OhToFu’s Tier List 5.4.2
OhToFu released a new tier list today. I feel this guy has one of the best feels for the game and heavily weight his opinion on tier lists.
Interestingly he states the Twins is the third best killer in the game, knocking Spirit down to fourth. He also has Deathslinger at the top of A tier, coming in at seventh best.
Have yall seen his YT video yet and how’s it feel to know Twins is still considered high tier despite their complications?
Honorable mention: Hillbilly over Oni. The debate continues.
Comments
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I think those opinions make sense given he doesn't play killer. Ayy.
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Twins usually have the highest pick rate in comp when Nurse and Blight are banned, so it makes sense that he has them there.
The one I really disagree with is Billy. He doesn't really have a power at loops unless survivors are throwing the game and don't understand what they're playing against. If his argument for Wraith is "bad against top level players", you have to apply that same logic to Billy. Billy is literally Oni without a power once the pallet is thrown.
Post edited by edgarpoop on2 -
I don’t understand Twins over Spirit at all. Spirit moves so much faster and is way more time efficient than Twins.
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Agreed lol
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Yea the man's definitely got some wrong opinions deathslinger isn't anywhere near A tier he wasn't even before the nerfs and he's definitely not now
You can tell he doesn't play a lot of the killers he talked about if we are being honest
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Twins have too much downtime to be that good even assuming it’s an amazing twins player. COH and dead hard validation kick her down to b tier imo
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twins ability to both chase one survivor and camp another on the other side of the map can't be overlooked especially at higher mmr where being in two places at once while forcing 3 survivors to not work on gens is very valuable.
the only real issue with the twins is the healing meta is a big counter to them but if that ever changes we will see the twins regain popularity.
also with the recent nerf to spirit she struggles at higher mmr unless she brings her best addons at average mmr she is fine.
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He is assuming the player has mastered the killer. In the case of deathslinger an old slinger could pretty much hit a shot anywhere. That is A tier worthy imo
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I guess you guys aren't long time viewers.
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Yea again I'm not trying to sound rude but just play him I'm serious
I main slinger
He can't hit half the shots he used to nowadays
Vs a good swf he'd get destroyed he has him right next to hag
Hag actually stands a chance vs a good swf
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Can’t we say the same about Artist? She can be at multiple places at once yet be put her below Twins and Spirit. I say Twins has bad time efficiency because Victor can’t hook survivors, Charlotte has to go all the way where Victor ended up to get a hook state.
Spirit also has more potential for faster downs than Victor as well, due to being faster and invisible.
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Exactly I’m talking about before the nerf he was justifiably A tier. Now he’s probably low B
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Deathslinger was S tier in his prior list and I think it was reasonable. He’s able to make shots on players in an eighteen meter radius around him. Mixed with the shorter terror radius, he was soooo good in chase that he didn’t need gen regression at all. He would just tear through survivors in chases.
They 100% nerfed that, but if you play with identical builds, you can achieve the same results. I’ve been doing really really well with Slinger these last couple of weeks after reverting back to my prenerf build.
Thing is monitor was always highly useful on him. Now it’s practically mandatory. STBFL remains one of his best perks; giving him access to the hit-shot-hit combo. It still works. It comes down to getting used to when to pull the trigger. The insta-ADS shot is gone. Adapt.
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Honestly, I can’t complain about his thoughts on most killers. Twins is crazy good, and the ridiculous downplaying most do with them is hilarious. I agree they’re top 5, maybe not 3 but Victor is one of the strongest powers in the game. I’m also glad to see Billy and Slinger up there, as both are still very good killers. People like to over exaggerate their demise. Billy and Slinger both just went from S to A tier killers after each of their respective nerfs.
Was a good watch, like to see other people’s opinions who know the game.
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I agree. The lowballing of these killers (Deathslinger, Twins, Hillbilly in particular) always made me feel awesome when I achieved better results played with them then the tier lists said could be done. This list feels reasonable.
The only one I’m tempted to place down is Artist because I believe the counterplay already exists and is really damaging.
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I agree with that 100% sorry didn't try to come across as argumentative
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Deathslinger was never S tier…
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Artist's crows are much, much harder to control than victor, and you can't camp / hold a totem very well with the birds, compared to victor.
Spirit is much better, but tends to have the same issue Jackal has (I.e banned every 2 seconds)
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If I had never heard of it, I would probably think that this tier list was made by someone who plays killer once every blue moon, it has a lot of extremely wrong positions
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Still watching the video, but one thing I don't understand is he put Deathslinger above Huntress. I just don't see how you can objectively consider Deathslinger better than Huntress. The only advantage he has that I can think of is his shot hitbox is small so a really, really good Deathslinger can shoot throw cracks for possible crazy hits sometimes, maybe. ... But that's it, Huntress is as good or better in every other way I can think of.
