Let's talk about Saboteur

SaltyKiller
SaltyKiller Member Posts: 474
edited May 2018 in Feedback and Suggestions

As far as Survivor perks that really grind my gears I would say Saboteur is either my 2nd or 3rd most hated after Decisive Strike. But I don't know what it is about this perk but all Survivor mains not only say it's fine but that it's really weak. They say the same exact thing about Adrenaline as well.

Saboteur is the only perk in the game that completely stops a Killer from killing Survivors. My main problem with the perk is that Survivors can work on a hook, get it to 99%, walk away, and then just touch it to destroy it.

That's the #1 thing I hate about this perk that they can walk away from a hook and just touch it to save their buddies or troll the Killer.

Thoughts? And if you're going to say "LOL, it's fine." Then explain why you think that. Because you couple that perk with offerings that remove hooks and it's absolute hell to play Killer. If you play against an SWF team and there's a guy with that perk/toolbox and it's going to be absolute hell.

Comments

  • ZiNc
    ZiNc Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 250

    Throwback to running to a corner to go down and knowing you'd be safe... IG + AG forever in 2016 ;p

    Honestly, as a killer sabo is no longer a threat. It has its times where it can be slightly annoying, but not enough to warrant any sort of major change imo.

  • ZiNc
    ZiNc Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 250

    @SaltyKiller said:

    @ZiNc said:
    Throwback to running to a corner to go down and knowing you'd be safe... IG + AG forever in 2016 ;p

    Honestly, as a killer sabo is no longer a threat. It has its times where it can be slightly annoying, but not enough to warrant any sort of major change imo.

    Again, explain why you think it's fine. Because, again, they can work a hook to 99%, step away for as long as the match goes on, and if you bring someone to that hook they can just touch it to save their buddy. Explain why you think that's fine. I want to see the mental gymnastics in action.

    Because this godforsaken perk is the reason why I stick Hangman's Trick on all of my Killers.

    It's fine because that's one less survivor working on a generator, on top of the one you're carrying. Suppose you drop the one you're carrying to chase the one who was sabotaging. That's now three survivors not working on generators.

    Sounds alright to me =)

  • Techn0
    Techn0 Member Posts: 405
    edited May 2018

    I believe it is fine currently. Not because of the three minute timer but because it takes time to sabo. You can always slug or use a perk like third seal/knockout to hide where you are from the sabo squad. Right now it is simply the better option to go do gens then it is to sabo. Sabo wastes so much time and the gens get done so quickly that there really is not a point in doing it. Sabo can be extremely annoying and I understand that but I would much rather go up against a sabo squad then a gen-rushing team as in this meta sabo squads are shooting themselves in the foot before a race.

  • Visionmaker
    Visionmaker Member Posts: 2,051
    edited May 2018

    @Steve said:
    Personally, after sabo got nerfed. I agree with @ZiNc in saying, sabo is no longer really a threat to killers.

    BUT: If you are concerned, you can always use brutal strength or even agitation.. You don't really need both, since sabo isn't really OP, in my opinion.

    You mean Iron Grasp. And most killers use one or both.

    Sabotage is just a troll tech. If survivors have time to 99% each and every hook you somehow go to, and they still manage to complete gens/escape, then you're probably doing something horribly wrong.

  • Mc_Harty
    Mc_Harty Member Posts: 3,293

    @Steve said:
    Personally, after sabo got nerfed. I agree with @ZiNc in saying, sabo is no longer really a threat to killers.

    BUT: If you are concerned, you can always use brutal strength or even agitation.. You don't really need both, since sabo isn't really OP, in my opinion.

    Hangman's Trick is also good for Sabotuer as well.

    Renders the perk useless if you don't mind using a perk slot against it.

  • Trundler
    Trundler Member Posts: 20

    I personally was feeling it could use a buff, but I'm content where it is now.

    1) Without a toolbox, the sabotaging of hooks using Saboteur perk takes a very long time. This time is always better used towards a generator.
    2) Even with a toolbox, when you 99% the hooks, you still need to be in a similar area that the killer DOWNS a player, and the killer BRINGS the player. Spending all this time to sabotage and still be in the area to finish off the hooks just delays the game.

    Imagine the survivor you downed gets away from those hooks. Worst case scenario is you have two survivors to chase after now instead of one.

  • Trundler
    Trundler Member Posts: 20

    @SaltyKiller said:

    @Trundler said:

    2) Even with a toolbox, when you 99% the hooks, you still need to be in a similar area that the killer DOWNS a player, and the killer BRINGS the player. Spending all this time to sabotage and still be in the area to finish off the hooks just delays the game.

    Imagine the survivor you downed gets away from those hooks. Worst case scenario is you have two survivors to chase after now instead of one.

