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Killer/trial balancing ideas(Devs pls read & comment I worked hard for you)
Just wondering what everyone thinks about some Killer changes that I've thought of. I obviously doubt any will come to fruition but you never know if others are in agreement.
Trapper:
Feels like the current meta of the game the only trap about the trapper is it's a trap to waste time getting the traps because the time you even begin setting up one or two traps at least 1 generator will pop if not multiple being ready to pop immediately. It would be nice if the trapper had his traps defaulted picked up or have 5 and a total amount of them and retrieve them from lockers like huntress does for her hatchets. That little bit of time saving would probably make this killer more enjoyable to play. I just feel my first thought when playing him shouldn't be "do I wait to set traps until I know nobody is on generators or put one down now for later?".
Pig:
She's not the worst killer but she's certainly nowhere near as good as she could be. It would be nice if she could either move faster when crouched(not by much) or have a better default lunge, perhaps removing the noise, it's abnoxious to sneak up within 8 meters of someone and use the dash and then an immediate game of "which direction is the survivor going to go" because if you pick wrong 9 times out of 10 it's a miss and not to mention my other idea if the one above isn't good is remove the long pause after the missed dash, it's literally like being stunned by a tier 2 decisive. Great ability to get within distance, but slow and time costing. Especially when generators only take 80 seconds at their base you really can't afford to move about the whole map using that ability.
Clown:
It would be nice if clown could auto reload all of his bottles at once, that change right there would be enough to make a m1 killer like him more viable. As a rank one survivor and rank one killer I might add.. my first thoughts shouldn't be "oh it's clown it's an easy game this time". That should never be the case. Ofc the pinky finger would need a change to make the reload bottles one at a time like it currently is because it would be broken if he auto reloaded a bunch of one hits lol. But outside of that add on this type of change would make a m1 killer like clown viable to play.
Legion
Don't worry I played both sides of the former powered Legion and I'd like to believe the last thing anyone killer or survivor wants is to have the old Legion back. My suggestion for Legion to make him a bit more viable would be to make his power have one more innate effect, keeping the same timer for mends because it's fine how it is but apply an innate hemorrhage effect after the mend. This ways it's not impossible to find someone after using the ability but gives the survivor the chance to mend like they currently do. Obviously not as powered at slowing healing as sloppy but about half the power of it innate and caps at using sloppy.
Survivor With Friends Lobby's (3 or full party):
I find this to be the most insane part of this game. A SWF team has so many incredible advantages that a regular team doesn't and it completely and entirely makes this game beyond unbalanced for a killer who isn't running one of the big three. Firstly, SWF can communicate where the killer is at all times which allowes the team to focus on gens, they can call out traps/pallets/puke/snares/travel teleports etc which makes being a killer that much more difficult because their power is now at a natural disadvantage. This ofc includes if you hook a Survivor they can call out where exactly the killer is to a specific area of the map which allows for one person to grab while the rest do generators efficiency. In a normal trial I do believe this game meets the Survival horror aspect most of the time, however in SWF lobbies it's horror for the killer, and it's not a survival fight it's a timed race of gen rushing. I believe generators should have a default time of 100 seconds and only one toolbox should work on a generator in these lobbies. The requirements I believe for the above to met would be:
1. 3 or 4 users in a SWF group in the lobby
2. Half the team is of Red Ranks
Obviously these lobbies are harder games and more stressful for the killer naturally so it should be appropriate that bloodpoints are increased in these trials by 30-50% at the final for all people in the trial. Which hopefully encourages people to not suicide hooks/DC/give up and the killer will want to and have incentive to want to stay for a SWF lobby. Especially at the ranks above to enter this trial bloodpoints aren't as needed but obviously welcomed for future add-ons. I'd even day an increase in XP by 25% should be encouraged as well.
Mori's
Ebony Mori's shouldn't be allowed to be used in a trial until the trial has gone on for over 9 minutes(where the gatekeeper medal is determined). This way a team has the full possibility of being able to pop a fee generators by the time it's possible to Mori and it allows survivors to not have a killer with complete incentive to tunnel someone down after the first hook, instead the killer would want to go for someone else for their first hook.
Keys
Keep them how they are but if the killer closes the hatch and begins the endgame collapse no survivor key should work on the hatch because the survivor wasn't fast enough to get the free escape. This ofc should mean if a survivor has a key it should be kept if they don't make it out of the trial as a courtesy for them. Killers more often than not earn those victories and closing the hatch should be the nail in the coffin on escaping from from it.
