1 or more survivors winning from losing...

Keys need a rework. Hatch as well, but keys more urgently. Using a key to open the hatch is a free escape and totally unbalanced.

Do you have any ideas to rework keys perhaps?

I believe the survivor's goal is actually to survive any way possible if we're going off of lore. I do agree the hatch isn't a good mechanic for end game, though. If everyone died but one, I don't believe they should be entitled to a hatch and that whole thing is rather boring. It basically becomes a game of who's willing to wait the longest and that shouldn't be a thing in my opinion. They could rework the end game to allow for more interesting plays for that scenario in the very least. As for keys, it's annoying when you get an early escape, but there are counters towards people having keys and it isn't just not allowing more than two gens to be done.

I agree about the hatch. However I don't have an issue with keys.

@ThirdSealOPplzNerf said:

@Science_Guy said:
And how did you "outskill" the survivor you didn't catch?

By killing all of them. Except I can't because of the hatch.

You did not catch the Survivor. Otherwise he would not get the Hatch.

And yes, sometimes a Survivor deserves the Hatch. Often the one getting the Hatch is not the one that did really well, but there are moments were simply one Survivor did more than the rest of the Team.

@NoShinyPony said:

@blue4zion said:

@NoShinyPony said:
Keys need a rework. Hatch as well, but keys more urgently. Using a key to open the hatch is a free escape and totally unbalanced.

Do you have any ideas to rework keys perhaps?

Maybe it should take a little bit to actually open them, possibly include skillchecks or alert the killer when a survivor is unlocking it. This way, a survivor cant just jump into it mid chase and they'd need to wait for the killer to be a decent distance away.

I don't think that change would be enough. It's not only about survivors escaping mid-chase.

Imagine that only 2 survivors are still alive, 3 gens have been done. The survivors take a key and escape through the hatch. That's not fair to the killer at all. The killer can't do anything against it.

The hatch should only be an option for the last survivor. If there are more survivors alive, they should have to repair all the gens.

@fluffybunny said:
but there are counters towards people having keys

Please tell me the counter to survivors getting keys from chests. You know Franklin's isn't one.

You should know how hard it is to find a key once it's hit out of your hands. It's a rare, expensive item meant to speed the game up, essentially like a mori.

@NoShinyPony said:

@fluffybunny said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@blue4zion said:

@NoShinyPony said:
Keys need a rework. Hatch as well, but keys more urgently. Using a key to open the hatch is a free escape and totally unbalanced.

Do you have any ideas to rework keys perhaps?

Maybe it should take a little bit to actually open them, possibly include skillchecks or alert the killer when a survivor is unlocking it. This way, a survivor cant just jump into it mid chase and they'd need to wait for the killer to be a decent distance away.

I don't think that change would be enough. It's not only about survivors escaping mid-chase.

Imagine that only 2 survivors are still alive, 3 gens have been done. The survivors take a key and escape through the hatch. That's not fair to the killer at all. The killer can't do anything against it.

The hatch should only be an option for the last survivor. If there are more survivors alive, they should have to repair all the gens.

@fluffybunny said:
but there are counters towards people having keys

Please tell me the counter to survivors getting keys from chests. You know Franklin's isn't one.

You should know how hard it is to find a key once it's hit out of your hands. It's a rare, expensive item meant to speed the game up, essentially like a mori.

You are really trying to tell me that Franklin's is a counter against keys found in chests...

Have you ever had a key smacked out of your hand before as survivor? If you're paranoid over something that also requires finding a hatch that's making no noise and may or may not be hidden, just bring franky's. It's more of a counter than some of the stuff that killers have and if you smack the key person enough, the item will be depleted.

@fluffybunny said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@fluffybunny said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@blue4zion said:

@NoShinyPony said:
Keys need a rework. Hatch as well, but keys more urgently. Using a key to open the hatch is a free escape and totally unbalanced.

Do you have any ideas to rework keys perhaps?

Maybe it should take a little bit to actually open them, possibly include skillchecks or alert the killer when a survivor is unlocking it. This way, a survivor cant just jump into it mid chase and they'd need to wait for the killer to be a decent distance away.

I don't think that change would be enough. It's not only about survivors escaping mid-chase.

Imagine that only 2 survivors are still alive, 3 gens have been done. The survivors take a key and escape through the hatch. That's not fair to the killer at all. The killer can't do anything against it.

The hatch should only be an option for the last survivor. If there are more survivors alive, they should have to repair all the gens.

@fluffybunny said:
but there are counters towards people having keys

Please tell me the counter to survivors getting keys from chests. You know Franklin's isn't one.

