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Bubba masks and a general displeasure about the way its handled
So i have mayor issues the way this is handled we are setting a precedent where we punish the ones who actually grinded out these masks instead of punishing people who harassing said players. So in effect we are punishing bubba players and yes you give out some compensation but let's be honest a bit of currency is not really replacing it and no bubba cosmetic can be bought even with iri shards. I am very displeased that the easy route has been taken instead of punishing toxic behavior. Not to mention they have not been given out yet.
Sorry this is a bit of a rant but i needed to speak up this is just unjust and makes me lose interest in keeping on playing.
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I disagreed with the way it was handled and I am very disappointed in how the "compensation" has been handled.
There were other avenues available that should have been explored and there is no way the compensation should still be missing.
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The only part that I really don't like is the compensation part. The cosmetic taken away were for Bubba but these Shards don't let us get anything for Bubba.
As much as it would have hurt the pocket book, if BHVR really was serious about how it affects their players, either Auric Cells should have been given (enough for one of the Bubba Cosmetics) or a new replacement cosmetic for Bubba should have been created for this. Since they just released the Old Lady Cosmetic a little while ago, I presume they still have some kind of a working relationship with the license holder if they needed permission to give Bubba some kind of new mask or cosmetic (maybe a multi-person cosmetic where all four survivors faces are sewn into one mask?).
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More than ten days have passed and I still haven't received the compensation (Bubba bought on January 3rd, and completed the Bubba achievement on the 4th)🤣
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The masks weren't bought. You got them through playing. You earn Shards through playing. So you got Shards back.
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Ultimately it is their call what they do but it does feel irksome that they took away cosmetics from Bubba but gave you no replacements for Bubba.
Whether I got them for free or not doesn't really matter to me. It's BHVRs call in the end so they can do what they want (Hell, it would have been well within their right to just pull the masks they feel is problematic and told everyone to suck it up and give us nothing) but I feel like it would have gone far smoother if they replaced the cosmetics we lost with a different one.
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Them removing a tool used for racism doesn't prevent them from also taking action against the racists.
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Then you would have complaints that people dislike the new Leatherface cosmetic and feel its inferior to the old ones.
At least this way, you're completely free to spend your compensation however you want instead of having something you may not even want forced on you.
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The entire point is removing the black character's face being used as a skin, which then got used to target POC streamers. That would defeat the point.
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Fair
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I still think it should have been at least 7,200 shards if not a cosmetic. Part of me is like well maybe it was the license and they didn't want their property used this way so BHVR bent to keep Leatherface in the game, but the other part of me is like, exploitable. Wonder what else is going to go next once someone gets their knickers in a twist.
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That cosmetic... wouldn't have changed anything... it might've made it worse if that was the compensation
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No, the issue was it got used together with actively targeting POC streamers. As in, the black face mask was pretty clearly being used as a proxy for the actual person playing as survivor in question.
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The issue with that mask was getting quite the Streisand effect and getting rather difficult to control. It's impossible to proof a game against ill-intentions but when a piece of cosmetic is getting weaponized by racists then it's not just a matter of punishing those players, but preventing others from following their lead.
In summary, no answer from BHVR would sit well with all members of the community.
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many people still have not yet received their shards.
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Thing is, it wasn't even enough for a "good" cosmetic. It should have at least been 7500 shards.
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The four masks were low effort retextures of his default mask.
A standard low effort retexture of a cosmetic in the shop costs 900 Iridescent Shards. You can get six new equivalent cosmetics in exchange for losing four.
Let's not pretend that the survivor masks were anything special.
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No, but it would have been nice :)
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At this point, what is done is done. Yes, it was handled poorly, but what can we do about it? At least I got a Partial Clown from it.
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Agreed, but it is what it is.
Like someone already mentioned, they could have just give nothing at all in return. At least 6,000 Iridescent Shards is worth several dozen hours of playtime.
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I disagree with how it was handled as well. But hey, 6000 shards go towards a future chapter so I can avoid giving them money after they keep making terrible decisions, so that's a win.
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It's another one of those "This is why we can't have nice things".
If someone is racist, they're going to find a way to be racist no matter what. Taking away these "tools" doesn't change how they act. BHVR actually being vigilant about this behavior and actively banning it might tho. But it's probably "too much work".
As for the shard thing I'm just speechless at this point. BHVR is a literal meme.
If you are not satisfied with the way they handle things, "go play civ". Don't support them. Don't buy auric cells. I regret that I put a bit of money at the beginning into this game. They don't deserve it.
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I think it's a little bit disingenuous, intentionally or otherwise, to act as though this is setting a precedent where bad actors can get things removed from the game to punish legitimate players.
That framing ignores the fact that a lot of people had very legitimate reasons to be uncomfortable with Smartface, and debate about it had been ongoing for a long while before the most recent batch of bad actors partaking in targeted harassment and abuse towards players and streamers. Those two things combined make a very compelling case for removing the masks.
