A Killer's momentum should overpower a Survivor's momentum, not the other way round.

DocOctober

I think that Survivors should not be able to push the Killers around simply by running into them or outright blocking them.

The other day, I was chasing after an injured Survivor, beelining for them, then I suddenly get pushed to my right even though I "counter-steered" and saw another Survivor come into my FOV who was running straight ahead into me.

I was absolutely furious because it felt so wrong. I was playing the Trapper, our hulking 7' tall beast of a Killer and that feeble short Dwight who probably doesn't even have half the mass of Evan MacMillan could push me out of my path simply by running into me and there was nothing that I could do.

If he had stopped in front of me, I'd come to a dead stop. That doesn't make any sense. The Killer's momentum should always be able to overpower that of the Survivors, they have more mass, are taller, stronger and empowered by the Entity.

Yes it should slow a Killer down a bit and maybe divert their path a bit, that makes sense, but definitely not what I currently does.

If this was changed, it would also remove the exploit of blocking the Hook prompt by crouching below Hooks as they would be pushed out of the way.

only1biggs

Agreed, but if they block hooks just get hits on them.

SeducedByDaemonette

Realism is not applied to this game . Not to mention that there are killers who are smaller than survivors (like Hag/Pig against David/Tapp) .

DocOctober

@SeducedByDaemonette said:
Realism is not applied to this game . Not to mention that there are killers who are smaller than survivors (like Hag/Pig against David/Tapp) .

I'm fully aware of that, but a lack of realism present is not an argument for not considering my suggestion.

Also, as I said in my post, the Killers are empowered by the Entity. Or how else would Hag and Pig be able to lift Survivors and break Pallets just as easily as the other taller Killers?

oke

Bodyblocking is an essential part of the game. For killers and for survivors. This is a game and it is not supposed to be realistic. Or is it realistic that you can get chainsawed an infinite number of times yet still fully heal to healthy state and running at full speed using Sprint Burst?

95% of the times I get bodyblocked as Killer, I just enjoy the free hits. And the other 5% it is just a really good team rewarding themselves for good teamplay. So I have absolutely no problem with bodyblocking as it is in the current state of the game.

DocOctober

oke said:

Bodyblocking is an essential part of the game. For killers and for survivors. This is a game and it is not supposed to be realistic. Or is it realistic that you can get chainsawed an infinite number of times yet still fully heal to healthy state and running at full speed using Sprint Burst?

95% of the times I get bodyblocked as Killer, I just enjoy the free hits. And the other 5% it is just a really good team rewarding themselves for good teamplay. So I have absolutely no problem with bodyblocking as it is in the current state of the game.

Bodyblocking is not the main part of this thread and what I'm referring to is as much an exploit as the old facecamping was.

Exploits have no place in a game.

Master

@DocOctober said:
I think that Survivors should not be able to push the Killers around simply by running into them or outright blocking them.

The other day, I was chasing after an injured Survivor, beelining for them, then I suddenly get pushed to my right even though I "counter-steered" and saw another Survivor come into my FOV who was running straight ahead into me.

I was absolutely furious because it felt so wrong. I was playing the Trapper, our hulking 7' tall beast of a Killer and that feeble short Dwight who probably doesn't even have half the mass of Evan MacMillan could push me out of my path simply by running into me and there was nothing that I could do.

If he had stopped in front of me, I'd come to a dead stop. That doesn't make any sense. The Killer's momentum should always be able to overpower that of the Survivors, they have more mass, are taller, stronger and empowered by the Entity.

Yes it should slow a Killer down a bit and maybe divert their path a bit, that makes sense, but definitely not what I currently does.

If this was changed, it would also remove the exploit of blocking the Hook prompt by crouching below Hooks as they would be pushed out of the way.

When I am trying to secure a kill and a squad comes in, bodyblock/pushing me away from my hook and savely unhooking their mate, leaving me behind like an idiot I always laugh, equip my slugg build and make survivors suffer for the rest of the day

Devs removed facecamp by allowing to unhook from all angles, yet the killer can be blocked away from the hook easily. Its just a classic example.

In the end you have to understand that survivors represent 80% of the wallets, so if they want to push around the killer, they can I guess

TheTimeMachine

     The point I see is: Why can Survivors push the Killer around while both are moving but the Killer cannot? It’s a strange role reversal.

DocOctober

Master said:

@DocOctober said:
I think that Survivors should not be able to push the Killers around simply by running into them or outright blocking them.

The other day, I was chasing after an injured Survivor, beelining for them, then I suddenly get pushed to my right even though I "counter-steered" and saw another Survivor come into my FOV who was running straight ahead into me.

I was absolutely furious because it felt so wrong. I was playing the Trapper, our hulking 7' tall beast of a Killer and that feeble short Dwight who probably doesn't even have half the mass of Evan MacMillan could push me out of my path simply by running into me and there was nothing that I could do.

If he had stopped in front of me, I'd come to a dead stop. That doesn't make any sense. The Killer's momentum should always be able to overpower that of the Survivors, they have more mass, are taller, stronger and empowered by the Entity.

Yes it should slow a Killer down a bit and maybe divert their path a bit, that makes sense, but definitely not what I currently does.

If this was changed, it would also remove the exploit of blocking the Hook prompt by crouching below Hooks as they would be pushed out of the way.

When I am trying to secure a kill and a squad comes in, bodyblock/pushing me away from my hook and savely unhooking their mate, leaving me behind like an idiot I always laugh, equip my slugg build and make survivors suffer for the rest of the day

Devs removed facecamp by allowing to unhook from all angles, yet the killer can be blocked away from the hook easily. Its just a classic example.

