Why do people hate NOED so much?

@fluffybunny said:
NOED carries weak killers the same way DS carries weak survivors. I personally don't hate it so much as getting annoyed by how it can encourage and pardon poor plays.

Basically this. There's also no way to tell if the killer has NOED or if a non-obsessed survivor has D-Strike. They're both badly designed.

@fluffybunny said:

@TrAiNwReCk said:

@ermsy said:
NuclearBurrito2 said:

Not saying that NOED in particular is fine. But in general perks that give you a boost when you are losing are not problematic, however that is only true so long as the boost is less than the snowball from the fact that you are losing (or in otherwords you should never be MORE likely to win now that the survivors have made additional progress). Those gens should always hurt you more than they help you, but that does not mean they can't help you, hence end game builds.

like, a survivor is very likely to escape once the gate is powered, not as likely if the killer has NOED, but even in that case they are still more likely to escape compared to when the gate isn't powered.

DS is problematic because you are more likely to survive a chase after using it compared to when you were initially injured or downed

Or in otherwords a perk can turn a point of failure into a point of lesser failure and still be fair. However it is not fair for a perk to turn a point of failure into a point of success.

Keep in mind that even without NOED it is possible for the killer to win after the gates are powered. Thus having a boost that makes it possible to win is still a point of failure as the gates being powered still makes it highly possible to lose compared to before then.

(I consider blood warden and remember me to both be stronger than NOED in this context since they are more effective at letting you win the game after the gates are powered)

I agree that ds is much more of a problem compared to noed as respecting the possibility of a noed as a survivor is usually enough to escape. You just have to take ds most of the time and hope you can resolve the second chase quickly, if not you lose.

I don't believe remember me and blood warden is stronger. Although Remember me is very strong but promotes tunneling and blood warden is too situational, survivors can make themselves scarce if they know about it and you have to time the hook.

This is only my opinion

The only reason why NOED is a problem at all is because of over altruistic survivors.

• Survivor (A) got hooked
• Survivor (B) opens gate
• (B) is really good or has borrowed time "I can get my mate easy, no way the killer can stop us!"
• (A) i'm getting rescued "This is awesome we are both going to escape!"

Survivor (B) runs FEARLESSLY towards the killer knowing the plan "there's no way I can be stopped, the gate is right next to us as well!"

Killer swings INSTANT DOWN

Survivor A & B "You trash, noob, no good blah blah blah"

The killer was at least going to get that 1 kill, and instead of escaping your friend went in for the save. Survivors should play with some sort of fear saying "Screw this I don't want to take a chance, i'm out of here" NOED changes that possibility entirely and survivors hate that. Like players who camp with insidious. Never ever ever, when facing leather face and see a survivor hooked in the basement will I ever go for the save. And for players who rush in without thinking twice getting mad that they were just downed by an insidious camping leather face only have them selves to blame for charging in thinking it's just like any other game. Survivors blame yourself, not the perks. I have died due to stupidity and instead of coming to complain in the forums I have tried to learn, to accept and work around it.

I will happily struggle till the time runs out to give my team time to gen rush a camping killer, but HATE when I see them run downstairs to the rescue without any thought of their fate.

Only my experience and opinion.

In my experience, survivors have issue with it because it can turn a 1k into a 3/4k. The killer could do poorly and still net a win with a perk's help.

No doubt the perk can swing things in the killers favor, but unless the other survivors are happily dancing in front of the killer at the very least 2 can get out if they jump on a gate until it's open and then leave.

Admittedly, back in the day when I used NOED, a game where I was so lucky to get 1 survivor on the hook before a gate was opened and they all escaped. Many games the other 3 would stay . . and keep messing around like they're going to outsmart me. All I want is at at least one kill, I was terrible back then. Nope here they come swarming the hook, ready to body block and all because they didn't walk out of the open gate ROFL.

I totally agree with you, but it has been in so many cases that survivors have a gate open. They can leave, but they chose to stay. Any time a survivor chooses to stay instead of leave, they need to get over it if they die.

I can see NOED as an anti borrowed time perk at the end game. Without NOED with 1 or more players going for the save to body block and the BT protecting the injured there is no way a killer is going to secure any kill. And survivors get to use borrowed time throughout the entire game.

Again, I agree with you that the perk can help get a massive snowball in an otherwise lost game, but 9/10 times the other survivors simply had to leave out the gate, but chose to stay. Their choice not to leave caused their death, not the perk they weren't counting on the killer having. The perk just made it possible.

@ermsy said:
TrAiNwReCk said:

@NightmareReborn said:

I feel like people hate it because it rewards poor performance. I'd just make it so that survivors know the killer has noed when the last gen is popped rather when a survivor is hit. It would give extra warning to the survivors. Also that the NOED totem would be revealed in a small radius so you would have to spend 10 hrs finding it.

I don't care about NOED or DS. They both can be annoying to go up against, but I like your thoughts on players perception of the NOED perk.