Pallets
If a killer is on tier 1 bloodlust a pallet break shouldn't cause the bloodlust to stop. A pallet stun should though. At tier 1 bloodlust a killer is not fast enough for long loops to mind game properly to get a good survivor or even most of the time an inexperienced survivor. At tier 2 blood lust or tier 3 however the killer should lose the bloodlust to obviously discourage farming pallet drops from a panicked survivor. A survivor should have some confidence. Worth mentioning the killer should lose the bloodlust at tier 1 if they break the pallet and can't find the survivor with 3-5 seconds on screen.
Generators
A killer that KICKS a generator with intent of breaking it should do some better regression to the generator. Especially as well all have seen those chases where a killer kicks a generator and the survivor touches it with their finger and it's fixed. The killer to do that requires an action. A survivor to magically stop the regression requires no action whatsoever and they are equal. Intent to break with a kicked action by a supernatural killer should not be equal to a survivor touching the generator with their finger and running away. The stopped regression should only stop regressing after 1.25 seconds of the generator being worked on by a survivor again(so shorter duration than default mad grit)
Ruin:
I understand the frustration of Ruin previously for many survivors, just as I understand the frustration for killers without it. It would be nice if the current ruin could receives a part of the old ruins effect on generators until destroyed (no bonus progression for hitting greater skill checks) it's silly because it's so easy and the reverse argument of survivors saying ,"ruin is useless at high ranks" is quite Incorrect because that small progress forced gens at best to be at 80secs solo without repair boosts. It gave killers the time they needed. Can do without the smaller skill checks bar though to make it fair. It gives a bit of the slow that it once had but not like it once was.
Edit as of 12:27 am 2/28/20 below
Spies from the Shadows:
Since this perk has a cooldown of activating it would be cool since the gimmick of the Perk essentially has the killers and the crows for the most part working together to not have the crows alert survivors if the killer is around. Where the reverse perk of Whispers is active at all times and let's a kill hone in on a precise location by moving in and out then left and right of the 32m area to find a survivor that's hiding. It would be good especially if there was an additional "5 second" cooldown for the crows not to make a sound and flee if a killer goes by. Obviously if a killer is running by two crows, one would stay silent and the other would make a sound by the cooldown as stated above. It would create a little more reason to use this type of perk when paired with some of the smaller terror radius builds to be as optimal as possible.
Enduring:
This perk has taken a massive heavy hit as of late by switching the stun penalty to just pallets alone which has created this perk to be used solely in tandem with Spirit Fury based builds for the most part. It would be good if this perk can receive a portion of its power back in a balanced way. For example; after activating and stopping any stun that is either a carry-escape, decisive strike, or head on the perk would activate for 10-15 seconds to reduce any stuns the killer may take by the 50%. This would stop survivors from chain stunning a killer which has become a rather annoying thing, especially during end-game collapse where a survivor would decisive strike the killer near a locker, then someone else would hop into the locker and chain stun the killer. This would basically keep the perk as it currently is however add a bit more weight to its potential to stop being bullied by survivors like this. This really isn't a combo a survivor should be able to pull off.
Coulrophobia:
This perk must be one of the most least played killer perks in the history of this game. I've watched so many streams and played so many matches to realize no-one really runs this perk. It would be good if it would receive an added benefit for not just healing but mending also. Most killers who have a mend function, unless a borrowed time occurs, they don't have the largest of terror radius's and there's stops inside their kits from stopping them being able to completely and entirely tunnel down a survivor. This would at least let the perk be possibly used by the odd gimmick build and potentially a bit more different things.
Monstrous Shrine:
This perk is great how it currently is, but it shouldn't be limited to just the basements. It should slow down the opening of chests and decrease the time it takes for end-game collapse to be complete for when the entity intervenes. The point in this game is that the Entity is some unholy supernatural force powerful enough to subdue killers to its will and wants to see the death of the survivors. This perks name is Monstrous Shrine not Monstrous Basement and it would end up being used on more than just a trapper who is camping someone in a basement. In addition to the above if it were to be ran on some other builds an interesting pairing of this perk and Blood Warden would occur, which would essentially make for the Killer only using two perks during the trial in an attempt to have a better end-game portion so it would let the whole "gen rushing" still be good, the potential to escape still be there, but more importantly gives the killer a more common reason to use this perk.
Franklins Demise:
Perk is absolutely great to use, it can be completely useless in many instances, however in the right scenario it can be vicious. It would be nice if instead of 10% of the base value, which isn't necessarily too much as it would require you to knock the item out of someones hands 10 times in a trial to deplete it(which is the side-point of the perk). It would be nice if it would have a 20% chance to disable an add-on that is attached to it during the trial. Obviously I say disable so that if the survivor escapes they are able to retain their hard kept items. But all-in-all it actually gives this perk a "Demise" factor and it doesn't become a complete waste of a slotted perk and survivors are still able to use the base kit for their add-ons.