My own personal take is kinda twofold. On the one hand, I do think that a better solution would have been to replace all four masks with some other unlockable cosmetic that sidesteps the problematic aspects of old Smartface. On the other... there's no earthly way that solution would've been fast enough, so I do respect the pressure to just do the quick and less pleasant thing to deal with the problem ASAP. Who knows, maybe they'll introduce some other unlockable cosmetic later on down the line...
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How would they have punished the racist otherwise then?
Ban them? So they can buy 1 of the 1000ths to 10000ths free accounts made with epic and bubba, facecamp a couple of claudette's and do it all over again?
People were getting harrased now and they needed an answer now. Removing them ensures it doesn't happen again, simple and effective and no way around it.
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After the removal of the masks, I never play Bubba any other way than facecamping the first hook and then collecting the salt in the end-game chat. Works like a charm, 3k-4k most of the times, although even when I get just 1k, the salt is real. This game doesn't deserve any better after all what happened.
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[insert Scream Queens eye roll gif]
SmartFace needed to go. It’s not a punishment for Bubba players. This has nothing to do with banning people for racial slurs in end game chat etc. But the cosmetics were used as a tool for racism to harass streamers etc which is not directly reportable/able to be proven with in-game info.
i would have liked different masks or other cosmetics for Bubba too. But there is also still the license holder so they can’t just create something and put it in.
the only bad thing here is how the shards are not being distributed correctly.
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A kitchen knife can be used as a weapon of murder. We must make all knives illegal. As well as hammers, shovels, and a ton of other tools. Genius!
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Thanks for showing how much you don’t understand the issue of Blackface.
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Haven’t seen this before.
you can’t be that petty, can you?
you are changing your way of playing to… well to accomplish literally nothing but making the odd game of some noobs a boring experience. Even if they flame you in the end, they move on and will forget you or just put you in the same memory with the other facecampers. Just another sore person. no one would even know you are doing it because of the removal of the masks…
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Well if you make no effort it doesn't sit well its here is a token which does nothing for the character itself that is my biggest issue than at least give auric cells so you can buy one of the 2 outfits or part of it what do iri shards do for bubba absolutely nothing.
Why do you think the compensation is good it does nothing for the character and time played on a certain character to unlock his cosmetics especially for a licensed one does not compare to iri shards which buy nothing for a licensed character if it was auric cells so you can buy a replacement cosmetic if you so desire.
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The masks were barely noticeable in-game anyways and can’t be compared to Bubbas other cosmetics. Also you never paid anything for the masks, so asking for currency that’s literally worth money is unreasonable.
they didn’t have to give anything at all. BHVR and the license holder agreed to remove the masks. Them giving out shards is just them being nice. (Disregarding the fact that the distribution didn’t work - which wasn’t intentional at least).
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If they were barely notieable they wouldn't have been removed. And no i don't think its unreasonable to ask for something to replace cosmetics for a character. And i get replacing it for new cosmetics is hard to do with licenseholders and such. So what else can you do give some cells or one of the store outfits is a better fix than giving something that does nothing for bubba itself.
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They were removed because the SmartFace cosmetic was indeed Blackface (Bubbas face under the mask was dark) and it was used to harass streamers that were PoC. the Same for the Jake mask.
Dwights and Megs masks were barely noticeable, they were removed because of consistency and not just removing cosmetics with other than white skin colors.
all of this doesn’t change the fact that they were just color changes of the original mask and were in fact barely noticeable with the exception of Smartface.
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I normally stay out of this discussion but something piqued my interest.
You say that SmartFace was being used as a tool to enable racists. Could you not make the same argument about Bubba himself?
On a similar note, you mention in a later comment that SmartFace was inherently racist, but here you seem to indicate that it is not inherently racist but that it was used as an unfortunate tool.
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What is the next comment you get upset about some pixels? Sorry but you don't get to dictate how i value things but comparing a iri shard compensation for cosmetics for a licensed character is off any way you look at it. And i get that you can't replace them with something new without approval from the licenseholder which is not easy to get but this is a very low effort attempt. Also shows reporting people doesn't work if you take away the tools for harassment instead of fixing the core problem which is toxicity.
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The concept of Smartface is not inherently racist as it is just supposed to be Bubba wearing his victims skin as a mask without seeing the different skin color or pretending to be of/mocking people of color. But the implementation actually is directly Blackface and therefore racist because under the mask Bubbas face is also darker (probably due to a bug which could be fixed). This was kinda confirmed in a stream by not_queen iirc. She acknowledged the problem and said it has to be discussed with the license holder as BHVR can’t just make changes on licensed content.
Now the cosmetics were also directly used to harass streamers that are people of color. Those were not reportable since it was on Stream and the trolls/racists were not actually outright racist in-game eg in the chat. Therefore BHVR had no control over it and decided (with the license holder) that it was best to remove the cosmetics to avoid situations like these.
all of this might be difficult to understand/relate to if you are not aware of the history of Blackface or you have never been harassed because of your skin color. And I can’t really elaborate any further I am afraid. There are content creators that made good videos where they explain it though..