* I feel like people hate it because it rewards poor performance

If this truly is the majority of players perception I as a killer who couldn't care if NOED stays or goes.

* Remove NOED for killers
* Remove hatch for survivors

NO MORE REWARDING ANYONE FOR BAD PERFORMANCE

Id agree to this

@fluffybunny since you mentioned poor play in one of your posts :-)

@brokedownpalace said:
Considering there are about 500 topics detailing why people hate this perk or that perk you could have used the search function instead of making the 501st one. But here we are.

Many people like to create their own personal thread of frustration. I look up old threads and surprised at some how they died out as some players have made some very good suggestions and arguments of all sorts, but they die with time.

No one wants to support someone else's died out frustration thread XD

Survivors feel it "robs them" of their victory.

@Vietfox said:
Because they are too lazy to adapt.

When did you become so killer sided? Every comment I see from you is always in favour of killers. You ditched survivor or something?

@Poweas said:

@Vietfox said:
Because they are too lazy to adapt.

When did you become so killer sided? Every comment I see from you is always in favour of killers. You ditched survivor or something?

Blueberry said:

I don't dislike NOED because I think it's unfair, I think it's totally fair. The survivors have the full opportunity to cleanse the totems ahead of time. I dislike NOED because it rewards killers for the survivors being greedy, not because they actually played well. It gives kills that they didn't earn. I think we'd be shocked to see the games kill stats if all NOED downs were taken out of that data.

Tucking_Friggered said:

If you were downed at the end by NOED, you didn't earn your escape. Git gud.

Tucking_Friggered said:

@The_Crusader said:
Tucking_Friggered said:

If you were downed at the end by NOED, you didn't earn your escape. Git gud.

If a survivor escaped due to DS, you didn't earn your hook. Git gud.

We do. So looks like we all deal with it. You keep your DS and we'll keep NOED. We have Enduring and you have cleansing. ;}

Tucking_Friggered said:

@The_Crusader said:

Cool. A race to the bottom with crappy perks. Just what the game needs. Much fun.

The perks are fine. You're just mediocre in talent and cleansing gens which require map navigation and awareness are too complicated for you to do reliably. That's a personal issue. A git gud one specifically. Understanding that, play carefully and exit the gate instead of sticking around to troll the killer and try and unhook that survivor through brute force.

MhhBurgers said:

Even zubatlel sometimes uses NOED so the "only bad killers" use NOED is thrown out of the window. I use it on legion for the 4% MS increase and sometimes to surprise adrenaline users or ppl who just run for the hooked guy.

@The_Crusader said:
Tucking_Friggered said:

@The_Crusader said:

Cool. A race to the bottom with crappy perks. Just what the game needs. Much fun.

The perks are fine. You're just mediocre in talent and cleansing gens which require map navigation and awareness are too complicated for you to do reliably. That's a personal issue. A git gud one specifically. Understanding that, play carefully and exit the gate instead of sticking around to troll the killer and try and unhook that survivor through brute force.

Nice assumption. Ok I'll learn to do that. Thanks for the advice.

Perhaps you could learn how to pressure gens, learn when a survivor is better than you and give uo the chase, and stop relying on perks to carry you through?

No thanks. The perks are there for that specific purpose. Deal with it. As for all of those terms you like to throw around, the amusing part is that you lack the talent to do any of that which is why you're a survivor main. Your skill caps at staying immersed and looping a pallet. When you fail at doing those two things and find yourself on a hook near the end game because you wasted all the pallets early and mid you are upsetti spaghetti your teammates can't save you easily. Or in the opposite scenario, you can not save the guy that made those same mediocre choices. The sad part of all of this is even if they removed NOED and you managed to climb to the top ranks you'd have your ass carved and handed to you gourmet by killers that absolutely never use NOED.

Tucking_Friggered said:

@The_Crusader said:
Tucking_Friggered said:

@The_Crusader said:

Cool. A race to the bottom with crappy perks. Just what the game needs. Much fun.

The perks are fine. You're just mediocre in talent and cleansing gens which require map navigation and awareness are too complicated for you to do reliably. That's a personal issue. A git gud one specifically. Understanding that, play carefully and exit the gate instead of sticking around to troll the killer and try and unhook that survivor through brute force.

Nice assumption. Ok I'll learn to do that. Thanks for the advice.

Perhaps you could learn how to pressure gens, learn when a survivor is better than you and give uo the chase, and stop relying on perks to carry you through?

No thanks. The perks are there for that specific purpose. Deal with it. As for all of those terms you like to throw around, the amusing part is that you lack the talent to do any of that which is why you're a survivor main. Your skill caps at staying immersed and looping a pallet. When you fail at doing those two things and find yourself on a hook near the end game because you wasted all the pallets early and mid you are upsetti spaghetti your teammates can't save you easily. Or in the opposite scenario, you can not save the guy that made those same mediocre choices. The sad part of all of this is even if they removed NOED and you managed to climb to the top ranks you'd have your ass carved and handed to you gourmet by killers that absolutely never use NOED.