Nerf the Spirit

And thats the very reason why DBD is losing players because some people,survivor mains complain a killer is too strong,they are already needed PH and now you want to go after The Spirit...if you read her bio then you would understand her mechanics as to her style of killing...

Its even in the name "DEAD BY DAYLIGHT",I'm a killer main but it's safe to say that maybe killer mains like myself and others feel like we are becoming toxic because survivors cry about a killer...might as well be "alive by daylight" and no I don't use perks for my killers

By what ur saying pain sounds should be removed from her in phase? If that's the case then ur right won't need iron will however how did u manage to get hit off her in the first place as she doesn't hear ur grunts of pain so if she can hit u with no pain sounds likely hood they will get u anyway just like the killer see's the grass move in phase u can also track the killer by grass movements and counter also she had massive nerf by running into ppl being removed as it was so unfair let's nerf spirit more as all we want is killers who we can read and loop for days like ppl who played any killer pre nerf they adapt and get kills so maybe rather than need things nerfed all the time ppl should do less complaining of op things in game be it killer or survivor perks and adapt improve and will make the game higher skilled based

Too easy, and immense reward?? I really wonder how you've derived your measuring standard.

Ask any spirit player and they’ll tell you she’s on the easier side and everyone knows her immense power

I’m just saying it’s a nice perk to have to make a quick escape after an unhook especially against killers with nurses

Iron will is a solid counter against spirit. I almost always use IW in my builds so I can loop killer use a little misdirection and boom by the time you've caught on I'm at the next loop. It takes a good bit of practice to properly track survivors with her its not as easy as you might think although Stridor certainly helps.

Against spirit to misdirect her use IW run in a direction leaving tracks. Then crouch walk the opposite direction when your certain she's chasing in the previous direction. Then after several seconds sprint to the next loop. Its actually fairly easy when you get the strat down. Wastes a ton of the killers time. Also putting pallets down then crawling over slowly and running the direction the killer just came from works well against spirit.

Its all about misdirection with spirit. I actually find it exciting to go against spirit I mained her for a while so I know what works against me when I play her. Play a ton of mindgames and switch them up as you condition the killer to your strategy be unpredictable. Practice makes perfect as cliche as that sounds also playing both killer and survivor at high level helps you learn the strats giving you a broader understanding of the playstyle.

I disagree. Although nurse can be OP in the right hands, there are a lot more ways to counter her than there are for Spirit.

Nurse takes a hefty amount of skill to beat, if you are a good nurse, you practically could run her without ANY perks whatsoever.

Spirit without add-ons and perks is a challenging but possible task, but takes no skill to learn. A person at rank 1 who has never played spirit can pick her up and play her almost instantaneously, if they understand how her power works, unlike nurse who's power is quick to learn but incredibly difficult to master without a lot of practice.

Freddy isn't overpowered and a lot of people just get wound up because it seems like his lunge is longer than it actually is.

Freddy is an incredibly easy killer to counter, as long as you're decent at running the killer. He does have 70% win rate at red ranks, but his entire power relies on you being asleep, so keeping you and your teammates awake is the easiest way to counter his ability.

Doctor also is easy to counter, depending on the type of player you're playing against. Sometimes you can just run in a different direction before he shoots his blast to quickly outrun it, therefore not having it affect you.

Spirit however has a power that's quite hard to track, if not at all. It does again depend on the player, but there needs to be something that gives away her position. Maybe a mix of Wraiths cloak and how you can see it, mixed with Freddy's in/out of the dream world phasing (where he randomly goes invisible) I think this would be the only tweak they'd have to do to spirit to make her just have a tad more counterplay.

I disagree with this point as well. As a nurse main, the one counter I always see and the best way to counter ANY nurse is to lose line of sight. When you've done that, it's a complete guessing game.

Sure a nurse can get add-ons to stop the fatigue, have extra blinks or recover faster, but at the end of the day a survivor can still make a few seconds worth of distance and make you lose sight again, therefore restarting the cycle.

