SWF groups hurt Dead by Daylight more than they help
Comments
-
I've been there lol I had one swf survivor self-caring once and when I tried to heal them up so we could go save their buddy, they kept pulling away and pointing at their friend. So I ended up doing the save on my own, got him unhooked with BT, but then i went down and the two of them ran straight out the exit. Even the Clown was looking back and forth like what the..
3 -
Matchmaking room should let kilelr know if atleast two people are on a swf, or amy swf at all they are
2 -
Yes, because killers totally won't just lobby hop until they get a full solo lobby /s
6 -
as i said before, they should give free ebony memento mori prenerf when you are aganist a swf... if they want to play with broken stuff, killers should have a counter for that too... i'm tired of those teams, the only thing that they actually fear/can't counter is bubba cause it's virtually impossible to do a save if he choose to camp, but i'm tired to play the same killer again and again in order to make them pay for their toxic behavior... coming from a player who play both sides and DESPISE swf with a burning passion (yes, even when i'm playing as survivor)
0 -
it's also fun being camped by a bubba or tunneled by a nurse... this is what they are asking sadly... yesterday i tried to play a chill match with the dredge without meta perks and brown addons... 2 hooks all gen done despite they took 4 flans... i had 1 kill cause i was forced to camp in the endgame... if they found this funny i don't really know what to say then...
0 -
What you see/progress in the match is not the same to team mates, they have different views, which they may not thought of camping and tried to heal.
While Im agree skill, situation awareness, knowing what to do is needed. But "comm" is what make the gaps between Solo & Swf high, imaging you could simply chat "killer camps me" when you're on hook without Kindred.
I dont want to see constant insult in mid game by teammate, but by what Home Sweet Home does, a few sticker that showing what you're doing (chased, doing Gen, need help...) certainly solve the problems of Solo
3 -
solo survivor can still switch gameplay based of what you saw: if your mates are efficient and do 2/3 gens in a single chase you can play without problems... otherwise if you have teammates who kept going down and not even 1 gen is done then play stealthy, play for the points (hook saves and gens) without being caught by the killer and play for the hatch... solo survivor can at least adapt well to the circumstances, the killer is a punchbag in case of good solo survivor or average premades (i say average cause even them can win aganist a killer who make no mistakes thanks to their perks, not for their skill... maybe except nurse). i have problems in solo survivor only when people actually play aganist you on purpose: some time ago i had a match where survivors were AWFUL, and the last one alive instead of recovering told to the killer where i was... afterchat that idiot flame me about HOW I PLAYED despite i was the only guy who did a generator... sure, it's my fault if all of you went down in less than a minute aganist a deathslinger in midwitch near the basement... entitlement at his finest...
1 -
as they should
2 -
I don't agree with the OP on this. I have played SWF the same amount of time if not more as solo (nearly 2500 hours total) and I can tell you in my experience SWF is a million times more fun than playing solo. All of my friends have since quit playing the game and I play much less now because of it. The solo que experience is very different than SWF for obvious reasons. You never know who you will be matched with or how they will play. With SWF, the experience is more in your control but more importantly you get to play the game with your friends and create memories that can last a life time. There are matches I had with my SWF that were so much fun they would come up in conversation all the time and we would laugh at all the shenanigans we had. I have played thousands of matches in solo que and nearly all of them become forgotten memories.
I know SWF to many killer mains isn't always a fun experience but I'm afraid its something they're just going to have to endure if they keep playing. I really don't know what they could do to change SWF that would make it better for killers but also not taking that experience away from SWF. Removing it would undoubtedly bring about the end of the game, but so would less people playing killer. There really is no solution here for those who see SWF as a problem.
0 -
I understand that everyone has a different perspective of what is happening during their game. However, Ace was also trying to heal while on different gen as well. All while he knew Spirit was hard-camping from the git go.
So my best guess is that maybe he had a challenge, but to me at THAT specific moment... fully knowing the Nea (the only other teammate I saw actually trying to come get me when I was being camped myself) was being hard-camped herself. He should have known that we would have had all the gens done with his Prove Thyself AND perhaps even given Nea a chance. Meanwhile Leon......
Neither one of them had been hooked or chased at all.
