SWF's need a nerf

Voice coms offer the equivalence of multiple perks worth of information. When I play SWF those voice coms usually weigh in as if I had somewhere between 8-12 more perks. This completely breaks the game.

It's really simple. Give the killer +4 perk slots that only activate in case of SWF. If the game features SWF then they get 4 more perks that activate as part of their current loadout.

Do the same for solo queue survivors in the same game - but only give them information perks like kindred, bond, rookie spirit, etc.

-"honestly, the recent nerf to our perks really hurts our ability to pressure such survivors and the new buff to solo queue with the magical UI exarcerbates that issue even more."

If the idea was to make solo queue stronger then the hud changes did that. It's really not fun to play against. Still though I would welcome the changes if it meant I got +4 perks every game.

I dont think I want all perks to be game breaking and overpowered. Maybe you do Mr. SUS.

Given that game breaking and overpowered, on average, actually means "any perk that has any effect or causes me to think on how to deal with it as Survivor or Killer", I would claim otherwise.

Nah, but the patterns typically aren't wrong.

Eruption needed to be changed for sure, but not to how it is now. Just disable it with 1 gen left and make it block gens instead. Done. Two of the biggest complaints resolved.

Mostly bad ideas, again, that demonstrate why the devs don't listen to the forums. And why I was right about it speaking volumes.

Your "simple fix" absolutely will be abused by Killers to ensure you always get solo queue Survivors, so that won't be happening. And to break down your list...

1. Nope, hurts casuals SWFs and solos in the match.
2. Nope, hurts casuals SWFs and solos in the match.
3. Your Shattered rework sounds bad and unfair for the obsession, sorry. A doesn't include boon buffs when it should. B sounds interesting though.
4. I can't math so I'm going to assume that's bad since maps that are too small are typically too easy to patrol, which shouldn't be the case.
5. Or you can just kick the god pallet? This is such a miniscule complaint, god pallets don't buy much in the grand scheme of things and there isn't nearly enough to bother. And if you're going to go "BORGO", still not enough god pallets. RPD has noticeably more, but once they're gone, those rooms become dead zones.

Consider the following: To deal with meta, you should play meta. Or do... anything to counter meta. I have no idea why this community is so entitled that they should be able to easily and consistently shut down meta stuff (whether it be perks, add-ons, etc) while not changing anything about their builds or playstyles, not even perks or add-ons.

I sense you're a "Killer main" like Spectral tbh, your opinions are waaaay too Killer biased. If DBD ever looks at listening to pros for upcoming updates, I hope they filter feedback that comes from Survivor/Killer "mains" who give takes like this.

I think that there are valid criticisms and complaints to be made about both sides of the isle right now. Complaining about one side being "NERFED" harder than the other is never going to get anywhere because you people treat killer verses survivor with the fervor of sports fans. The bottom line is this...

Killers are currently frustrated at the META for a multitude of reasons. Having to hit a survivor potentially 5 times due to multiple perks preventing potential hits is very hard to counter. Some maps are just flat out BAD for a good amount of killers and survivors don't really have a equivalent map that is really bad for them. And to sum a lot of other frustration up, its really annoying that to do well as killer, you really have to just sit down and get good at nurse, and a lot of us don't want to do that because we all have our favorites.

Survivors are currently frustrated at the META because impossible 3 Gen camps are a thing especially with skull merchant, the killers are incentivized to go after survivors with damaged health states and tunnel/camp hooks to apply pressure, and I don't if this is still a major complaint from this side of the isle but I remember hearing a lot about survivors being really upset that perks like light born and franklins demise exist, but that might not be the case anymore.

And then for the elephant in the room; THE 3 GEN STANDOFF. I think it can be said that there is a lot in this game on both sides that have resulted in us arriving at this type of meta, and sadly I think it will always come down to a chicken in the egg kind of blame circle. Survivors hate 3 gen because it slows the game down and can be really hard to win if a killer bring the right set ups and defends a good 3 gen. Killer kind of have to play 3 gen because gen rushing is such a problem for a lot of killer to counter effectively. Survivors take meta perks because killers are incentivized to tunnel and camp to apply pressure. Killers tunnel and camp to defend kills to try and squeeze whatever blood points they can out of a unwinnable match. We could go on and on and around and around in circles trying to point the blame at whoever started this but ultimately its all about the objective of the game.

Killers are going to defend hooks and use the opportunity of altruistic survivors to pull people off of generators and deplete health states and get kills to make it harder for survivors to complete gens.