- Huntress always does damage on a hit. Deathslinger can often hit an injured survivor and, if they happen to be across a pallet, not get the down. Or can hit a survivor and because of bad terrain or another survivor bodyblocking not get the down. The fact he doesn't get a guaranteed down on a hit is pretty significant.
- Huntress' damage is instantaneous. Deathslinger's damage takes an additional 4-6 seconds most of the time every single time. That adds up, especially where he's a 110% movement killer with no map traversal.
- Deathslinger and Huntress' reloads are kind of a wash. Deathslinger doesn't have to go to lockers but does have to reload after every shot. Huntress gets more shots before reloading but going to a locker takes a bit longer than Deathslinger's reload.
Am I overlooking something? Deathslinger just seems like a slightly weaker version of Huntress basically.
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I watched it. Look at the tier list again. He literally rates them on a 1v1 basis. Some placements are still weird but it does explain the high placement of Slinger, for instance.
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On the contrary I've watched tofu off and on for years and that's exactly why I say this, he's kind of out of touch when it comes to the killer side because he barely ever plays it anymore but no disrespect to him I enjoy tofu and his content. You're more than welcome to disagree with me it's just an opinion and I mean no ill will towards you. I respect him and his opinions I just don't agree with them.
I say the same thing towards people that have out there opinions (imo lol) that never play the other side, no matter which side it is.
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But the game isnt about 1v1 it's about 1v4 tho
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Nope not missing anything that's exactly what slinger is these days just a weaker version of huntress and trickster
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Tbh, without the ability to quickscope shooting through small cracks doesn't matter. Survivors have more than enough to react to a deathslinger trying to make a trick shot like that.
Deathslinger sits at a weird place where he's just a more limited huntress.
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Dude Deathslinger was never considered S Tier(Let alone A tier) even before the nerfs by anyone who plays killer as he was simply too slow to win most games as speed is considered the best stat in the game for killers and he has the worst overall speed in the game.
He's obnoxiously slow as he has the highest amount of self slows in the entire game at NINE from his power let alone for a 110% killer.
He also can't defend generators very well nor can he reach generators further spread out then a hard 3 gen.
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I think you are really discounting how good he was at chase and the effect that had on generators. He was one of the best at getting downs quickly.
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So many bad takes. Some of the most egregiously awful points worth addressing.
It's like tofu ignored the big change to twin that increased Victor's vulnerability. Any twin mains (you know people who actually play the killer) consistently have stated even with the camping strat you still have a massive uphill struggle setting up the snowball. Getting the down is brutally difficult because survivors pair up and heal to lock the twins player out of the game.
Ffs plague in b tier? When coh boon is creating incredible time efficiency is so out of touch its baffling. I'm not gonna argue tofu doesn't know Billy but he definitely lacks experience on oni. With a lot of indoor maps and increased obstacles oni got a clear advantage over Billy.
Then there slinger holy hell. He said himself it takes a long time to get guaranteed hit on slinger that is not top of A tier. That is a baffling stupid take. Man's so obsessed with the 1 v 1 he doesn't see the wider 1 v 4. This entire tier list is a 1 v 1 tier list tbh. You can be unhappy with killer design but at least evaluate a killer on there potential to win games outside of the 1 v 1.
I get it tiers lists are opinion based but this one in particular reads like it was made 2 years ago. It ignores meta perks, time efficiency, map overhauls and the current playstlyes favoured by both sides. Honestly I can't blame em if he hasn't been playing much dbd I wouldnt want to either.
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Seems like this tier list was just made to generate controversy and clicks. Maybe he's losing viewers cause survivor isn't as exciting. I don't watch his streams really so I'm just guessing. No one in their right mind puts Deathslinger above Huntress, he's legit the worst killer in the game now this side of Ghostface. Also, Twins are completely destroyed by Circle of Healing.
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Yeah, but Twins has the potential to exert an insane amount of pressure in a very short time. Someone downed? Leave Victor or Charlotte nearby and switch killers to put a bit of pressure somewhere else. Someone hooked? Victor or Charlotte can stay relatively close while the other is used to push gens etc.
Twins has the ability to be consistently in a chase. While Spirit ends a chase faster, she can not be in a chase for a very long time. If the average Chase on Twins takes 55 seconds, and on Spirit 40 seconds, but the time between chases is on average 10 seconds for Twins and 30 seconds for Spirit. Twins would overall win by 5 seconds on average.