As for the "gap" between SWF and Solo players, it ain't that deep. People want to make it sound like it is, but in actuality if solo teammates just stuck to the objective at the very least, then everyone would have a much better chance of surviving. The fact is half of them don't want to be chased NOR do a gen, when in reality they have to pick one. It is unfair that one person has to do gens and run the killer. That isn't how the game is suppose to work and it boggles my mind that people want to blame it all on the fact that they have no communication. It is not my experience and it has never been in the 7.000 hours I have in this game. At some point part of your ability to play the game basically boils down to the most basic task. Holding M1.
In short, I am not saying that verbally telling someone "Do gens I am being camped", is the same as someone having to bother to go to a hook just to find that information out. What I am saying is that, this small piece of information isn't magically creating a huge gap between both Solo and SWF as many claim. Not when it is evident by the people who bring Kindred and teammates are STILL somehow not doing anything and instead crouch and flock around the hook waiting for the killer to leave.
4 -
Ah yes hyperbole is strong everywhere.
In discussion saying i play against swf all the time - there aren't as man swf as you make it out to be
In this discussion - all survivor are swf and hurting it will make the survivor olayerbase drop to 0.
Which it wouldn't, people playing exclusive soloQ would probably rejoice just for the fact that the game could finally be balanced around solo vs killer exclusively without having swf preventing that. Just like nurse is hampering balance for M1 killers.
0 -
You do understand that this then has a knock-on effect of causing longer queue times, right?
One killer does it, then the next killer, so on and so forth until one of two things happens: Either A - The matchmaker throws in a baby killer who then has a really bad time, or B - The survivors stop queuing up as a group and instead lobby hop to circumvent killers lobby dodging. Neither of these are healthy for the game and would be the greater of the two evils.
2 -
Ban lobby hop, there fixed.
0 -
How many players are streamers?
5 -
As a killer main, there's a lot of confirmation bias going on here.
Yes there are SWF groups that can wreck a killer with coordinated builds and a hook-deny playstyle.
But there are just as many, probably more, SWF groups that dont, and who play the same way as solo survivor.
You just don't notice them, because they're not ruining your games.
You don't come out of a great game where you got a 3K and genuinely outplayed by the last survinor and think "that must have been a SWF". You only think that when you've been chain blinded, bodyblocked and then teabagged at the exit.
Not all SWFs are this unstoppable bully squad, and you can't penalise those who are without ruining the game for those who arent.
9 -
I mean yeah, no ######### its a hyperbole.
Would the game drop to 0? No. Would it drop significantly? Yes. Simply playing with your friends is a staple in games today, take it away and people will simply play something else that they can play together.
2 -
So no one can leave the lobby? Survs or killers? Can't ban one side but not the other...
2 -
Fact: I haven't played the game outside PTBs in nearly a year due to SWFs.
0 -
Mostly because other games balance gameplay so that people playing with friends don't see a significant advantage purely because they're playing together. Either that, or they split the queues. Instead, the DbD devs decided to just throw up their hands and complain that it's too hard to balance, so they won't even try.
0 -
Take away the peoples option to play this game with their friends and this game is going to die faster than you could count to 20. SWF is very healthy for this game, whether you like it or not.
Also, there are plenty of SWF groups out there who play this game casually. In fact, I would dare say most of them do. But since they are not the bully squad everyone pictures when talking about SWF, most don't even recognise them as one.
What needs to happen is BHVR finally addressing the elefant in the room and buffing solo Survivors to be able to keep up with those tryhard SWF groups (so that we no longer have a split Survivor playerbase) and then balance the game accordingly.
But you can't just go around punishing people for wanting to play with their friends.
2 -
I agree with this to an extent but why play solo when you know you could get teammates that don't randomly dc or give up and aren't idiots?
0 -
Because I have social anxiety and because I’m bad at the game and people would shun me when they see how bad I am.
0 -
If you meet people that care more about fun than winning, I promise you won't have to worry about it. Best of luck with that regard.
3 -
Thank you.
2 -
When you play solo q you understand why all the best players are in a 4 man swf.
I think solo q has the funniest experiences but solo q is a miserable experience most times.
0 -
"solo players have the best experience" LOL, solo survivors get t he worst experience DBD can offer, is literally called SOLO Q PAIN for a reason. youll lose most of your games, useless teammates, killers love to tunnel and camp and no one brings decent perks to counter any of that or take hits to protect each other is just pain, endless suffering.
1 -
- I disagree: SWF is not healthy in its current state, and certainly not in map balance.
- I also didn't say that SWF should be abolished, but that the game should be made more difficult for them because they have advantages.