Survivors are going to bring perks and items to help them achieve completing gens fast and preventing as many hooks and hits as possible to get out alive.

Where in lies the problem is the expectations of fun chases. Not everyone is going to be amazing at chase on either side. As a newer killer main I can tell you that it is really frustrating to be looped for a couple minutes straight while gens pop around me just because I really want to hit this damn flash light clicking and crouch spamming bill that has been stringing be along most of the game. but that is MY expectation of having a fun chase. A fun chase for me is outwitting the survivor and hitting them and then hooking them. Survivors I think have the same expectation of fun for chases just on the other side. They want to convince a killer to commit to them so they can show off their sick moves and escape getting hit within a fraction of a second, but its really frustrating for survivors to get hit and then be tunneled or camped because the killer needs them out of the game.

Its an argument of who is allowed to have fun with chases and if chases are the primary goal of the game. At this point I honestly think that gen pressure has just become so much more of a priority for killers AND survivors that the chase just isn't really that important anymore. And the META reflects this.

Killers are going to bring slow down perks and try to get survivors on hooks and keep them there to slow down the game. The killer needs to STALL to win.

Survivors will bring strong gen rush items and chase perks to prevent the killer from doing this so that they can RUSH the game.

We are diametrically opposed in our goals via gameplay, and the metal reflects this.

I think that's why bringing a specific fix to the game is going to take a lot more than just changing some map size or limiting perks. The developers for the game have been pushing the game in this direction for a while, and I think we all just need to adapt and try to find ways to have fun in the current state of the game. The game is just so HEAVLY based on this type of gameplay style that I don't see what you could possibly do to change the game from gens to chase without heavily gutting one side or the other.

One sides fun is derived from the other, sadly. And while I generally do agree that survivors individually seem to be REALLY powerful right now, I think what makes it feel extremely unfair for us killer mains is that there are 4 of them that all feel that way to go against. It is kind of by design that the survivors are going to feel really overpowered in a lot of ways to go against since like I said, there are 4 of them, and only one of us.

I'm a fairly new killer main so I get the frustration. I absolutely despise the new map. I despise getting gen rushed and I despise the toxicity that I receive just for playing the role that I chose to queue up as.

But right now I think that the developers are trying to push the game into an objective focused game harder than ever before. The focus has shifted to either rushing the gens or stalling them out. As killers we have gotten some pretty decent stuff in terms of gen slow down and being able to defend a 3 gen for end game. Call of Brine and Eruption are *Chefs kiss* REAL NICE when you need to keep control over 3 gens. The game is just less and less focused on chase and it shows.

The developers keep giving survivors ways to rush gens and stay alive, so in return we get ways to slow down gens. As much as it sucks to admit, Skull Merchant really hit that final nail into the coffin for this game being about gen rush/slow down. So we either adhere to the meta at high MMR, or we hope for the game of knuckle head survivors that allows us to relax a bit. Either way, its all in the slow growth of game with a meta.

The game IS unbalanced, and both sides sway way up and way down constantly. That month of fun that you are feeling was living through a stage of overcorrection in which everyone had to find new ways to be able to optimally sweat the game. It was a time of experimentation, and because we aren't the ones needing to experiment it was a lot easier for us to have fun. But now that it is on the sway back to the other side, our job has gotten hard again. its the ebb and flow of trying to balance an asymmetrical game. Both sides CANT be equal by necessity because then that would demolish the core reason the game is fun.

Killers are supposed to feel empowering to play, but when the game doesn't go our way or the survivors have too many resources, we feel like we've been cheated from feeling that power trip. Survivors are supposed to feel like they have to face great adversity to win, and if the killers have too many resources then it feels incredibly oppressive to play against.

I think the final thing Ill say is that this game just seems like its really hard to balance and makes sure both sides are having fun at the same time. And its probably going to continue to sway back and forth because if you nerf/buff one side then the other side gets nerfed/buffed just for being on the opposite side of the swaying pendulum.

It actually 100% would've, because those were the common, valid ones, and not just the ones from biased players.

Blocking the gen would've fixed "not being able to do anything", preventing the gen from working at 1 gen left would've fixed the "forcing 3 gen checkmates" playstyle.

Based off of your takes and how they align with certain other people here, I highly doubt it.

And yeah, everyone else has pushed for a "fAiR GaMe" too, you're not unique. Problem is, a "fair game" means a game where Killers and Survivors don't have to try, perks, etc are easy to shut down or just ignore and nobody has to consider switching up their builds if they struggle with anything meta or strong.

