Make Moris either require 2 hooks, or give them 0 rank progress in the sacrifice category.
Moris are ridiculously boring, unfair, and is pretty much a guaranteed depip. There's no ultra rare survivor offering that guarantees the hatch spawns after one gen, so I feel like there needs to be a serious drawback to using them. I suggest either making it JUST a visual effect(this is my preferred idea, and many people generally agree with this), or make it give 0 rank progress in the sacrifice category. They can still keep their sacrifice bloodpoints, but 0 rank progress would guarantee they wouldn't be using the Mori just to win the game for them. I've seen too many ebony moris, so no, they are not rare, and again, imbalanced. If there's no survivor counter that rewards them an escape just as easy as it awards the killer a 3 or 4k, then there is no balance for the item. Cypress could stay as is, because it's actually pretty fair, but Ivory and Ebony moris are too strong to be an offering as they are, considering there is no survivor offering with the same strength. It'd make sense lore wise for the second option as the entity wants killers to hook their prey, but again, I'd rather they just be visual effects, rather than overpowered unfun mechanics.
And if you're going to come arguing about moris being fair, before you do imagine a survivor offering that guaranteed the hatch spawned after one generator. Because that's pretty much the same experience as an ebony.
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I think green and yellow mori is fine but yeah obivisouly Ebony mori is a win for a killer.
You can't do anything against a killer who tunnel you with a mori (BTW DS is useless in this case) and you depip after a 2 min game.
i think ranking system is'nt adapt to mori (90% of time if killer has mori you depip cause you play 2 min in your game).
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I've always liked the idea of Ivory/Ebony Mori being two-hook from an in-game balance standpoint, but my concern from a bloodpoint perspective is that an offering that only let you Mori after two-hook would be pretty useless outside of using it for daily ritual.
My personal suggestion would be to scrap all the current Mori offerings and then have two-hook Moris be baked into the bloodpoint offerings. Maybe have the yellow bloodpoint offerings let you Mori one person you've two-hooked (except Pudding and Hollow Shell) and the green offerings let you Mori anyone you've two-hooked (except Bloody Streamers). I know those bloodpoint offerings tend to be pretty useless, so having the two-hook Moris be baked into them could at least give you slightly more reason to want them.
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@TAG Honestly that's a pretty unique and nice idea.
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If moris go keys need to as well...as they give a very similar benefit..difference being survivors are rewarded for using keys and can be farmed in game using plunderers plus get multi used from a single one. While killers only rarely get them..black pip at best when using them plus losing points and are always lost no matter what , plus are not a guaranteed win at all..strong yes but I've survived without even seeing a mori be used...however keys can give entire games with of benefits and on top of it all ignores the egc mechanic nearly entirely when the killer finds the black lock first...cant be unfair and just strip moris of use when statistically keys are just as strong if not stronger..just my thoughts anyway
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Don't moris already not award sacrifice points, because they don't count as a hook state?
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@immortalls96 Um...how is a key similar of benefit to a mori? A purple or red key both require all 5 gens to be done for all 4 to escape. A red mori pretty much automatically gives the killer a win and depips for everybody, and a green mori greatly enhances a killer's chances to win. For a key, you still need to do every objective, unless people die, in which case you still need to do as many gens -1 for every death. Survivors are rewarded for using keys because they still did their entire objective.
This is why I said before you think moris are balanced, to imagine an offering where survivors only had to do one gen, and the hatch spawned, because as of right now the hatch only spawns when all 5 gens are done, unless the killer is winning. The key doesn't automatically give survivors an advantage. It gives them a chance of escape when things are going badly.
A mori automatically puts the game in the killer's advantage regardless of the situation, and no, moris are not rare. I've seen several, even going so far as multiple in a row. In a normal game, a killer with an ebony mori will automatically have 8 hook states removed, if he kills everyone, which is very likely if he slugs the next to last survivor, and a killer will automatically be trying to use that mori ASAP, meaning ignoring everyone else except the person who was just unhooked.
Survivors with a key need: 5 generators, and 3 other people to listen to them when looking for the hatch for a 4 escape. These are not the same mechanics, and I would argue a key is NOTHING like a mori. That said, how else would one use the hatch if keys were removed? How would one get the 4 people escape through the hatch achievement? And the EGC isn't a guaranteed kill for survivors, and if they have a key it's likely one of the only ways to get out if the killer got a 3k and closed the hatch because of how the doors are positioned. I'm not against the removal of keys(although I can't imagine how it would work with that achievement, and honestly keys don't seem that powerful to me), but I find them pretty lackluster as a killer with Franklin's can remove the key from the survivor, and again, they still need to do 5 gens unless people die.
@Rydog Pretty sure you still get them, just not as many because you're not hooking them as much as you normally would need to.