You should know how hard it is to find a key once it's hit out of your hands. It's a rare, expensive item meant to speed the game up, essentially like a mori.

You are really trying to tell me that Franklin's is a counter against keys found in chests...

Have you ever had a key smacked out of your hand before as survivor? If you're paranoid over something that also requires finding a hatch that's making no noise and may or may not be hidden, just bring franky's. It's more of a counter than some of the stuff that killers have and if you smack the key person enough, the item will be depleted.

You tell me that you find it hard to find a closed hatch.
You also tell me that it's hard for you to find an item again after you've dropped it due to Franklin's.

Honestly, these things are some of the easiest elements in the game. Really. You need to a reach a point where you don't consider these things hard anymore first. Then, you can have reasonable discussions about balance issues.

@fluffybunny said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@fluffybunny said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@fluffybunny said:

@NoShinyPony said:

@blue4zion said:

@NoShinyPony said:
Keys need a rework. Hatch as well, but keys more urgently. Using a key to open the hatch is a free escape and totally unbalanced.

Do you have any ideas to rework keys perhaps?

Maybe it should take a little bit to actually open them, possibly include skillchecks or alert the killer when a survivor is unlocking it. This way, a survivor cant just jump into it mid chase and they'd need to wait for the killer to be a decent distance away.

I don't think that change would be enough. It's not only about survivors escaping mid-chase.

Imagine that only 2 survivors are still alive, 3 gens have been done. The survivors take a key and escape through the hatch. That's not fair to the killer at all. The killer can't do anything against it.

The hatch should only be an option for the last survivor. If there are more survivors alive, they should have to repair all the gens.

@fluffybunny said:
but there are counters towards people having keys

Please tell me the counter to survivors getting keys from chests. You know Franklin's isn't one.

You should know how hard it is to find a key once it's hit out of your hands. It's a rare, expensive item meant to speed the game up, essentially like a mori.

You are really trying to tell me that Franklin's is a counter against keys found in chests...

Have you ever had a key smacked out of your hand before as survivor? If you're paranoid over something that also requires finding a hatch that's making no noise and may or may not be hidden, just bring franky's. It's more of a counter than some of the stuff that killers have and if you smack the key person enough, the item will be depleted.

You tell me that you find it hard to find a closed hatch.
You also tell me that it's hard for you to find an item again after you've dropped it due to Franklin's.

Honestly, these things are some of the easiest elements in the game. Really. You need to a reach a point where you don't consider these things hard anymore first. Then, you can have reasonable discussions about balance issues.

I take it you're hatch god and keys have a beacon of light when you play survivor. I hate to break it to you, but for everyone else keys are small little objects that often blends with environments.

If you get hit and lose the item due to Franklin's, you know where on the map that happened. It did not happen to someone else. You were right there. You were a participant some seconds or minutes ago. You just go back to the place and pick your item up. You have to remember where you lost your item only for a couple of minutes at max!

If you insist that you are telling the truth and that this is indeed a challenge for you, then that's how it is. But for the big majority of players it isn't.

I'm very glad the devs so far don't agree with you.
Personally my enjoyment comes from good games, which most of the time doesn't end up with me surviving or me killing everyone in the game.

Your suggestion is terrible and would definitely decrease my enjoyment of the game, as a survivor it would be impossible to escape, so I would just run around the killer until I die, and as a killer be forced to afk until a single immersed survivor spends a long time doing the remaining objectives.

That would be the worst part, you place 1 survivor in a position where they know they are dead, and since there is really no incentive to do gens at that point, you will likely end up with more trolling and forcing me to quit the game as killer, just so you can feel good about a 4 kill.
That you are also resorting to slugging to achieve this, you are the type of player I am glad I don't play with often.

Well, this post could have been about how the hatch should be an interaction to open, perhaps with a loud squealing noise like that of a rusty safe. Or maybe this post could have been about how exit gate opening and key-hatch interacting should be similar in length. Or maybe the post could have detailed a realistic way of adding secondary objectives to get the hatch to spawn rather than share the same objective the exit gates require. None of this was discussed. I feel like this was a missed opportunity to talk about more than just frustration.

@ThirdSealOPplzNerf said:

Failing to complete all objectives to activate another escape isn't ok. And I do earn a win because winning as killer in rank 1 is extremely difficult and someone just escaping when the survivors lose is a robbery. You aren't entitled to a free escape. If survivors gets free escape from losing then killers should get something too.