    Yeah, it's not like Survivors can see each other's aura's when getting attacked or downed and people or people play SWF with mics. That's just not a thing...

    I really don't know what it is but people seem to think it's fine. The only change I want is that they cannot work on a hook to 99% (or any percentage), step away from it, and then just touch it to destroy it. That's it.

    But for whatever bizarre reason there's people who think that's fine. I'm just going to have to assume that these are the same kind of people that enjoy getting kicked in the nuts and think that's great.

    "What? You got kicked in the nuts in a fight? Great! It adds to the challenge and it's not like you get knifed!"

    I see where you're coming from but there are way more important things to be upset about in this game balance wise haha...

    P1: "Oh man, come die over here! I 99'd the hooks so the killer will have to drop you!"
    P2: "Okay but why didn't you just work on a generator?"
    Killer: "Welp ok I guess"

  • Xoxonas
    Xoxonas Member Posts: 4

    @Visionmaker said:

    @Steve said:
    Personally, after sabo got nerfed. I agree with @ZiNc in saying, sabo is no longer really a threat to killers.

    BUT: If you are concerned, you can always use brutal strength or even agitation.. You don't really need both, since sabo isn't really OP, in my opinion.

    You mean Iron Grasp. And most killers use one or both.

    Sabotage is just a troll tech. If survivors have time to 99% each and every hook you somehow go to, and they still manage to complete gens/escape, then you're probably doing something horribly wrong.

    Yes, you are a baby cry killer , and cant adapt , that game is not for you man.

  • ZiNc
    ZiNc Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 250

    @Xoxonas said:

    @Visionmaker said:

    @Steve said:
    Personally, after sabo got nerfed. I agree with @ZiNc in saying, sabo is no longer really a threat to killers.

    BUT: If you are concerned, you can always use brutal strength or even agitation.. You don't really need both, since sabo isn't really OP, in my opinion.

    You mean Iron Grasp. And most killers use one or both.

    Sabotage is just a troll tech. If survivors have time to 99% each and every hook you somehow go to, and they still manage to complete gens/escape, then you're probably doing something horribly wrong.

    Yes, you are a baby cry killer , and cant adapt , that game is not for you man.

    No need to be mean! If you've got constructive feedback/replies, give those. Don't just attack the person you're interacting with =)

  • TheAngryPickle
    TheAngryPickle Member Posts: 73

    Sabo doesn't award emblem points, so people rarely use it. Besides, if as a killer you're so worried about Sabo squads, just run Hangman's.

  • Xoxonas
    Xoxonas Member Posts: 4

    @ZiNc said:

    @Xoxonas said:

    @Visionmaker said:

    @Steve said:
    Personally, after sabo got nerfed. I agree with @ZiNc in saying, sabo is no longer really a threat to killers.

    BUT: If you are concerned, you can always use brutal strength or even agitation.. You don't really need both, since sabo isn't really OP, in my opinion.

    You mean Iron Grasp. And most killers use one or both.

    Sabotage is just a troll tech. If survivors have time to 99% each and every hook you somehow go to, and they still manage to complete gens/escape, then you're probably doing something horribly wrong.

    Yes, you are a baby cry killer , and cant adapt , that game is not for you man.

    No need to be mean! If you've got constructive feedback/replies, give those. Don't just attack the person you're interacting with =)

    i'm not interacting, i'm just leaving my opinion ^^

  • sunshoes
    sunshoes Member Posts: 3

    @SaltyKiller said:

    @Trundler said:
    I see where you're coming from but there are way more important things to be upset about in this game balance wise haha...

    P1: "Oh man, come die over here! I 99'd the hooks so the killer will have to drop you!"
    P2: "Okay but why didn't you just work on a generator?"
    Killer: "Welp ok I guess"

    I think people like you are just never going to get it. Because guess what? That guy with Sabo is going to be sticking close to other Survivors, especially, ESPECIALLY if they're SWF. And also, in addition, the guy with Sabo will have DS or Sprint Burst or Unbreakable or something. Most likely DS.

    So this constant hammering of "Well, they're not doing gens so this is fine!" Wrong. There is one guy not doing gens who can buy his team precious time by destroying the only means Killers have to kill Survivors. And it only takes 90 seconds for a gen to get done.

    It's like debating a flat earther. You just can't get through to people like you.

    Why ask for other people's thoughts if you are just going to insult people for replying to you? You might find it frustrating but someone pointed out why people do not run around 99%ing hooks in high level play and your first response was to start personally insulting them.

  • ZiNc
    ZiNc Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 250
    edited May 2018

    @SaltyKiller said:

    @Xoxonas said:
    i'm not interacting, i'm just leaving my opinion ^^

    Your opinion is wrong.