The Wraith:
This is such an interesting concept for this Killer with the power to go invisible and re-appear at will. However, his power is also what holds him back as he is completely a M1 Killer that is dependent on his add-on speeds or perks(not even his own) to be viable. In lower tier play The Wraith is an absolute menace for newer survivors but in higher tier play, even against randoms most people laugh. It would be good if this killer could receive a power-up that isn't so powerful to completely irritate survivors in lower tiers but also make him more viable in higher tiers. Wraiths natural weakness's are being super loopable. It would be cool if the wraith could have an effect with the "wailing" bell. Specifically if a survivor is within x meters of the wraith who is using the wailing bell, the survivor that was in the area would have a temporary(few seconds) disorientation effect with a deafening effect which would prevent the survivor hearing anything in the trial. This would still be the same giveaway that the killer is nearby and coming as per normal, but would give The Wraith the potential element of surprise on a survivor which is his entire powers gimmick. Currently any survivor can hear the direction of the bell and just take off to pallets and be gone before the wraith begins moving post bell ringing.This also wouldn't ruin the silent approach with the add-on which would still have use as the survivor wouldn't know the killer is around(wouldn't cause the deafening). Definition of Wailing below. No reason that sound can't make the survivor deaf for just a few seconds. All-in-all not the largest change, but enough to be more playable at high ranks with mind games and it's still relatively the same for lower ranks.
Definition of Wailing:
making a prolonged high-pitched sound.
Killer Chest (giving rewards to a killer)
Currently this type of idea would be a waste of time in the trial for a killer especially when it's such a time based meta because of gen rushing. It would be nice if post trial, if the killer received a Merciless they could be allowed to keep their add-ons. This is honestly the perfect idea to create incentive for a Killer to try. Currently if a survivor escapes any trial they are allowed to keep their item + add-ons. It would be nice if the Killer upon receiving a Merciless victory would be granted a gift from the Entity in the form of the add-ons for their power that they brought into the trial to be retained. Currently at any tier of play a Merciless Victory requires the Killer to not tunnel, camp, and actually do all of the objectives(break pallets, defend gens, hook survivors, win chases). It wouldn't be fun for survivors if a Killer could finish a trial and retain their add-ons if they win every single time especially when some add-ons are really strong(looking at huntress hatchets or unlimited t3 myres or pinky finger etc). However.. A merciless requires much more than running through a team in record time, more often than not when a killer does it. It's done with red add-ons. Although when a Killer does get a Merciless Victory it's a hard fought victory on their end which more often than not has yellow/green add-ons for their powers. That little bit of incentive to go for a Merciless would make it worth it for a Killer to want to actually try in order to keep their add-ons. After-all the killer is doing it for the entity, it's only fair if the entity bestows something to the Killer in this instance.
Edited again below
Region or Global Leaderboard
It would be nice if we could have a region or Global based leaderboard. The current Matchmaking does not take account your rank in game but uses a hidden experience as the matchmaking portion whole coexisting with the rank system that can be displayed. One thing is for sure there's lots of competitive players in this game so it would be nice if we could add a leaderboard to track the amount of times a survivor or killer has received a +2 pip via the current rank system when holding a red rank. This would again create incentive for a portion of the player base that are competitive to really want to try their best each game. Perhaps even allowing a new custom icon or a modified version of the current red ranks perhaps like the prestiged version to show that they're at a certain class of the leaderboard. This would give killers a reason not to depip if they want to try and be on said leaderboard as it would require red ranks to progress. It would also mean more survivors may want to try killer to get on both Leaderboard and vice versa which ultimately is the goal of the daily log in challenge's and the ascendant challenges. This could be another potentially motivating factor for higher level players to want to face other higher level players and not just pub stomp with their friends a purple or green ranked killer.
Edit for Feb 29th
Killer Totems during SWF (3 or 4man):
Noed? Devourer Hope? Two most hated Killer perks when they get going. Killers Defense? "Stop gen rushing and cleanse totems" 9/10 in higher end lobbies the killer can't even get going before the totems come into play.
What if the Killer could see all their totems on the map(totems need new spawn placements as well on all maps to be properly random and not bugged out random like some after the Freddy rework!)