In the end you have to understand that survivors represent 80% of the wallets, so if they want to push around the killer, they can I guess

Let's not do anything because the majority of the players are Survivors is NOT an argument.

The devs went down that road and it skewed the game's balance out of whack. Thankfully, they learnt from that mistake.

WolfPad06

This is something I've thought about pretty much since I bought the game.
I can understand slight deviations or slow downs if a survivor tries to body block you while running, but it seems to me that 99% of the time their collision takes priority over the killer and STOPS IT DEAD IN IT'S TRACKS, which makes absolutely no sense (regardless of the realism of the game, we're talking balance here).

I'm not saying this as a killer player. I've memed so many killers who're going in for the hit before my friend can escape. I just run right into them and POP I teleport in front of them and tank the hit.

As far as body blocking a killer carrying a player to the hook, I can see how a crouching survivor should be able to stop a killer dead in it's tracks (and be punished by getting hit), since the killer is slowed and the survivor is in a much more "stable" posture, but certainly not just push them away like a newborn puppy while they're in a chase.

Jack11803

@TheTimeMachine said:
     The point I see is: Why can Survivors push the Killer around while both are moving but the Killer cannot? It’s a strange role reversal.

Just tested this in KYF with trapper. Survivors can’t literally push the killer, unless they dead hard, which that’s in place to prevent it from hitting the killer like a brick wall

DocOctober

@Jack11803 said:

@TheTimeMachine said:
     The point I see is: Why can Survivors push the Killer around while both are moving but the Killer cannot? It’s a strange role reversal.

Just tested this in KYF with trapper. Survivors can’t literally push the killer, unless they dead hard, which that’s in place to prevent it from hitting the killer like a brick wall

Have one Survivor run into the Killer from the side while the Killer keeps walking straight ahead, it will divert the Killer's path towards the direction the Survivor is pushing them into.

DocOctober

@WolfPad06 said:
This is something I've thought about pretty much since I bought the game.
I can understand slight deviations or slow downs if a survivor tries to body block you while running, but it seems to me that 99% of the time their collision takes priority over the killer and STOPS IT DEAD IN IT'S TRACKS, which makes absolutely no sense (regardless of the realism of the game, we're talking balance here).

I'm not saying this as a killer player. I've memed so many killers who're going in for the hit before my friend can escape. I just run right into them and POP I teleport in front of them and tank the hit.

As far as body blocking a killer carrying a player to the hook, I can see how a crouching survivor should be able to stop a killer dead in it's tracks (and be punished by getting hit), since the killer is slowed and the survivor is in a much more "stable" posture, but certainly not just push them away like a newborn puppy while they're in a chase.

That is exactly the scenario I'm talking about.

Jack11803

@DocOctober said:

@Jack11803 said:

@TheTimeMachine said:
     The point I see is: Why can Survivors push the Killer around while both are moving but the Killer cannot? It’s a strange role reversal.

Just tested this in KYF with trapper. Survivors can’t literally push the killer, unless they dead hard, which that’s in place to prevent it from hitting the killer like a brick wall

Have one Survivor run into the Killer from the side while the Killer keeps walking straight ahead, it will divert the Killer's path towards the direction the Survivor is pushing them into.

Didn’t try that. Maybe it’s because for both sides the other players are walls, so it automatically directs the killer to a side, instead of a dead stop? It’s probably the survivor running just a bit in front of the killer while going to the side, creating a mini block

WolfPad06

@Jack11803 said:

@TheTimeMachine said:
     The point I see is: Why can Survivors push the Killer around while both are moving but the Killer cannot? It’s a strange role reversal.

Just tested this in KYF with trapper. Survivors can’t literally push the killer, unless they dead hard, which that’s in place to prevent it from hitting the killer like a brick wall

Then your friend did a poor job trying to body block,. probably.
Approach the killer in a perpendicular/diagonal way and you will always manage to either pop in front of them or outright stop/change their trajectory. At that point they (the killer) can either 1) waste a bunch of time trying to go around you to hit the injured survivor or 2) hit you and allow the injured survivor to escape during the successful hit cooldown to then proceed and try to down you.

If this happens near an open exit gate both survivors will escape. Or if there's 3 healthy survivors who coordinate the body block they can literally escape on a gate that is on the other side of the map even without Dead Hard or dropping pallets on you.

Jack11803

@WolfPad06 said:

@Jack11803 said:

@TheTimeMachine said:
     The point I see is: Why can Survivors push the Killer around while both are moving but the Killer cannot? It’s a strange role reversal.

Just tested this in KYF with trapper. Survivors can’t literally push the killer, unless they dead hard, which that’s in place to prevent it from hitting the killer like a brick wall

Then your friend did a poor job trying to body block,. probably.
Approach the killer in a perpendicular/diagonal way and you will always manage to either pop in front of them or outright stop/change their trajectory. At that point they (the killer) can either 1) waste a bunch of time trying to go around you to hit the injured survivor or 2) hit you and allow the injured survivor to escape during the successful hit cooldown to then proceed and try to down you.

If this happens near an open exit gate both survivors will escape. Or if there's 3 healthy survivors who coordinate the body block they can literally escape on a gate that is on the other side of the map even without Dead Hard or dropping pallets on you.

I was under the impression this post was at first about just an error in hitboxes and their priorities, but yeah, now that I know; the tests weren’t about exit gate stuff like that, I knew that happens. From what doc said first, I thought a survivor ran into him headfirst and pushed the killer around.

WolfPad06

Nah a survivor would be very foolish to do that, the body blocks we're talking about are during engame tunneling, which wouldn't be a problem is the endgame mechanics weren't so... Dull.

I made a topic about the endgames on the killer's subforum giving some ideas how the killer can punish extreme altruism and make the endgame way more strategic and fun than it is right now.