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SWF is cheating
Comments
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I get that SWF is absolutely frustrating to play against when you aren't using a top tier killer. I nearly quit the game altogether because I got sick of 70% of my lobbies being SWF (I used to check Steam profiles). It's frustrating when you just want to play Plague or some other joke of a killer at red ranks but you can't because you don't feel like intentionally deranking that day.
That being said, this isn't a SWF problem. This is a BHVR problem and a killer balance problem. Making the game less fun for people who want to play with their friends will ultimately hurt the game overall. We need more mind game-able pallets at high ranks (which they seem to acknowledge). Killers need more mobility (Freddy rework is promising). We're moving in the right direction. In the meantime, become a Nurse or Spirit god and lose 1 in 10 games.
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In regards to the voice chat debate, the only thing more disturbing than ACTUALLY having a debate on BHVR using EAC to block voice comm programs, is the fact that a game with a system built to let you play with your friends, was ever brought off the drawing board without an integrated voice comm system integrated and considered.
Even the excuse that you knew your integrated voice system would be inferior to any one of the dedicated apps out there now, it's a team based game and the year is 2019. I'm embarrassed for you BHVR. Again, going back to the beginning, the game should have been planned on survivor's having voice comms. I can't say how, that would require some thought but if it had been a consideration, I'm certain things would be different. My guess is mostly to do with the pace of the game.
Look at how a L4D game ends up when players don't use voice comms. It's night and day. The game is broken without a team that communicates in many situations. But that was a consideration they had from the start.
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It looks like anything I don't like in a game=cheating therefore I don't like the fact that the killer kills me cheater!
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Ah yes, let me just play with my friends and not be able to talk with them. What a fun time.
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I'm tempted to let killers just block anything and everything they don't like - survivors, swf, items. We'll see how long that lasts when their queue times are three hours per game.
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In terms of teabagging one idea I saw that would be sort of funny would be to turn teabagging into an actual game mechanic.
You teabag in rapid succession in a chase (3-4 crouches in a row) while healthy, you "taunt" the killer. Doing this inflicts the exposed status effect for a duration of time while you earn double boldness points.
Basically people can still teabag, but they better be confident as heck in their looping ability. High risk, medium reward, but toxic survivors who teabag after every pallet stun etc. have to accept they'll be one-hit-downable.
This is more of a joke idea, but maybe if a survivor continues teabagging constantly, over, and over, and over and ignores the exposed proc, and they're teabagging their little pants off (Well beyond "Excessive") the killer could get the option to forfeit 25% of their bloodpoints that match to Mori them. Same type of idea, if they're going to teabag and be an [bad word], karma could bite. (Killer gets fed up, decides screw this and simply kills the survivor themself, Entity doesn't like it and you are punished with a BP penalty.) Limit one "Salt-Mori" per match.
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Just admit you're a salty kid and go.
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TBH my opponent using M1 is cheating.
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Agreed! Make sure to report everyone who uses M1 for cheating while you're at it!
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A completely different situation, and you know that. if you're going to have a dishonest argument you should stop replying. Unlike you i'm willing to throw my ideas away. You can change my mind. I've already been convinced it's not cheating.
You'd destroy open discussion just because you don't have the self control not to click on topics you don't like? And I do think having an unfair advantage should be dealt with in a fair way. Banning people for using unauthorized third party software was just an idea I had, and in no way relates to you wanting to censor, and ban people for talking about an obviously unbalanced aspect of the game.
You completely dismissing the rest of my reply to argue in one "gotcha" moment is indicative of a weak mind. And is morally questionable. There is a difference between banning something you don't agree with, and banning something because you want to improve that something. one is selfish, the other is not. You can also agree with something, but still understand it's negative effects.
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Now that a dev is aware of this thread, can they say if they're going to balance swf vs killer? At least somewhat? Or is there still a 'swf is fine, the killer can just go jump off a cliff' type mentality around it?
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Breaking News: Owning two TV sets in the same room is now bannable! We’ve done it folks, we’ve achieved world peace.
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I like how F13 does it. You can only hear others when your close or have the walkie talkie. And the killer (besides sense) can only hear when your close.
Then it's just a honor game XD
Me and my buddies always stick to it cause it's more fun that way
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The problem is that would only work if voice comms were implemented within the game, and third party equipment wasn't used.
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I'm not strictly opposed to survivors talking with each other, but it needs to be balanced (which the devs have embarrassingly failed to do so far).
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Using iri heads is cheating. It cuts chase length almost twice.
Running prayer beads is cheating. Without spine chill, you cant predict it
Using SweetFX is cheating. When players have different images of the same map, its unfair.
Git gud
SWF itself give you ability to not get done on first hook, use your time more efficient. You may be sure, that while you are running with killer, gens are progressing. SWF itself doesnt makes chases harder or easier. If they are 3 minutes length, its not SWF problem. Its your problem. Bodyblock is intended mechanic, that could be used by even solo players, just it ll be less effective. Same goes for gen rush.