    You're doing just the same thing, even if your intentions are good... Refer to my post here:

    @ZiNc said:
    No need to be mean! If you've got constructive feedback/replies, give those. Don't just attack the person you're interacting with =)

    Let's try and hop back on topic, peeps =)

  • JEWberry
    JEWberry Member Posts: 78
    SaltyKiller said:

    @sunshoes said:

    Why ask for other people's thoughts if you are just going to insult people for replying to you? You might find it frustrating but someone pointed out why people do not run around 99%ing hooks in high level play and your first response was to start personally insulting them.

    I'm listing my reasons and so far no one has really been able to rebuke them other than saying "Well, that's one guy not doing gens!" Completely ignoring my points regarding SWF play or the guy with Sabo will have DS and stick close to his team to save them.

    I'm not seeing any kind of reasoning for why they should be allowed to get a hook to 99% and walk away. Defend that.

    I don't think requesting this one and only one change to Saboteur that they cannot get a hook to 99% or 50% or whatever, they have to stay on it and break it in one go. I don't think this makes me Hitler.

    But everyone here can't really defend it and most likely is low rank or never played against an obnoxious SWF team.

    I really, really, really freaking (trying to keep this PG-13) DOUBT that any Killer taking a Survivor to a hook, a guy with Sabo runs up to the hook, touches the hook, instantly destroys it, and the Killer player just thinks "Yay! This is great!"

    But reading comments here leads me to believe that every single guy saying Sabo is fine does that. They probably step away from the keyboard and do a merry dance whenever that happens. "That's one guy not doing gens! THIS IS AMAZING!" Okay...

    That change would literally bury sabo in the durt. Hook respawn time is so fast(like 2:00 minutes?) which makes the only use for sabo is to 99% hooks and tap them to save a friend. Yes that is one person not doing gens and that does help with time, but that person is sacrificing his time to delay your time, its a trade off but a gamble as well. If he can get the whole map 99% that is great for him. But if the map isn’t small then he isn’t always going to be there for someone unless if he is butt hugging u or has communication. SWF teams with sabo and 4 petrified oak offerings just have one person on gens while the other 3 sabo squad the map.

    This may sound good but it isn’t as viable as just running top tier perks and just pallet looping. You probably waste more of the killer’s time through that than making him chase an injured survivor again or just slugging to wait for the flock to appear. Plus the time wasted on pallet looping is equal on both sides, it’s actually a 1 for 1 which is huge for survivors. Sabo actually takes a survivors time for a longer period before the killer actually gets involved and loses his time. Also, once sabo gets the killer involved, it requires 2 people off objectives rather than 1 for pallet looping. This definetely slows the game down but for the time these 2 are chasing/ being chased by the killer, 2 are possibly working rather than 3 in a pallet looping scenario. This makes pallet looping the more viable option because it simply has less negatives than sabo.
  • Antero
    Antero Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 39

    @SaltyKiller said:

    @sunshoes said:

    Why ask for other people's thoughts if you are just going to insult people for replying to you? You might find it frustrating but someone pointed out why people do not run around 99%ing hooks in high level play and your first response was to start personally insulting them.

    I'm listing my reasons and so far no one has really been able to rebuke them other than saying "Well, that's one guy not doing gens!" Completely ignoring my points regarding SWF play or the guy with Sabo will have DS and stick close to his team to save them.

    I'm not seeing any kind of reasoning for why they should be allowed to get a hook to 99% and walk away. Defend that.

    I don't think requesting this one and only one change to Saboteur that they cannot get a hook to 99% or 50% or whatever, they have to stay on it and break it in one go. I don't think this makes me Hitler.

    But everyone here can't really defend it and most likely is low rank or never played against an obnoxious SWF team.

    I really, really, really freaking (trying to keep this PG-13) DOUBT that any Killer taking a Survivor to a hook, a guy with Sabo runs up to the hook, touches the hook, instantly destroys it, and the Killer player just thinks "Yay! This is great!"

    But reading comments here leads me to believe that every single guy saying Sabo is fine does that. They probably step away from the keyboard and do a merry dance whenever that happens. "That's one guy not doing gens! THIS IS AMAZING!" Okay...

    Alright, alright,
    People just want to tell You that saboteur is not that big of a problem, and it's true. You don't run into sabo squads every game , probably in the worst scenario once for like 10 games and still You got tools to counter that. You can see what items people bring to the game and You can have a pretty good idea what is going to happen: 3-4 toolboxes? Probably really fast gens or sabo squad. You can (I know it`s not polite to do but) dodge the lobby, slug them (with deer stalker or nurses) , run hangman's trick or agitation + iron grasp.

    I do agree that beeing able to 99 % hooks is unfun and I don't really like that it's in the game but hey, it's not like the good old times when You lost all hooks and could only do a nice slug fiesta =)