing in the game?Boss said:@HavelmomDaS1 said:
Boss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
Lmao sure you like to go down at the end because of NOED, no matter how good you played and how undeserved it was for the killer
Everyone who played a single competitive pvp game before which was pretty good balanced will see the flaws of designing noedHuh? Go down?
Be actually good and that won't even happen.
DS? Just down him again.
Genrush? Just pressure gens.
Facecamp? Just don't get caught.
Insta heal? Just down him again.
Seriously, with that sentence I'm pretty sure you don't care about balancing and you never played a balanced pvp game in you life before (or maybe you did but u didn't like it cuz there aren't bad designed crutch things to use to compensate lack of skill)2 -
The Killer is playing with 3 perks thoughout the whole match until all gens are powered and you fail to cleanse 5 totems in the meantime? Mhm.
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Damn that's a really good example.. Fcking blue Shell allowed the worst player to ######### up the best player, such a bad designed mechanic. Or this rocket thing boosting you forward for free ..The_Crusader said:
Why on earth would you need unless all gens were fixed?Jigmac said:looks at Decisive strike , Self-care
Sooo something that can be countered and only avaiable when all gens are fixed is bad design?
Given how much NOED alone can swing the results of a game yes it is bad game design. It's like the blue shell from Mario Kart on steroids.
Again with the defensive positions. DS is absolutely awful too. Nobody is defending that.
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Bloodlust is a bad designed mechanic aswell. It just exist because maps and loops are bad designed, it's a band-aid fix and not even a good oneAshleyWB said:I like using noed as a final trick up my sleeve. Also to give myself one last push to deny the survivor escape. Not at all a bad game design.
You can't label anything you dislike facing as bad game design.
That logic got bloodlust 2 and 3 removed even though if you couldn't lose the killer you were still capable of slowing them down.0 -
@HavelmomDaS1 said:
Boss said:@HavelmomDaS1 said:
Boss said:
I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.) Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.) Lmao sure you like to go down at the end because of NOED, no matter how good you played and how undeserved it was for the killer
Everyone who played a single competitive pvp game before which was pretty good balanced will see the flaws of designing noed
Huh? Go down?
Be actually good and that won't even happen.
Oh I see, "that" argument.. Come on, grow up. Shall we all respond this way to every bad designed thing in the game?
DS? Just down him again.
Genrush? Just pressure gens.
Facecamp? Just don't get caught.
Insta heal? Just down him again.Seriously, with that sentence I'm pretty sure you don't care about balancing and you never played a balanced pvp game in you life before (or maybe you did but u didn't like it cuz there aren't bad designed crutch things to use to compensate lack of skill)
That's pretty rude and false.
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NOED is not as big of a deal as people make it out to be, and yes you should cleanse the totems, It takes 14 seconds to cleanse a totem.
Totems are supposed to be a secondary objective, Most people gloss over them if they see a dull totem and then complain if they see NOED pop up at the end, It's completely counterable. Dull totems become pointless if NOED Doesn't exist.The whole point of NOED Being so strong is it's an easy counter. DS on the other hand is even more broken but has no counter in the game.
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@PiiFree said:
The Killer is playing with 3 perks thoughout the whole match until all gens are powered and you fail to cleanse 5 totems in the meantime? Mhm.this.
how much more you need vs one single perk ? how much counter play adrenaline got?
like none? and 4 can have it in 1 game, you hook one with it ? still get it after save.0 -
One of OPs issues i would actually like to see in the following way...
While it shouldn't be the solution, it would be an extra tool.
Killer Perks that are (more) powerful against SWF.Like on Barbecue & Chili: "The Entity detected some Survivors are together. Those who are a member of a Survive With Friends group grant 2 Tokens on their first hooking." (And then the limit of Tokens would be raised from 4 to 8 to allow these extra Tokens to be gained. (You can't get more than 4 Tokens against solos anyway, so raising the limit wouldn't do anything there.))
Of course that's just an example, but it's about the concept.So apply something like that to H:NOED so that it can receive the proper nerf that OP wants against solos.