What if for every uncleansed totem when the final generator is complete the exit gates take an additional 4% longer to open and the endgame collapse is faster by 2%. If no totems in the trial were cleansed the killer receives a 3% movement speed increase and 15% action speed increase on top of the additional door time. The flip side for each totem that has been cleansed the survivor exit door opens 4% faster. If all totems have been cleansed when the exit gate is opened it also opens the other exit gate and the hatch on the map in addition to rewarding each of the alive survivors that have cleansed a totem the bloodpoints for opening those three things.
This gives any survivors the incentive to get out even faster, but also gives killers the opportunity to have an additional slowdown mechanic for the game to progress.
Edit for Feb 29th later in the Day
Oni:
Oni to me after a number of trials with him against high survivors he's super strong, has amazing tracking because of the blood that's left behind for his power, the base power regen is great, so is the suctioning, and he's got a 1 hit ko power when it's ready and extremely easy to control speed all at base. I've been able to down multiple survivor teams through slugging with him without any issues with no addons. I'm of the opinion that this must not be fun for survivors to go against however the idea of this Killer is amazing. Instead of nerfing his power, why not decrease his field of view by a slight percentage when he's doing his rush attack this way it'll require him to look for already hurt survivors or tracks to find someone but at the same time potentially could remove some of his godtier map movement without hurting the actual movement but just the visibility of what he can see when using that form.
Nurse:
One thing I would work say that should have balance though is not the amount of blinks a nurse can do but the distance while doing the blinking. For example why not just give her one ability meter and she can choose one incredibly long blink or up to 3 shorter blinks(each taking 33% of the meter) before it goes on cooldown for 2 seconds and comes back up. That imo gives killers the surprise for an even longer map jump, allows them to close chases with shorter blinks. But also lets survivors have an idea of how far the nurse can go based on what's being charged and how many blinks she has remaining guaranteed.
As for the perks that do some of those things they should be changed to effects instead, a slowing effect for one perk(to replace the charge speed) and an exhaustion causing effect until 1 second after nurse next blinks for the other perk(so instead of multiple blinks it just stops a survivor from being able to dead hard the next blink but also lets the survivor have the distance and chance to get away and the effect goes if nurse misses the next blink attack. Would work perfectly seeing as nurse would never catch someone walking so the disabled exhaustion wouldn't even matter in that right.
Disconnect Feature
The current Disconnect feature is very flawed. Update: As I was typing this I was loading up a game and immediately, I'm sure it's a coincidence, I got complete validation for my point of flawed. This happened less than 1 minute into a trial. https://i.imgur.com/rTTGvFy.jpg
The player(I cut his name out) let me kill him and killed himself on hook. It was a dwight with legacy fire as well.
So As I was going to originally say the current system is flawed and is just going to make a survivor KILL themselves on the hook. Is this a solution? NOPE!
Here's why:
It prevents the Killer from getting Merciless Victories
It prevents the Survivors from getting their max amount of points because it removes the extra participant for safe unhooks, blocks, co-op actions and forces the remaining survivors to be in even more potentially bad chases.
Patch 1.5.3 info below for a KillerL
Survivor Disconnect during Trial: Survivors who disconnect after 5 minutes of the Trial will grant the Killer +4 Killer Goals as they would be depriving the Killer of his Killer Goals.
This absolutely ridiculous because any survivor who is downed within 5 minutes has the potential to just kill themselves on the hook completely screwing the killer over of their points. If a Killer does the dcing it's just a wait timer.
I'm of the opinion the wait timer between trials should be a thing but it should be tweaked to account for client issues(the DBD client is buggy and sometimes crashes happen) which leads me to my suggestion for BOTH killer & survivors who DC.
Survivor:
If a survivor hasn't repaired a generator in 3+ minutes or been in a chase that hasn't involved them moving more than 10 steps the survivor should be marked out as a Disconnect from game as they are clearly not playing which makes the trial no fun.
If a Killer hasn't moved at least 10 steps or entered in more than one different chase or done an action against a generator in over 3 minutes the Killer should be marked as DC'D, the trial should end, and the survivors should retain their bloodpoints they earned and either be granted their pip they earned or the +0 (never a negative) along with retaining their items and addons they brought into the trial.
If a survivor purposely struggles to their death and lets themselves die within 5 minutes of a trial the Killer should receive MAX points for this survivor as if they actually played. There shouldn't be any penalization to a Killer because a survivor chose to give up or leave and avoid the DC Penalty. The other survivors in the trial should each get a bit of a boost to their end-game points as well because their chance to escape is much smaller. It's not fair for them either.
In addition to the above there should be a limiter in effect
Each trial a survivor or killer can achieve a maximum +2 pip bloodpoint accumulation of 32,000(not counting boosts).