You dont like toxic moves? Want them to be restricted? Ok then, lets punish the killer if they spam mori with... Consuming mori! They are toxic #########, they dont deserve it, didnt they? Killer is wiggling their head? Stun them for 5 seconds!
Avoid toxicness? Ok, let survivors see which killer they are facing, their addons, blessings, it ll be fair! Spirit? IRON WILL! Nurse? DC! Stealthy boi\oinker? OoO!
Your whole post is so killer biased, mate, its so salty. And SWF is not a cheating.
If you want some easy games, derank, you ll get them.
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Who chats when they play games? This isn't Pool or Poker, Idk but I've always liked playing in silence without distractions, rather be immersed in the gameplay.
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You probably not playing sweaty enough, gotta show no mercy.
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????
Yea, no one ever talks while playing video games, sorry bud but you're the minority here.
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I'm not your bud Mr.wolverine
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All of these suggestions you gave at first don't sound healthy for the game. Sure SWF is unbalanced due to comms but it would've been in regardless due to stuff like Discord or the built in party systems on consoles.
More emotes would be good for Solo Survivors as does the arrow indicator if they play in a swf but that in of itself can influence how the killer plays/dodge lobbies if they aren't all Solos. Resulting in longer que times for both that person and the group. It would take awhile to find a lobby with only solos when most people play in groups of two or four.
Bonus bp incentive and the timeouts on crouching/flashlights aren't a good solution as (as much as I'd hate to say it) it proves to be uneeded and a waste of development time. Just because people wanna play with friends and fool around shouldn't mean you get extra bp for playing a normal match nor should the toxic behaviors be stopped in animation as it wastes their own time that they could've used to get to a pallet/window and it happens alot where they overestimate how long they teabag to how far the pallet/window is. In fact, be happy that they're cocky as it will also make them play more cocky which will give you more times to get hits/downs from their cocky plays.
You also gotta remember, not all SFW groups are toxic/good. Its the few that ruin the name of many. You will encounter toxic sfw groups while playing both sides (being bullied and farmed as a Solo against the other three sucks) but that doesn't mean you can't win still. Toxicity doesn't mean they'll win, and getting annoyed about it mid and after game will just affect you more as you'll play worse due to it. If a toxic sfw group gets to you, take a break from the game or play the other side (i advise the first option, solo surv is hell and just as frustrating as playing killer sometimes) until the rage passes.
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Everyone does? I use the game as background when playing with friends sometimes it's fun to just play and chat some times.
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balance game around assumin survivors use voice chat , its not fun playing m1 killer vs good swf team , 0 enjoy in match o
or let us see who is swf its not that nerf like ######### why is that still not a thing
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Ok, Buddy.
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Consider all the problems spanning the history of humanity, all the death, pain, famine, disease and realise your complaining about someone teabagging you on a video game. What have we come to people
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Lmao complaining about the same perks again, half of which can be respected or have to be worked for. I'm going to say this again...
BT: Get the person who unhooked
SB: Just don't swing until they use it
MoM: Isn't even a problem anymore
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You know someone is just flat-out bad when they complain about MoM.
I've seen it proc once when I've played killer since the nerf.
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Ikr, it needed a nerf but it has no purpose anymore seeing as it's so difficult to activate and has a huge downside for the amount of work you need to do in order to proc it.
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Just play Nurse
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Cheating or not, tryhard SWF on comms make the game unfun as hell for me. I am usually pretty chill and relaxed when playing killer, aiming for 8 hooks 0k.
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Well you've already accepted comms isn't cheating, and while it is without a doubt an advantage that can be as big as the survivors want there's not much that can be done about it. Said it a thousand times before, but punishments, restrictions and handicaps are honestly a bad idea and pointless. Players that just want to chill and play with some friends will be put off, and the actual ~evil bully squads~ will just queue snipe eachother and drive queue times up for everyone just like people did before SWF was added. The only realistic options are incentives like BP modifiers and the often mentioned buff solos -> buff killers that need it approach.
And on "toxic" (I personally don't think taunt-like actions are inherently toxic, but it's subjective) behavior, restricting it is also pointless. Somehow find a magical solution that removes tbagging and flashlight clicking and people will just popularize something else to take their place if they really want. Maybe it'll be running in little circles, maybe it'll be pointing at the killer more often, maybe it'll be crouching and looking up and down to nod - and once enough people that play in a "toxic" manner adopt the new methods it will be percieved that way by killers that are bothered by tbagging/clicky clicky as well. You genuinely can't stop that sort of behavior unless it's bannable, which it isn't in DBD.
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Balance the damn game for voice comms. You know damn well 70% or more of the Survivors are in a group of at least two, if not more. Stop telling your ENTIRE Killer player base to “suck it up cause they want to have fun”, when their “fun” is nothing more than an ego trip stomping Killer players using extra help outside of the game.
Put a debuff on any Survivors that are in a SWF group. Plain and simple. Solo players are unaffected by this debuff.