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But twins gets hard countered by teams to know how to play against her and pair up in groups of two
There is no counter to spirit
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Anyone who comes from a shooter background would correct you for the thought someones gonna play comsistently at aimbot level and hit all there shots. Look at any hunt streamer and you will see that even those that have clocked 5000+ hours still won't hit 100% of there shots. Especially when the weapon is a breach action single shot capacity with a muzzle velocity so slow it would make a derringer laugh (an exaggeration) but comparatively to other shooters the redeemer muzzle velocity is actually pretty bad.
Also has a max range of 18 meters as well and some shots will yield no down due to chain snap. Again indoor maps have become more widespread and severely neuter the killers potential.
Deathslinger was never strong. He always lost the 1 v 4 hard. The 1 v 1 potential is worthless if you have to aim shoot reel hit reload on top of a lower moment speed so map traversal is nightmarish.(increased numbers of large maps might I add). At most top of b tier in his prime. As of now bottom of b tier easily.
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He wasn’t considered S tier by some, and IMO those people were wrong. I’ll go over some of those now.
- 110 isn’t that big a difference from 115. Can it effect some loops? Sure, but it’s not like you have Nurse walk speed.
- He had a 24m terror radius, and with monitor could go down to 16, which was smaller than his spearguns distance (18m)
- Instant usage of a power that could not be reacted to. You could guess when he’d use it, but then it’s just a mind game in Slingers favor, heavily so.
- Can’t be looped anywhere but safe pallets, and those would have to be predropped.
People underestimate how impactful winning 1v1 is, and slinger was top 4 in that department, he’s now just top 10. The reason Blight and Spirit are so good is they have mobility AND chase potential. Wraith is extremely mobile but can’t win chases quickly, and is usually considered C tier or worse. Winning chases is the name of the game, and Slinger is a top 10 killer at that, even after his nerf.
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I hate to inform you of this but you clearly haven't played a lot of slinger post nerf if you believe any of that
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Oni can't rev his power up at will. Billy can at least kick the pallet then rev on command.
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Sorry, those points were referring to pre-nerf Slinger. He doesn’t have all that anymore, which is fine. He doesn’t need all that to still be a very good killer.
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But he's not a very good killer tho
And you would realize that if you ever played more then 10 games on him post nerf
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You'd realize that if you played him at all pre-nerf.
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Pre nerf has nothing to do with the state he's in right now, the tier list is based on the current patch and he put him at a
Every slinger player and their brother will tell you he's not a tier especially nowadays
Theirs no point in talking about the past because they aren't gonna revert the changes we are talking about current slinger and how garbage he is
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There is plenty of counters to current day Spirit: pre-dropping pallets gives you more than enough phasing sound to avoid getting hit. You can hear which direction she's phasing in from, so you can pre-walk or even pre-run towards a loop that is away from where she's coming from. Once she has used her power, it takes 3x the amount to recover, with recovery addons being nerfed quite significantly. You dont really need perks
Twins' only real issues right now, is boon Exponential, but no one really runs that, and a smidge of Circle of Healing. Unbreakable is a 1-time issue. No Mither is a bonus.
Twins doesnt really have too much vanilla gameplay that can be used against her, while Spirit does have some.
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Tofu rarely plays killer these days and he honestly believes Circle of Healing is fine as it currently is, I can't really take his opinion seriously and I disagree with most all of his stances.
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I'd take anything, tier list wise or balance wise, from that guy with a grain of salt. He doesn't seem to take the game too seriously, and does stuff like randomized killer perks and somehow succeeds against the survivors, so definitely very low MMR. Nobody who's playing killer at high level has "chill" killer games, as I constantly see him experiencing.
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Deathslinger and Twins are bottom of the barrel killers. His tier list is completely laughable.
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There is a lot of stuff I disagree with it. 12 of the Killers are placed in a wrong spot imo, whether that be to low or too high
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How can a legacy player have so many bad takes
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Yikes that Oni placement...
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Slinger A tier and twins above spirit in a boon meta LMAO this video has worse takes than me holy #########.
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Deathslinger S tier
Peak DBD forums
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Believes circle of healing is fine as is...
Ohhhhhh that explains a lot.
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Oni forces people to heal or get punished by revving his power. Billy can kick the pallet and still succumb to Overheat so he can't really rev his power on command either. This literally proves how Oni is just better than Billy aside from what's already obvious. Billy's power is now so less of a threat that you can use it anytime you want if you can manage Overheat. Oni's Blood Fury is so good that it has to be locked behind a power up mechanic.
A master Billy that can curve is still just Billy, he'll hit a few shots on people that underestimate him to start the match because its hard to use him and most people using him aren't at that level. After that they'll make a small adjustment and continue to abuse windows/vaults.
With Oni people might pre-drop and waste resources early to deny early hits but that only raises the pressure and is another reason why he's better. You can slide off surfaces way easier in Demon Dash and land shots with higher reward because it can hit multiple people! The snowball pressure is way better, really not even close
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