Hag does not need nerfs, Hag needs buffs, I have no idea why people keep repeatedly that popular opinion, her traps are garbage and easy to counter. Just run over them when she's distracted. So what if she teleports? Then the other Survivor can hop back on gens. Oh, she's "web reliant and 3 gen reliant but then she's TOTALLY AMAZING!!!1"? Well, that sounds like current Skull Merchant. And everyone thinks she's weak.

"you probably see the game as not survivor sided"

It actually is at the highest competitive level, but here's the problem: You most likely are not at a comp level. The majority here are not at a comp level. And if you're wanting SWF nerfed, you most likely don't play both sides, or are at least Killer biased, you have waaaaaay too many Killer takes to not be Killer biased.

And nah, not "more than anything else". Balance is used to achieve fun, if balance is in the way of fun, it gets thrown out. Simple as that. This is a game, not an e-sports device. The game needs to be fun for casuals to sell.

I also said more than that, I said "Or do... anything to counter meta." as well.

Not to mention that I should've been a bit more specific: You should stop playing M1 Killers specifically and consider Killers with anti-loop like Huntress, Plague or Nemesis. M1 Killers will always struggle against goated survivors, DH and COH can be gone and you will still lose to them without them making major mistakes. It's not because of "MUH DH", it's because they know meta strategies like optimal gen rush and being aggressive on gens. If you want to deal with their meta stuff + tactics, play a better Killer. Doesn't have to be Nurse or Blight.

Not to mention that, technically, most Killers do have at least weak anti-loop (Trapper with his traps, Pig with her Ambush, Myers with vault speed, higher movement speed and lunge increase, Ghosty with no TR + no red stain with a button press), but you want them to have Huntress-level anti-loop I'm assuming. Which is fine.

"Imagine if you could only play solo queue only in a specific mode and you can't use Nurse/Blight but you cant use boons or DH. Or we could do the sensible thing and nerf those perks to oblivion like we did for Eruption."

Nobody would play that mode without incentive.

And nah lmao, let's just fix Eruption and rework + buff boons. Because let's be fair, if you get what you want, you guys will move onto WoO or whatever perk shoots to the top next on Nightlight, and then write paragraphs as to why that needs to be removed because "you TOTALLY would've won if those darned Survivors didn't have it!"

-"You most likely are not at a comp level. The majority here are not at a comp level. And if you're wanting SWF nerfed, you most likely don't play both sides, or are at least Killer biased"

First I play against people who are part of the comp scene in my random matches pretty often. It's more rare for me to see someone under 500 hours than to see someone with 5000 hours.

Then we have your logic error.

"[DBD] actually is [survivor sided] at the highest competitive level."

Comp level play is a 4 man swf. The broken nature of letting a SWF bring whatever they want allows random people in a SWF to play at comp levels with no restrictions. In other words : comp play is easier because they can't bring more than 1 medkit/toolbox and cannot repeat any perks. Without restrictions SWF teams that play at a high level get to bully killers; this gives those killers bad feelings which lead to an "arms race" where everyone loses.

-"You should stop playing M1 Killers specifically and consider Killers with anti-loop like Huntress, Plague or Nemesis."

You are funny if you didn't think I did that years ago. But I desire for all the killers to be viable or all the killers to have a fair arena in which to play. In the current balance hard locking many of the killers to 1200-1400 MMR would do exactly that. But survivors would hate it because then it would be 99% Nurse and Blight at anything over 1600 MMR.

When you see a huntress you would get this :

-" Because let's be fair, if you get what you want, you guys will move onto WoO or whatever perk shoots to the top next on Nightlight"

This is a strawman argument because historically it is exactly what the survivors do and as 4/5ths of the audience the devs listen. Most of the perks that get massive use by survivors get gentle taps.

The 6.0 rework gutted : Eruption, Pop and Scourge hook pain res.

The 6.0 rework buffed : Borrowed time (base kit - so nobody ever uses it), Dead Hard is better for the top players, and survivors got SWF level info sharing with the new Hud.

It's a sham to say that the last year of development has been anything but 2 steps forward for survivor and 1 step forward for killer.

That last stats on SWF from like 2019 stated half of all survs in at least a two--man group, with threes and fours much less common. With solo-queue just so delightful since that time, I have to believe the number of SWF groups have risen.

Much more recent stats would be quite welcome though.