Really they did at least 2 if not more of their objectives in order to have the hatch even spawn so they did in fact do enough objectives to have the hatch spawn. Also you didn't earn a win unless you kill all 4 survivors which you failed to do because you let one escape.

The bottom line the only one to blame here is you because you as the killer FAILED in keeping them from doing gens.

If you're at rank 1 and 1 survivor escapes you've won already, but what you want is a guaranteed 4k every game it isn't happening get over it. It's also not a free escape since in order for it to be a free escape the survivors wouldn't have to do any gens.

In order for it to be a free escape they'd spawn on an open hatch all of them, they'd have to be allowed to jump in without the killer being able to touch them.

So in other words you don't deserve anything from the survivors making it out from the hatch because bottom line you have perks/items/addons.

**Here's the very definition of the term FREE: **

1.not under the control or in the power of another; able to act or be done as one wishes.

2.without cost or payment.

Hmmn sure looks like that your definition of free doesn't correspond with actual facts and logic since the survivors have to either do 2 gens and 3 die.

The survivors have to do more than 2 gens and have 1 more gen done than survivors left alive.

All of the survivors must be gone for the last survivor to take the hatch once all the gens are powered.

The killer has to actually let the survivor get into the hatch and not try and stop them.

Wow would you imagine that all those pesky facts and logic just prove you're acting entitled to a free 4k and the survivors aren't getting a FREE escape.

So in other words the only one acting or trying to be entitled here is you and the only one wanting something for free is you.

@ThirdSealOPplzNerf said:

Lol even if I used every perk to stop generator regression it will be impossible. Survivors have to do less than half of their objective so if they lose 1 can get a free escape. And it isnt a "free" 4k if I killed 3 survivors I should obviously be rewarded by killing the 4th but apparently not because people like to keep their bullshit in the game like ds and hatch. You telling me I'm asking for a free 4k then that means you're telling me I want all the survivor dead easy and free idiot. Name the amount of free second chances and ridiculous things survivors has some don't even have counters. Adrenaline God pallets ds exhaustion perks just rushing gens is a free escape if the player isn't using the nurse. And name something free that's broken on the killer side there isn't any in game thing that instantly hooks and kills random survivors for losing is there? Noed can be countered only bad survivors fall for it and what else? And generators are the objective survivors are obviously going to try to do them and a hatch spawning just in case if survivors fail to escape completely unfair.

Rofl, yet killers manage to keep survivors from doing any gens let alone more than 1 at red ranks because they simply outplay them.

Also see my earlier definitions of why it isn't and never will be a free escape no matter how much you whine about it, IT'S NOT FREE.

Yes you are asking for a free kill and you know it and insulting me just shows you can't admit you know you're asking for a free 4th kill. If you kill 3 you shouldn't be rewarded with a FREE 4th kill, you have to EARN IT, not have it handed to you because you want a freebie.

Oho now it's DS and hatch is bs, the only bs here is your whining over your sense of entitlement because you want something for free without having to actually do anything for it.

Lets see you can dribble the ds user, it's a 1 time use only perk, you can drop them on steps or into a corner, slug them, mori them later etc. Oh there's Enduring you know that perks that's works wonders on stuns of all kinds not just DS.

All you're doing is proving you're just another entitled killer who doesn't want to have to work for that 4th kill and wants it instead handed to them.

Yes come up with more excuses and deflections for why you should be entitled to that free 4k since you know you've got no real argument anymore.

You act like you have to respect every pallet, that you have to blindly follow behind them and let them reuse the same pallets over and over. All you can do now is make excuses for your sense of entitlement for your free underserved 4th kill.

Why is it that killer like Monto, Hybrid Panda, and other don't come on here whining about the hatch and then asking for a free 4th kill. Why is it that most killers don't come on here and whine about a entitled 4k and don't whine about all the other things you do and still 4k?.

You can keep whining about it and making excuses about it, keep blaming anything and everything because you can't have a free 4k every game.

The bottom line is YOU'RE NOT ENTITLED TO A FREE 4TH KILL, EARN IT.

Again since you completely ignored it, here's all the reasons it's not a free escape again.

**Here's the very definition of the term FREE: **

1.not under the control or in the power of another; able to act or be done as one wishes.

2.without cost or payment.

Hmmn sure looks like that your definition of free doesn't correspond with actual facts and logic since the survivors have to either do 2 gens and 3 die.

The survivors have to do more than 2 gens and have 1 more gen done than survivors left alive.

All of the survivors must be gone for the last survivor to take the hatch once all the gens are powered.

The killer has to actually let the survivor get into the hatch and not try and stop them.