New deadhard have a potential to kill the game.

Who says you have full control of your movements?

For all we know the animation that plays is the survivor stopping and bracing for impact. Not moving at all for a second

Untill we see it in action nobody knows how good it will be

Let’s just wait until the PTB next week. Some are interpreting it as something scary, others like myself see it as something practically useless, that only skilled players will benefit from. Question is, is it worth a perk slot for those players?

Don't forget that DH will be a true Skill Based perk. Time it wrong then they still get hit and hurt

Wonder if after getting the endurance hit, that perk that lets you run faster for 2 extra seconds would also work, same with otr hit

The main issue with DH was the 'for distance' problem. Whilst the new DH has the potential to give survivors a brief speed boost, it requires meticulous timing - not like old DH where any mistake could be negated by pressing E. Please remember, the new DH only provides 1 second of endurance, this is such a small window of time and it would have to be timed perfectly with a killers M1.

You literally have to be jocking right right???

I mean old freddy got changed and his playrate skyrockted. If it stronger people wont mind. The reality is dead hard is gonna be weaker for most medium to low skill players. For excelent players it will be much stronger.

Think of the survivors who can consistently hit dead hard the minute enter .5 seconds of attacking. It really depend on how generous one second is and how it measure up to a killers swing.

"New Dead Hard: 12m travel distance"

Am I missing something here? New Dead Hard gives you no speed boost unless you time the Endurance hit correctly. So just using DH and not succeeding on that timing means your travel distance just normal Survivor run speed for 1 second (which I believe is 4 meters.)

The thing I came to realize about the change to Dead Hard is it's, at least on paper, exactly the kind of change I'd advocated for. Basically you get the distance if, and only if, you actually block a hit with it.

I've never minded the I-Frames aspect as I considered "take/evade a hit that would otherwise down you" was part of the perk's very premise (ex: the flavor text references how you know how to take a beating).

The perk is no longer a "Press E to Outplay", as in this case it now actually is an outplay. You do it right, you take that hit, presumably go into Deep Wounds, and get your post-hit speed burst (which itself has been nerfed, I feel should be mentioned), do it wrong, you go down.

That bit there, "Until we see it, it could literally be anything" is entirely the problem. There shouldn't be any guessing here. That's a problem in and of itself. We have the most problematic perk in the game and nobody knows if it's actually nerfed or just sidegraded. We have a high likelihood that the meta-shifting patch will fail in its goals of shaking up the meta. Killers will keep spamming slowdown perks, likely different ones since their flagship slowdown perks were universally kneecapped, but still slowdown. There is no question of waiting around for the PTB to learn whether or not corrupt/ruin/Pop/pain res are weaker than their live incarnations or not. Simply a question of whether they're still playable or whether they've been consigned to the dustbin.

Things probably won't change on the survivor side of things. The go-to meta build was pretty much DH/DS/BT and filler slot. They get a second filler slot now to increase their flexibility since BT is going nowhere at all since it was made basekit. DS was outright superseded by off the record doing DS's job but better. DH might not be going anywhere since on paper its change is so milquetoast that nobody is actually certain if is weaker or not. There's just a wishy-washy "well, maybe the way it works on the PTB will be a bit weaker than people think that it will be from the wording" bit of ambiguity.

That wish-washy ambiguity is what's causing such intense concern when the perk in question, Deadhard, was THE biggest problem child in the entire game.

They are using the optimal situation.

If used properly, the old DH only gave a 4m burst of movement.

In the right hands, the survivor will gain 1.8s of 50% Haste - gaining up to 6m/s for 1.8s - which is about 12m.

If you use DH perfectly today and the killer misses - they enter a 1.5s recovery animation and you gain 4m distance.

If you use DH perfectly after this patch and the killer hits you - they enter a 2.8s recovery animation and you gain 12m distance.

The killer experiences nearly twice the slowdown and the survivor covers three times as much distance.

This makes the perk much, much stronger numerically - and triggering it will not be outstandingly difficult, as most survivors have an approximate time that they will get hit by creating a threat to end the chase (Vault - throwing a pallet - Conspicuous action - body blocking)

In theory, not as good.

In practice - much better.

It is not at all a tighter window. Where it used to be a 'Use either right when you're about to get hit, or as you're approaching a loop interaction to gain distance, it's precisely the same here.

Use DH in the open to save yourself | Still works exactly the same, new version is patently better in the open - if you bait out the hit, higher numbers reward you.

Use DH at a loop while the killer draws close to extend the loop | Still works exactly the same, if you're about to lose the loop - press E to flip the killer the bird, if they hit you - you can rush to another loop altogether. This may fail at times, but it's highly reliable.

Use DH at a window to bait the miss | Can't do this anymore - as there are no I frames.

Use DH to get to a pallet safely | Still works exactly the same, instead of gaining 4m in 0.5s, the player has 1s of invulnerability and gain 4m in 1 second. It's effectively the same dash at half speed. The killer cannot hit you before you get to the pallet, and once on the other side - the pallet can be dropped safely. The killer must either give you a hit/speed boost and preserve the pallet, let you throw the pallet and stun them, or disengage and surrender the loop. Exactly the same.

Use DH before vaulting to ensure a safe vault. | Works even better now, one used to need to calculate distance to get to the vault faster - a mistimed DH will have the character bunch up against the window and eat a rebuttal attack, and even on a successful interaction, the player does not gain any momentum on the other side of the window. However, now the player is doubly fortified. If they press E before approaching the window - there's precious nothing the killer can do to stop them. Hitting the survivor will confer Deep Wounds and give them a substantial speed boost on the other side of their vault, waiting out the timer allows the survivor to safely vault away, and forfeiting the chase simply isn't a 'counter' to pressing E.

It's not a tighter window - you press the button at the same exact times and it's going to work effectively the same.

I do not think you're understanding.

Survivors move at 4m/s - that's 4 meters in 1 second.

Dead Hard grants 4m worth of movement.

If you press the E key at the exact same location as you previously would have with DH - you approach the pallet with Endurance and close the exact same amount of distance safely.

So long as there is a vault or a pallet at the tail end of that 1 second duration, there's nothing that can be done about the activation of the perk.

When survivors use Dead Hard to dash for a pallet, they do so safely - closing 4m of distance where the killer cannot stop them, and then throw the pallet.

When a survivor approaches that situation now, they do the exact same thing: Approach the pallet - press E when about 4m away - throw the pallet down upon reaching it.

The window is not tighter - the window is precisely the same: 4m from the pallet.

It is exactly the case, and I don't understand why you are not getting this.

Old DH ferries you safely 4m - the killer cannot hit you.

New DH ferries you safely 4m - the killer cannot hit you.

If the killer swings with old DH, 1.5s animation.

If the killer swings with new DH, 2.8s animation.

You are no longer dashing super quick over the 4m, but you have guaranteed safety for the next 4m.

You are traveling the same distance with safety.

Using the perk 8m or 6m from the pallet may no longer work, granted - as killers can now wait that out and hit before the pallet - but at the prime location to use DH for a pallet, the interaction is effectively unchanged.

Vaults, however, are greatly buffed - as survivors are given a generous speed boost afterwards, half of Lithe and a free health state.

"Using the perk 8m or 6m from the pallet may no longer work, granted - as killers can now wait that out and hit before the pallet"

Ergo, the window is now tighter. Case closed.