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Grabbing unhooking survivors
Hey,
why are killers able to grab unhooking survivors? i thought about it for a while and cant see the purpose of it other than making it possible for killers to camp and making a benefit out of it. There are only three possible outcomes in this situation.
- The Killer grabs the survivor and instantly has a chance to hook a second survivor giving him an upper hand over the game which gives him an opportunity to redo what he just did.
- The Killer fails the grab in which case he can hit the hooking survivor and possibly hitting im again after the unhook which also gives him an additional hook and the opportunity to redo what he just did.
- The Killer fails the grab and hits either accidentally or intentionally (which is bad game design to give him this option imo) the unhooked survivor which now has the short BT
the second and third option are less benefitial for the killer but still a good outcome and even the last option will give him a short distance to at least two survivors.
So if a killer decides to camp (which is absolutly not uncommon and youre confirming it with your later patches) he can with little thinking and little skill win the upper hand rather fast and reliable.
Sure you could argue that there are perks against that. But i dont think that this is the correct thing to counter this gameplay. Im not saying that there are no such tactics that benefit survivors but they dont outweight this huge oversight in game design.
I think it would be the better choice to remove the grab completly as this will likely discourage camping even more and will instantly eliminate the first outcome.
Im happy to here your opinions
Comments
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Because survivors are not supposed to be incentivized to divebomb the hook and unhook in front of the killer's face. Which comes with the side effect that it also works out for camping.
If hook grabbing is removed, unhooking should become uncancellable and all unhook speed modifiers should be removed. Then, at best will be a trade. That seems fair IMO.
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The idea is definitely to make unhooking risky if the killer's nearby, so that there's a layer of strategy towards when to unhook, and to punish people just rushing the hook straight away. Unfortunately, this does also benefit camping, as outlined above.
I'm also of the opinion that hook grabs should be removed (at least on healthy survivors, injured might be a different situation worth discussing), but there should definitely be trades there. Personally I think damage should just carry over if you're hit while unhooking, so you immediately take damage as soon as the unhook animation is completed. Removing the ability to cancel the unhook could also be experimented with, at least after a certain point of the animation.
Whatever the trade ends up being, I don't think hook grabs should just be removed without some other element of risk being present. Choosing to unhook in the killer's face in non-camping scenarios should carry some kind of risk, and that risk should be taken by the unhooker.
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I feel like grabbing unhooking survivors was a decision made a while ago when dbd was in a completely different state. I don't think it's needed anymore, as long as they also adjust some things and make some changes surrounding hooks.
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Hook grabs just encourage face camping. This would be one of the easiest and quickest ways to remove face camping. Any damage should pass to the unhooker though.
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Yeah i get that, you're right. It makes sense to be a somewhat risky move to unhook. But in its present state i cant understand why its in that state for so long. that the damage is dealt after the animation is what i thought too.
True, there are many details about the game where this is the case i feel like... That fact makes me so sad, because developers are not really interested in fixing those issues. They just focus on new content and minor adjustments against things like camping just because the community force them to. There is no one questioning old game design deccisions. (i think so at least)
Absolutly. i dont think camping will completly cease to exist but its a step in the right direction.
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In my own opinion, hook grabbing needs to be more punishable. Simply forcing the survivor to be unable to cancel rapidly so if they try to bait the unhook, the just can't and get grabbed.
A lot of my grabs already break because they can cancel so quickly.
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i forgot about that point in my post, that grab baiting is so stupid and no fun for everyone. If a killer wants to camp he grabs you, and puts you down right next to the hook in which case its extremely hard for the other two survivors to rescue any one of them. The overall concept of camping is so benefitial for the killer, for new players its almost a no brainer, no offense. when the game offers you this possibility of playing the game then go on. The thing is that as a survivor you have no such tactics, sure there are ways to f a killer up, but nothing is as strong as straight up hook camping.
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Really outdated second chance mechanics that doesn't meet modern dbd standards and encourage killer to camp and give them free grabs and a lot pressure. Should be removed for sure to disincentivize lazy, passive, defensive play and make killers to do their job of hunting down and chasing survivors!
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