Purposely killing yourself, or Disconnecting from a trial should have the Entity REMOVE 32,000 Bloodpoints from the player who disconnected. If a player goes into the negative on Bloodpoints the DC Penalty timer should count against them for each match until they paid back the bloodpoints tithe to the Entity. When the bloodpoints debt is paid back they can resume regular trials without wait again. In addition to the above if a survivor or killer were to receive a disconnect in X games within X allotted time and they have bloodpoints to lose they should still meet the DC timer.
The above method should discourage all forms of giving up and quitting, it should have a proper penalty for DC'ing as no one will want to play a trial or two or three to pay back points because they got angry and left a trial. It should also make them think twice about logging back into play if they're disconnecting for the day and it'll reward the rest of the players in the trial that they disconnected from to actually continue to play and enjoy themselves.
Edit for Surveillance
Surveillance:
due to how Hex Ruin currently works it has made Surveillance absolutely godtier for a perk combination as it gives globalmap pressure on all mobility based killers. Due to this and understanding just how powerful Surveillance is, it's already incredibly strong for killers even if it were to stay the same but for a survivor it's just absolutely horrid to go against as it's essentially an endless bbq chili. My suggestion for this perk is the "16 seconds" a generator stays yellow on the map should be reduced by a little bit as just in general with how powerful this perk is for awareness it's incredibly long lasting and makes for killers to be able to win chases and still see what's going on at all of the generators where survivors once were.
I'd love to know what you all think.
Comments
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Updated with an additional suggestion
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Bump - realized it's against forum rules mb
Post edited by ImMrBloo on0 -
Bump - realized it's against forum rules mb
Post edited by ImMrBloo on0 -
Some of this sound really good to me. But ,sorry to say this, bumping a thread isnt allowed here. (As far as i know) Sorry if i am mistaken i just dont want you to get mutet or something.
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@Demonl3y Glad some of it sounds good to you, I hoped to achieve that, I'll be writing a more in depth version of other changes I believe would be good in the post below in a little bit. If you think it's good be sure to "vote up" so that the devs have a chance of seeing it.
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Okay I've finished my entire post now, time to sleep 😀
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Those one where the killer could keep his add ons is the best one i think. I just have many matches where i use urltra rare offerings and addons and dont get back the points because the survivors always DC if i one hit them with my hatches or if i mori them. :(
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Yup I know what you mean, although in my suggestion it would require the killer to get a merciless and afaik 9/10 using mori's will only at most give you +1 pip unless you double hook to start and play normally instead of going for the uber beatdown lol
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Added an additional suggestion
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And the Nurse ??
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I chose not to bring up the nurse as I believe she has been well covered with all of the bugs going on by both the playerbase, and the devs commenting on it, and streamers making videos about it. What I hope to achieve is bringing a light on other things that have been discussed but haven't had balance in mind for survivors or killers at the same time. If you were asking me my personal opinion on the nurse though I'd say she has the second most overpowered perk set for a killer (hag wins that). I think all of her perks are great for her.
One thing I would work say that should have balance though is not the amount of blinks a nurse can do but the distance while doing the blinking. For example why not just give her one ability meter and she can choose one incredibly long blink or up to 3 shorter blinks before it goes on cooldown for 2 seconds and comes back up. That imo gives killers the surprise for an even longer map jump, allows them to close chases with shorter blinks. But also lets survivors have an idea of how far the nurse can go based on what's being charged and how many blinks she has remaining guaranteed.
As for the perks that do some of those things they should be changed to effects instead, a slowing effect for one perk(to replace the charge speed) and an exhaustion causing effect until 1 second after nurse next blinks for the other perk(so instead of multiple blinks it just stops a survivor from being able to dead hard the next blink but also lets the survivor have the distance and chance to get away and the effect goes if nurse misses the next blink attack. Would work perfectly seeing as nurse would never catch someone walking so the disabled exhaustion wouldn't even matter in that right. :) Thoughts? @Fengmin200
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Added an additional suggestion
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I have several other things I'll be adding to the post later today
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It's not even a nerve anymore, it's killing the Nurse 🤣
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Updated to include Nurse & Oni
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You could edit you original post with Edit: Added etc, you're clearly only adding these "Edits" as comments to "stealth" bump your post.
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I've added that in the message as well @SenzuDuck already. Is it against forum rules to mention on a thread when something is updated? Afterall it's new content being added and not the same content existing as I've been doing large-scale edits every time I've added stuff. Also since you commented, what do you think about my ideas? 😃
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@SenzuDuck just in case you didn't get the above message I'd still love to know what you think :)
Also I updated for the Disconnect Penalities as I believe my system idea is much better than the current implemented one :)
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