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You are the one upset about the removal of some pixels. Where was I ever upset about anything?
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I am perfectly aware of the history of Blackface.
So, Smartface's implementation was racist due to a bug, which could have (and should have) been fixed.
I have seen the Steam account of someone with a very offensive name who keeps a count of all the black characters they've killed in DBD. They have not been banned. It would seem to me that at least some of them are overt and are still not dealt with.
Circling back around, again, could you not make the case that Bubba should be removed as well since he is being used to target POC streamers? To quote you directly, "But the cosmetics were used as a tool for racism to harass streamers". Does that not also apply to the character himself?
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If they are showcasing this on Steam that it’s up to Steam to deal with it and not BHVR. BHVR cant legally do anything against people being racist on Steam/Twitch/other platforms.
Bubba on itself isn’t portraying anything racist though. In this case you could literally remove any and all killers with that argumentation.
Smartface was a problem because while the harassment was going on the people had to endure the sight of Blackface.
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Did i ever say you were upset? And don't twist my words to prove a point that is not even there. I was not against the removal i was against how it was handled.
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I understand that. However, does BHVR not ask for additional info when reporting someone? Could you not screenshot their profile (since you need to include their SteamID, it could be verified) and send in a clip of them in-game?
You could not make that argument with any Killer. There is no prior history of interdimensional monsters terrorizing POC. Is there not a history of under-educated, Southern white men terrorizing POC? Please, understand that I am not actually making that argument, merely showing that the logic you presented can be used to make illogical conclusions. This does not mean that your conclusion is incorrect, I am merely stating that the logic used to get there appears faulty to me.
As for your last sentence, you had previously explained to me that Smartface was not inherently racist but rather, that it was racist in it's implementation due to a bug. Ergo, if that bug was fixed, it would no longer be racist according to your own logic, correct?
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What is the next comment you get upset about some pixels?
doesnt this imply that you thought I was upset before?
And yeah you are right. You didn’t say anything against the removal. I might have misinterpreted this comment from you and I am sorry for that:
If they were barely notieable they wouldn't have been removed
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Well. They can’t use proof from outside the game to justify bans. And if the gameplay would be otherwise in line with the rules it would accomplish nothing. It would be different if the same person was always harassing the same streamer/group of streamers that way, that would fall under griefing and is reportable and bannable.
and I still don’t see how your theoretical argument against Bubba works the same way that Smartface worked.
in my opinion, if they fixed the bug then the cosmetic wouldn’t be racist. But keep in mind, that’s just my uneducated opinion on it.
(also, its still possible BHVR and the license holder agreed to new cosmetics to replace these masks but those need to be conceptualized, designed, implemented and approved by the license holder so we wouldn’t see them for quite some time anyways; just fixing the bug would probably not be enough for affected people or the people that were using the mask in that way)
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Oh. Look.
i can comment with a picture to this discussion after all.
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Oh
no i just want my boobba compensation
do not argue😓
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Waah, they took away my cosmetics because some people were being violently racist waah
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It's sad to see content being removed from the game in general - they were a piece of the games history that unfortunately we'll have to do without due to the actions of what I hope is a small minority of the dbd playerbase.
The mask had to go. Shame we also lost the other masks in the process but it happens, there was no pleasing everyone so I think BHVR took the path of least resistance in this case, which is fair enough.
Maybe in the future we'll see a return of this mechanic in a much more tasteful way as many people suggested during the middle of the controversy itself.
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It was a free thing that was earned through time, and the compensation is also something earned through time. They totally could've went the route of just not giving anything. In terms of what should've been done, it is the easiest solution to just remove them all, it was a basic situation of a small minority ruining it for everyone.
If the compensation is keeping you from having fun in the game, then just dont play? lol did you even have the masks unlocked? Sure it sucks they are gone but we ARE still getting something and in terms of business it was the easiest way to solve the problem. The compensation taking forever is annoying but again, it shouldn't stop you from playing lmfao
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The removal of the Bubba masks will not prevent people from being racist jerks towards others; All they have to do is be racist towards anyone playing Claudette, so the mask removal will do almost nothing on that front.
To wit, I still say that 6k Shards is a PITTANCE of a compensation for something that was being used as a incentive to buy Leatherface in the first place. That's not even enough shards for a single purple tier item...but we're losing 4 unique cosmetics for Bubba. I miss being able to mix and match his costumes.
Also? I STILL have not gotten my shards, and this is the 4th time they've 'fixed' it. I'm pretty damn angry about it.
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I don't even care about the masks anymore, I just want the 6k shards they promised and still didn't deliver ):
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Only it is not free i pay for the chapter and reason of the purchase was the unique grind items it brought and offcourse bbq and chili not gonna lie about that but it was something unique that no other chapter had and now it's gone without a proper replacement so it's not free at all in my view.
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