- It doesn't make sense atm to buff solo survivors to the point of immeasurability, because that would make the game even harder for killers.
- This has nothing to do with punishment and is an excuse.
Here, too, I disagree. I only play solo and I can assure you. A large percentage of survivors exaggerate and exacerbate solo Q for no reason. There are good rounds and there are bad rounds, we know that. If in your case it was more bad rounds, then I'm sorry for you. But it's not like that with me, quite the opposite.
You shouldn't always point fingers at other players, but have the courage to take a look at your own nose. I like the feeling of playing the way you want, so this experience is a positive one for me. Campers and tunnelers aren't unique to Solo Q, and that's pulling your hair out. LOL doesn't get you anywhere there either.
I won't deny that it's more difficult in the solo Q, but On the subject of Solo Q Pain, it really sounds like a trend.
Sry
1 -
I doubt that any killer would ever put themselves in such disadvantage considering a good SWF is basically unbeatable unless you're playing Nurse.
My suggestion would be giving a action speed debuff to SWF groups. They will never be on the same level as a solo, therefore BHVR should start treating different things as different.
1 -
- just no. And map balance is an entirely different topic altogether.
- you said SWF is unhealthy, therefore a logical conclusion to take from that is to assume you think the game was more healthy without it - which is not the case. Also you got me intrigued: how DO you nerf a Discord call?
- it makes a lot of sense. Don't do it and you got exactly what we got now: a split survivor playerbase where SWF groups reign supreme while its impossible to properly nerf Survivors because solos are going to greatly suffer from that.
- no you quite literally want to make the game harder for anyone who wants to play with their friends. That is the textbook definition of punishing me for wanting to play with friends.
Also, you are once again willfully ignoring away the existance of casual players here and act like every SWF group in existance was made of a bunch of ultra tryhards who do anything to make the game as unfun / unfair towards you as possible, when in reality those kind of groups make a clear minority of the actual SWF groups.
And your "solution" to punish people for playing together willingly takes those ~90% of casual players as collateral damage. Do I even need to tell you why this is a bad thing?
2 -
Sounds like you are almost as bad as me at this game. Keep at it I have faith you'll get there some day.
#cantloopifmypixellifedependedonit
;)
1 -
If the game removed SWF, the game would die very quickly.
3 -
I've been playing since the Stranger Things chapter released. I'm too embarassed to reveal my hour count. There is no hope for me.
0 -
i will have to agree to disagree, i have 4k+ hours in this game i played Solo q enough to say what im saying, way more than enough and killer aswell. in fact everytime i try playing solo q i do start remembering AGAIN Why, why do i do this............
do you remember the meme, why are we still here? just to suffer... there, and i dont learn is like if i wanted the extra challenge, the extra suffering just to realize most of my teammates arent able to deal with it.... the uncordination (letting others go second state consitently and for no reason, 2 survivors going for the same save or more than 2, survivors knowing killer has dead man and pain and keep on reparing the gen like they didnt know or dont care if explodes and blocks, and much more), the trolling, the trowhing for no reason, the baby perks, the non stop try harding killers getting everything their way because no one has a plan to respond back or plan back, the constant poor decision making even in the most basic things and you are there to see it not in the oposite side of the map and sometimes at the oposite side of the map aswell (im not talking about knowing the counter to every killer power and loop him for 2 minutes, no, the most commun basic things) is just way too much... maybe if i was a baby i could stand because i wouldnt know but once you learn what survivors can do and should do to respond back you dont want to see it no more... survivors uncordination is what kills Solo q experience and gives the killer SO MUCH MORE advatange towards survivors... once you get good as survivor you wont allow it no more having to carry a team of potatoes and still feeling they do nothing, they hide, dont do gens even when you take the killer for long perdios of time wasting everyoens time, resources.... im not saying you dont find decent solo q teammates sometimes you do but for the most part they play with other good players because they hate the solo q experience for this very reason and thats pretty much why SWF get to be so strong at times, good survivors tired of solo q... im not saying i dont make mistakes BTW (just clearing that before hand) i do as everyone does, but there are mistakes and there is horror, SOLO Q PAIN.
0 -
How do you know that? The game doesn't tell you whether survivors were in an swf or not.
1 -
How 32 forum users (based on OP’s upvotes) are this delusional is staggering.