Quit being scared of players leaving because they are petty and just want to win all the time.
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Using in game items isn’t the same as using out of games programs for help to get stronger. By all means though, live in your bubble.
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@SovererignKing, yeah i ll keep living in my double sided bubble. SWF is intended feature too, you know. You cant play in SWF, unless person is in your friend list. Its intended, that you have way of communication, even without 3 side programm.
In steam chat, PS4 party, XONE party.
And idea of debuff for SWF is trash, cause, example, decreasing repair speed with ruin will make a lot of difference. And so on. I agree, that killer should gain BP bonus for playing the game against SWF, but adjusting numbers for them will broke the game.
SWF tryhards will stay, as they are atm. Toxic swf will stay too. The only type of SWF that will be damaged is casual players. Also, your opinion, that every SWF playing for ego is #########.
Balancing the game around voice comms may be great decision. But, instead of giving solo-s VoIP, they may get gestures, callouts, whistles and etc.
I playing both sides equal, tbh.
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it would seem that you need to look up the definition of cheating
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SWF was intended, however the developers already admitted it was rushed out before the game was ready and balanced for it due to demand. They still haven't balanced for it. Again, voice comms is still outside the game, like it or not. You don't get to whine about Irri head on Huntress and the such then say voice comms is OK. Most of all when the developers specifically stated the game was not balanced nor designed to have that level of communication.
Adjusting the numbers for them, and them alone will make it simply balanced. They get at least 5 or more perks that give information that is vital for free. Not to mention just playing with team mates you know and trust, who can stack in perks with yours for maximum effect, as well as have play styles that synergize well with your own. There are more benefits to SWF than just voice comms.
SWF tryhards will be manageable instead of blatantly OP. Toxic will actually go down as it's kind of hard to be toxic when you get beaten repeatedly. Casuals will still play, they just won't get boosted to the higher ranks they can now due to leaning on SWF so much.
Also, please, do tell me how many SWF groups go into a match and do what my friends and I do. Where we purposely restrict ourselves? No calling out the Killers totem location. No calling out trap locations (if applicable). No calling out the Killers location. No saying who the Killer is until everyone already knows.
It is an ego thing, because they want to dominate and win, by any means. This includes basically cheating.
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If you are the random in a 3 swf party - you are screwed.
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Do people actually get salty over teabagging and clicking a flashlight?
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It's not relevant whatsoever that it's done with third-party applications when there's a post from Peanits in this very thread explicitly stating that it's not cheating or anything near it. It's the most explicitly "whitelisted" any third-party thing can possibly be, no "use at your own risk" like with icon replacements or MLGA or anything like that, but explicitly said to be completely okay.
Go ahead and argue about the balance surrounding it, I agree that there's work to do there (and I support the buff solo info + buff killers that need it approach), but calling it cheating or "basically cheating" is completely pointless as it's obvious that their current stance on the issue is the total opposite.
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The best part was.... The OP is new to the forums but has been playing DBD for 2 years and still didn't know using VOIP wasn't cheating.
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You act like SWF is a coordinated SWAT team, not just dudes chilling.
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I have a problem with swf communicating. And because I believe swf is broken I always use nurse vs swf because survivors can't stand nurse because they can't counter her or use their defenses against her
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You guys assume all swf groups are out to be toxic tryhards, when in reality they are mostly just people who want to play the game and have fun with friends. Games are always more enjoyable with friends why punish people for actually enjoying the game for once?
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In my defense on the outside of this community using coms really, really looks like cheating. It feels like cheating.
It's definitely an unfair advantage. Which can be easily mistaken for cheating. An honest, and understandable misconception imo.
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This is of course factually-correct. That makes it more hilarious and absurd.
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@Rydog My SWF's are very similar to yours - prob even worse - Mine are more like...
A- "What killer is it?"
B - Jason!"
A- "Jason? He isn't even in the game?"
B "Jason! The one with the knife and the mask, he is over by the tree"
A- "So micheal? Right ok - What tree?"
B- "By that rock, yknow that rock next to the tree"
B- "#########' his on me....ahhhhhhhhhh"...2 seconds..."I'm down"
A- "Is anyone close for the save or ?"
B- "Ermmm not really"
A - "Okay i'm coming" - Runs 500 yards...
B -"It's ok Claudette got me"
A- "FS...."
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But yeah...ban SWFS BAN THEM ALLLLLLL … not.
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@FredKrueger Tips for dealing with SWF
Lobby stage
- Always ready up last - see what items they are bringing in - don't like it? quit the lobby - or run Franklin's Demise.
Game stage
- Grab the first one, you can try and figure out who Is the weakest then camp them like #########. Then when you get a second one pretend to camp but dont' throw them off their game.
Post Game
- Play as a survivor for a few weeks so you can learn better patterns of movement
Rinse/Rpeat
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Man....someones having a bad go as killer when they want to BREAK flashlights and add a CD to crouching because they take another persons trivial actions WAAYYYYY too personally.
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Went a bit silly with the last three...
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