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I see where your coming from but...the mori cant be activated without a hook first..technically the mori only removes 1 down from the equation so it's not as huge as people like to pretend..I say keys are just as strong because they can be modified, still give free escapes weyher you acknowledge it or not, and as I said can be farmed in abundance..a key shouldnt be as strong as it's a 1v4 so the killer should have more punch regardless
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@immortalls96 Except you completely ignore Decisive Strike with a mori, so camping just outside the hook is encouraged and the second "hook state" isn't really something that's accomplished by normal means. That's why I say it removes 2. It completely ignores a hook, because you bypass the carrying to the hook(eliminating the occasional escape from the killer's grasp while carrying you). Normally you would either be slugged or picked up, with a chance of escape, but once downed, you're done for. Key modifications aren't that powerful and you can't use a key multiple times unless you have an addon that allows you to use it again after opening the hatch, or dying with it, and those aren't super common either. Also they can't be modified if they are gotten from a chest, and upon using one, it's destroyed, so I'm not sure how they can be farmed in abundance unless you escape without going through the hatch. A key is in no way more powerful than a mori, as again, it requires you to do MUCH MORE of your objective as a survivor than a mori does, and their conditions are completely different, as I said. A key requires you as a survivor to do your entire objective if you want 4 to escape. An ebony mori on the other hand requires you to do 1/4th your objective for a 4k(12 hooks normally, 4 hooks and 4 downs with an ebony). Again, the only comparable thing to a mori would be if survivors had an offering that allowed 4 people to escape via the hatch after one generator, or one and a quarter generators, two at most if you want to count downing them.
Moris also are not as rare as people say. I've gotten several just leveling characters from 1-40, and some people have had 3 on the same bloodweb right next together(and they were ebonies). Also the rate they are used also backs up my statement. Even while in yellow ranks I saw ebonies commonly on killers who were not fully leveled.
They are too powerful, not fun to play against(proven by how you constantly see people DC against them), and unfair(there is no survivor alternative, as I said, keys are completely different). They should only be made as visual effects and nothing more, unless a survivor offering is made in the same vein(and really I'd rather not go that route). TAG's idea is probably a really good implementation of how moris should work.
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The entire idea of making moris useless is bluntly biased to the extreme and as someone who's leveled nearly every killer past level fifty by a long shot I can assure you they are very very rare..never seen multiple moris together..I have seen 2 bnp connected to each other however very recently..so do forgive me if i feel your facts are more than slightly skewed on the whole idea
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Wow, I had the same idea about how moris should be changed. Having moris only work when someone is dead on hook is a change I'd love to see as it will effectively make playing survivor no longer ridiculous if the killer decides to run a mori. Although, wouldn't using a key be the same as running a mori?
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Exactly..but nobody wants the keys looked at because only survivor mains want moris nerfed..God forbid they should lose something similar XD
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@immortalls96 again, I don't care about keys but they are nothing like a mori. Not even close, and no one hardly ever uses BNP. Also, there was even a picture showing 3 ebonies connected by a bloody party streamers on these very forums a month or two ago. I don't even use keys. Their situation requires either you to do your entire objective, or most or your objective. It's underwhelming. You can feel cheated if someone manages to do 3 or 4 gens and you kill everyone but one, but that's drastically different than having a snowball from the beginning of the game. Keys are a safety net in case you start losing, but a mori is a bazooka that helps you win from the start. Entirely different concepts. As for BNP, people often call BNP useless. But anyways, if you truly believe keys are as strong as a mori, you and 3 teammates bring a red key vs a killer with an ebony and tell me how they're so similar. Manage a 4 man escape through the hatch in that situation 5 times out of 10 at least. That would prove your point that keys are just as overpowered as moris.
Also I am not a main of anything. I play both pretty equally depending on who I am leveling(I play who I intend to use my BP on). I've suggested things for both killer and survivor, and it's a little ridiculous to me that you're saying only survivor mains want moris nerfed when I have seen many killers also want them nerfed and even TAG is a Pig main and he agreed right in this very thread disproving you. The only ones who don't want moris nerfed are the ones who want to use them for either easy games, just to be dicks, or for revenge. I think that enough explains that moris are overpowered. Just because something is overpowered and needs a nerf on one side does not mean something else needs nerfed on the other, and again, for a key to have a similar escape as an ebony gives kills, you would need to do 5 gens. That's your entire objective as a survivor. Moris make things easier, keys just give an alternate escape option after you've already done what you needed to do, and nerfing or removing keys would make that achievement more difficult/impossible to obtain and they can't change ps4 trophies. I have rarely ever seen anyone complain about keys as there are also multiple ways to deal with them. Moris actually don't have a counter.
Post edited by Atrushan88 on0 -
Mori may be an easy way for the killer to against with the squads doing gen rush. I play this game for a long time, but I didn't get killed by the mori offering when I play in single. We should not be so strict to the killer player, I think if the decisive strike can be used for the mori, that could be better.
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That'll make Decisive Strike a must use perk. It's better to nerf the Mori itself as that's the root of the issue.
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All right. to be honest, I think the mori is just OK. trying to nerf the mori itself may be a bit embarrassing...
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