2 -
swf is one of the biggest factors to why the game is impossible to balance which therefore does hurt the game indeed. but playing with a bunch of friends in a cooperative game is so much fun.
anyways i do not know why people say dead by daylight would die without swf because we don't know how many people actually play only for swf compared to also killer and/or solo, and besides the player count is very high. not trying to say they should remove swf, just think that is an overreaction.
0 -
Your self-confidence is truly awe-inspiring!. Please tell me you're on Xbox. I need to see these skillz for myself...
0 -
I've been playing since just before Clown.
I am not even average at Survivor. It could be worse XD
2 -
I wish we could see the numbers for solos vs. SWF’s. I really am curious to see who makes up the majority of the community or whether it’s a close race. A lot of players say the game will die if SWF’s are handicapped or removed from public matches. I feel like it won’t, because my impression is that solo’s outnumber the 3-4 SWF’s. And with everything I just said, it’s safe to assume large SWF groups believe they control the census. Wonder who is right…
0 -
The devs should definitely release stats showing how many 3 - 4 stack SWFs there are what their escape rates are. I'm assuming 75%+ escape rate
0 -
I believe the devs stated that, across the various MMR levels, the highest escape rate gap between solo and swiffer was 15%.
This may have increased or decreased with certain changes since.
0 -
I would wish for a sysyem were you could see each others builds in the load up screen, but there was diminishing returns for multiple instances of the same build or certain perks.
Imagine if the exhaustion of Head On got increased by +10s per other survivor who got it, or DH invulnerability window reduced, etc.
SWF that just goof around aren't the problem, its the bully squads with coordinated builds and loadouts that just wanna torment and trap the killer in an unwinnable and disgusting situation.
0 -
I might be ok with SWF IF there was also a KILL with friends. 8 survivors (all in varying numbers of groups, like, say, 3/3/2 or 4/4 or 2/2/2/2) play against 2 killers. Solo survivors always get matched with solo killers, SWF always get matched with KWF. All 8 survivors won't be coordinated but they'll still have a leg up in coordination, 2 killers have more gens than usual to defend and get a bit extra time due to all the spread out pressure. Can the game/servers handle it? Probably not, but I don't believe there is a fairer solution.
0 -
Everyone's entitled to an opinion but that doesn't mean that it's correct. In fact according to the limited statistics the devs have stated that SWF's versus killers at the highest levels of play are relatively balanced in terms of escape to sacrifice ratio.
Quite simply if you are always losing to SWF's you should just try getting better. The reality is that survivors that don't play in SWF's get absolutely rolled because the difference between solo queing and playing in a group is a totally different ball game.
It's unfortunate that killers have gotten so comfortable playing against solo que lobbies where they attribute that as being the average level of skill when in reality SWF's are what survivors should be playing as on any given day, it just requires much more effort to form a group and get on comms.
3 -
that SWF players have advantages is obvious. What is there not to understand? I emphasize again. No one has said that SWF should disappear. DBD has changed, so don't pretend you know 100% that SWF is a minority. I don't know about other players. My solo Q experience is definitely good. It's exciting, challenging and fun.
0 -
that SWF players have advantages is obvious. What is there not to understand?
No one is arguing they didn't have an advantage over soloq players. I am even making an entire point about how we should buff soloq to be closer to SWF levels of power to then be able to properly balance the game.
don't pretend you know 100% that SWF is a minority
Once again, I never said anything along those lines. SWF is a clear majority of the games you play, that's one of the main things I've been saying - the bully squads YOU are talking about however are a clear minority of the overall amount of SWF groups out there, yet YOU are the one acting like you knew that every SWF out there was a bully squad.
I don't know about other players. My solo Q experience is definitely good. It's exciting, challenging and fun.
Good for you. Most people will still prefer playing together with some friends when they have the chance to do so.
1 -
Please don't twist my words. I never said anything about Bully Squads.
If anyone has said or thought the term, it's you. I in any case not
Thank you
0 -
bedrock mmr killers when survivors play with their friends😓😓😓. the problem isnt swfs, its solo queue. add voice chat already!
0 -
How would you make the game more difficult for SWF without punishing them for playing with their friends? Bear in mind that not all SWFs are death squads out to ruin the killer's day, most are just out to have a bit of casual fun with friends.
0 -
This is punishing people for playing with their friends. It does more harm than it does good.
This would only cause more problems than it'd solve and do more harm than good.
0