Problem with spirit is, she literally doesn't need her sight.

I also don't think anyone should factor in perks when trying to consider what does and doesn't need a nerf.

Think of any killer against four survivors, none of them using any perks.

Most killers that are "haha machete go slash" are usually quite easy to loop. This includes trapper, hag, wraith, ghostface, Michael, etc. Their powers are good and can stop loops, or give them a small speed boost, or provide an instant kill, but are the easiest to counter.

Then we have ranged killers, like huntress, the twins, plague, ph and Deathslinger. Easy to counter if you look behind you and watch how and where they aim, and learning early game how that specific player plays.

Next are the killers the slow you down, ie Clown, Freddy (dream pallets r useless lmao), doctor. They can usually get a free hit and are usually countered by throwing down pallets straight away, which usually throws them off. A downed pallet provides a better loop for these killers than others, and if you can run it correctly you can easily make them bash the pallets giving you distance.

And then there are the teleport/fast killers, like legion, spirit, blight and nurse. Legion, blight and Billy are pretty easily manageable, and can be countered with some good pallets and mind games. Nurse also has the disadvantage of sight and walls.

Now understanding how all of these killers work, and comparing them to spirit, you can see why she is an outlier. She moves fast, is invisible with no indication of where she is, gets a speed boost when she comes out of her phase, can track and hear better then any other killer, and her speed boost practically gives her longer range (all without perks).

I have beaten spirit, as have many others, and I don't think she needs a nerf, but a tweak. Something to just show players or give them a rough idea of where she is. I mentioned in a previous comment about a mix of wraith and Freddy's real/dream world invisibility, could really make the balance her out a lot.

Making the point that you can see her disturb crows or sway grass isn't good enough, as some maps have dead areas with no grass, or are indoor maps, and crows don't spawn every few meters, making that argument pretty pointless.

There really is no argument against it, and it could honestly only benefit the game. It is such a small tweak that it wouldn't ruin spirits power, but just enough of a tweak that it would essentially give spirit more counterplay. If they did something like this, there is literally no argument you could make to prove this wouldn't be a good tweak.

I'm obviously open to hear people's opinions, but I think this idea is just to good to not acknowledge, and I feel like you'd have to be pretty cynical to just not like this idea. If you could explain in detail why this idea wouldn't work, I'll happily listen and make a counter-point, but from where I'm sitting right now, I can't really think of a valid argument against it lmao.

I do quickly want to add one more comment for anyone that read all my previous comments too, but I appreciate most people in this thread being respectful and sharing their opinions. I think a lot of people share the same opinions on both sides.

I'm perfectly in the middle, I don't think spirit is overpowered and I've beaten her more than I've beaten say, cannibal or nurse (Nurse doesn't need a nerf either btw).

But a change (not a nerf) would definitely not hurt for spirit. I think there are a lot of ways to balance her even more and make counterplay towards her easier while still keeping her power and playstyle consistent. (For reference, read my above comments if you haven't already).

But I'm glad there are people willing to defend a character that most people enjoy either because she's on the difficult side of dbd killers, unlike say Twins where it's a two way street (you either suck with the twins or are a god with them) or because they find her easy and can counter her better than most players.

Err, no, you're literally wrong about that. Just because killer-players who dump 100's or 1000's of hours into getting good with a single killer doesn't mean the game is overly balanced in that killer's favour. That's a ridiculously poor argument to make.

An oft-repeated complaint about Spirit is that "ShE hAs No CoUnTeR!!" She absolutely does!

And another "StAnDiNg StIlL iS nOt A mInDgAmE", it absolutely is. See, the Spirit player has to take the chance whether to start phasing and hope you're dumb enough to stay at the loop, so she'll catch you, or whether you'll just run away in which case she won't see you. If you run and she didn't phase, you just gain distance. It absolutely is a mind-game, just not necessarily the game the survivors think it is... which is half the mindgame itself!

If I'm not mistaken, can't you hear her? I thought there was a visual or auditory tip off.