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the entire endgame is a bad design choice.
its full on survivor sided, the only way how killers can prevent this is by bringing the highly overrated perk Hex: No One Escapes Death.
the perk complpetely relies on the survivors to screw up to even activate and even then it can be taken down. or you could just be stealthy and avoid the killer. or you could just leave through the gate.
there is so much counterplay to it, if anyone above green ranks has any problems with this perk, you might not be ready for these ranks yet.and i am saying this as a survivor now:
cleanse the totems. its not hard. just leave the gens to your team and do these 5 little bad boys (with ruin its only 4 btw).
also, no. i do not need an indicator of how many totems have been done by other players. i have a brain and i am able to count up to 5. i go to the totem spots, destroy the totem and add it to the count. if the totem is already destroyed, ill add it to the count and move on. thats how easy it is.
also also, yes, the totems need to be better hidden. they are supposed to be a secondary objective and lead you away from the gens, but they barely do, as they usually spawn eigther right next to a gen or so obvious in the open field that you need to spend almost no time to search for them at all.you know, when noed activates you shouldnt be like "ugh another noob killer using this op perk", but rather like "darn, why did i allow this to activate?".
its not like the killer has any power over weather you cleanse the totems or not. he is waay too busy for that xD1 -
I just imagined game without noed and ds feels too easy and boringThe_Crusader said:
Why on earth would you need unless all gens were fixed?Jigmac said:looks at Decisive strike , Self-care
Sooo something that can be countered and only avaiable when all gens are fixed is bad design?
Given how much NOED alone can swing the results of a game yes it is bad game design. It's like the blue shell from Mario Kart on steroids.
Again with the defensive positions. DS is absolutely awful too. Nobody is defending that.0 -
Stop that childish killer/survivor main bullshit pleaseBACKSTABBER said:@The_Crusader said:
I know it. You know it. The devs know it. How about we all just admit it?Playing in the green ranks and it's literally carrying every single killer there. Guess this is the easy way to balance the game. Killers are struggling? oh well just give them a perk to make up for it.
Now before people cry "ClEaNsE tHe ToTUmZ", how about the devs actually make that viable for single player by giving some notification of when dull totems are destroyed? or after doing 4 am I meant to run around the map searching every nook and cranny just to be sure?
God I hate this game sometimes. NOED and DS, 2 perks that change the entire outcome of the match. Great game design right there.
Remove self care, then I accept if you remove NOED
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Genrush is not bad game design . The game is not really pvp its assymetrical horror killer s power shouldnt be equal to single survivor.HavelmomDaS1 said:
Oh I see, "that" argument.. Come on, grow up. Shall we all respond this way to every bad designed thing in the game?Boss said:@HavelmomDaS1 said:
Boss said:I actually liked facing NOED as Survivor and never liked running it as Killer. (Though the reason for that isn't exclusive to NOED.)
Too bad you feel like it's unfair, but one aspect i liked about DbD is that the match gets more dangerous as time goes on. (C'mon Fire Up, do something pls.)
Lmao sure you like to go down at the end because of NOED, no matter how good you played and how undeserved it was for the killer
Everyone who played a single competitive pvp game before which was pretty good balanced will see the flaws of designing noedHuh? Go down?
Be actually good and that won't even happen.
DS? Just down him again.
Genrush? Just pressure gens.
Facecamp? Just don't get caught.
Insta heal? Just down him again.
Seriously, with that sentence I'm pretty sure you don't care about balancing and you never played a balanced pvp game in you life before (or maybe you did but u didn't like it cuz there aren't bad designed crutch things to use to compensate lack of skill)0 -
16 perks vs 4 is bullshit argument and i wont even explain why. If 4 survivors took adrenaline only one is going to get good use of it and in 99% times hes going to get downed before he will be able to escape.thebluesusui said:@PiiFree said:
The Killer is playing with 3 perks thoughout the whole match until all gens are powered and you fail to cleanse 5 totems in the meantime? Mhm.this.
how much more you need vs one single perk ? how much counter play adrenaline got?
like none? and 4 can have it in 1 game, you hook one with it ? still get it after save.0 -
Well. I agree as a killer main.
But here's a wacky idea.
So is DS!1
