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Feedback on the new DS change
The change is fine with the exception of these 2 things:
1. It shouldn't deactivate if you heal. It is possible to bring a very fast medkit or a medkit with a borrowed-time bottle or insta heal. You can be chased, drop a pallet, heal a tiny bit, loop some more, heal a tiny bit etc. This DOES NOT MEAN that you aren't being tunneled and it's a risky play by itself because you trade distance for a tiny bit of heal progress.
Please make it so healing yourself DOES NOT deactivate DS, but healing others do.es I believe this is pretty sensible and anyone who is not biased can agree: healing yourself does not rule out tunneling.
2.Less important, but unhooking someone should not deactivate DS either. It's again possible that the chase happens to go near a hooked survivor and while it may not be ideal, you can pull off some plays like dropping a pallet or confusing the killer by having unpredictable movement around obstacles and give you the tiny bit amount of time you need to unhook the survivor with BT and you both make it out. Deactivating your DS for being smart and outplaying the tunneling killer doesn't sound quite right for an anti tunneling perk(that really wasn't an anti tunneling perk at the beginning but magically turned into one).
Comments
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1. It was clarified to deactivate if you heal OTHERS, not if others heal you.
2. The idea is that if you're doing something to progress the game or impede the killer's progress, then you're not being tunnelled. If you're repairing, then you're doing the objective. If you're unhooking a teammate, you're impeding the killer's objective and are therefore not being tunnelled.
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The healing part of your change almost makes sense. Except that if you are healing, you aren't really worried. You should not be able to heal yourself, STILL GO DOWN and DS the Killer.
The second part of your change makes no sense. You are using DS in an offensive manner and it puts the Killer into a situation that he cannot possibly win.
If you want DS to be a non-tunneling perk, reduce the stun to 3 seconds and make it so that all Survivors much reach 30% wiggle to use.
If you want it to be an anti-tunneling perk, keep it as it is.
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- Agree
- If you really are smart and outplayed the killer to rescue, then you don't need DS. If you need DS tho, you're confusing "outplayed" with "outperked"
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Ehh the new DS is still the strongest perk in the game they should leave it as it is now
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So if you get unhooked and killer follows you aka the definition for tunneling and you run run run and there is this guy whos in undying state infront of you already at 90% and you touch him to get him up while the killer is still after you as I said and this IS tunneling, suddenly this does not count as a tunneling because you touched someone ? Yea keep dreaming you may actually wake up one day. The idea is good on definition. The execution it will be problemetic. I can see healing others in general to be a problem.
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That's another good example of why the change isn't perfect. They need to make it so if you're actively in chase you can do aggressive actions. Otherwise they dull out the most intense part of the matches because people are running DS.
It does sound good on paper but I do see many moments of getting cucked because of limitations you have running ds. Guess we'll have to wait and see. I'm all ears for this change though.
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I wouldn't use the words agressive actions because this is more like a dire situation. You don't really want DS to be used to bomb a hook so the killer can pull you and you to DS him. I think this is one example where it is really stupid even though I like when there is action but in the end it was not made for that. But for getting someone up when chased or even healed may be a problem. The way many maps are designed today - very small with lots of vision for the killer, will make this very annoying for the survivors. I mean the killer can keep an eye of survivor easly from far while not chasing him and he can see him when hes healing someone /because the UI tells him eventually/ and wait and jump in the right moment. Personally I think I am going to abuse this change a lot on my wraith. Ill just sneak after a person who got unhooked, Ill just run after him /remember the wraith now is total invis from range/ and the moment he touches someone else or a gen Ill pop up and finish him off. Seems legit abuse
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Keep dreaming? I don't appreciate that comment. I merely explained the logic used when deciding when DS deactivates.
Also, WHY would you heal someone if the killer is on your back? That's literally asking for them to die and then you.
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I'm honestly in agreement with you. New DS changes will 100% lead to an even more miserable solo queue experience, as DS now HEAVILY discourages altruism. I foresee a lot of players with DS active leaving people on hook and refusing to heal others just so they can make sure they have their DS as long as possible. Solo queue is so low information that I can't even say that I blame them for it- how do they know that the killer isn't lurking around undetected and that they're gonna get clapped when they otherwise would have had DS active for 20-30 more seconds?
I also foresee a LOT more face camping complaints LMAOOO (Bubba, anyone?)... if someone gets face camped, the survivor with DS active is NOT saving your booty anymore, cause DS is no longer his second chance.
Anyways, yeah. DS may be completely and utterly ONLY anti-tunnel, now, but I hope the devs have something up their sleeve for other negative aspects of the game because DS is no longer the bandaid fix for a multitude of issues it USED to work for.
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You almost understood what I meant, and by that I mean not at all.
For the first part: it's not my job to hold the killer's hand. If you can't apply pressure and allow the survivor to get 1% of heal now and then, that's on you. The survivor shouldn't be punished because you are playing poorly.
The second part did not imply you use DS to get away. The second part meant this:
1.Chase ends up being near a hooked survivor.
2.You confuse the killer with your movement, get a tiny bit of time while he is figuring out where you are -> unhook survivor.
3.You both run. You do not get away because you used DS, you get away because you outplayed the killer with smart movement.
Then 2 things can happen:
a.With my change: you still have DS.
b.With the original change: you do not have DS anymore.
Read above. It is outplayed and not outperked. With dev's proposed change, I get penalised for outplaying the killer by having my DS removed. With the change I proposed I still have my DS after unhooking and safely running away BECAUSE I CONFUSED THE KILLER, not because of DS.
Again: the second scenario does not imply you use DS to get away. You get away by being smart and then you have your DS removed. I am talking about not having DS after you unhook & run away, the rest of the chase.
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If you outplayed the Killer, you don't need your DS anymore. You shouldn't be able to unhook someone, then immediately DS the Killer because you made a stupid play.
If you heal, you are not being tunneled. Simple as that. Don't want your DS to go away? Don't heal.
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I like the new DS changes, the devs did a really good job here.
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As @Pulsar said, if you really outplayed the killer you don't need your DS anymore. What you're saying is what actually is being done: hook bombing with the killer on your tail just cause you're invincible cause your DS is active. You should get punished for playing poorly, not the killer.
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Have you heard about soul guard ? Or maybe they are just next to a pallet that I can drop and then heal them ? Do you need more legic situations ? And I merely explained why that extremely simple logic where you said and I quote " if you're doing something to progress the game or impede the killer's progress, then you're not being tunnelled" is wrong . Now if u did not agree fully with that but you simply explained what the devs are trying to accomplish here then I apologize. I just thought you really believed such simple logic can actually be true !
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Sorry I meant progressive. Yeah definitely has some flaws in design but it's a step in the right direction. Current DS is so dumb especially paired with unbreakable.
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That situation of healing while killer is chasing is fairly common especially when it's end game for Survivors or the survivor team has had a collapse. I suppose we'll have to wait and see how this change plays out in these situations because they can be the most intense part of the games. Make or break.
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It's when you perform the healing action which is pretty dumb for a few reasons
- other players can still heal you so if they are doing that your not getting tunneled so why is it that you can't heal them. all this is doing is discouraging you from helping your other survivors.
- you can bypass the deactivation if another survivor won't heal you by using perks making it dumb that it deactivates when you use selfcare or a medkit.
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